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Election 2020 The 2020 Candidates: Right, Left and Center!

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wait shit I forgot

AVENGERS ENDGAME SPOILERS

but yeah, trump and his cult love the idea of him being a genocidal maniac

conservatives identify with villains all the time, and not even the cool villain protagonists you're supposed to identify with
 
tathra said:
but yeah, trump and his cult love the idea of him being a genocidal maniac
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You believe this? I can't see anyone seeing themselves as a genocidal maniac (those that are, tend not to see it). To clarify, whom is he genociding?

conservatives identify with villains all the time, and not even the cool villain protagonists you're supposed to identify with
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This bit I can buy to a degree. The way the MSM and Left highlight atrocities, law breaking, and general not-niceness by conservatives (factually grounded or not) can make conservatives look like villains (if they are or not). And, perhaps some have come to embrace that image - the villain who believes they are in the right (meaning 'correct', and also to address their view whether it is true or not) and the world is against them. Though, perhaps they see Trump as the Villain protagonist they identify with?
 
The one thing I can’t comprehend currently is why liberals are pro this impeachment hunt if they are %100 sure it won’t pass the senate . You even have dems that have stated they will vote against and so far we got one to flip parties cuz of this hunt . Now where I’m confused is why are they ok with all this wasted time and money .
Can someone explain this to me ? And please don’t say cuz it’s due process . It’s not like he got caught getting a blowjob underneath his desk . This is about interpreting what was said on that phone call which should have never bin made public in the first place .
you see crooked politicians getting booked for the craziest of crimes from all parties and I do believe they are all crooked in someway just some more then others . At this point in the race all the dem front leaders will say whatever they have to to get elected and that’s not cool because they either won’t follow thru or actually follow thru and the economy will go into a recession on the spot .
I’m not as into politics as the rest of you so I have not gone out of my way to research each candidates past votes on bills etc... as of now tho I believe if anyone but trump wins 2020 then the economy is doomed .
 
I agree they're all crooked, it's just that from what I've seen, of Trump himself speaking, and of evidence brought forth, he should have impeachment put on him. Even if it fails, it sets a precedent, or really it's drawing a line in the sand for the future. If we let him get away with it, future leaders will know that they can get away with anything, too. This stuff is unprecedented.

Now, I don't think he will get removed, I know what's going to happen. But it needs to be recognized that this guy is not fit for the position he's in. He has no experience at all with politics and being the "leader of the free world". He's a narcissistic egomaniac, he clearly has narcissistic personality disorder, I had a friend who was the same way, it's as clear as day anytime you observe him speaking about something. We are in a precarious position, we are not invincible, China and Russia are threats, Russia as it has been since the world wars, and now China. Both of these powers are looking to overturn us as the top world power. And they are playing him like a fiddle. If you have seen the footage of the hearings, and of the Republican/Trump administration response, and you don't see that, then I guess we're in two different realities about what's going on.

Impeachment does 3 things. It does what I described above, draws a line in the sand. It also tells our allies that we, the people, realize what is happening and want it to stop. And also, it COULD result in removing him earlier so he can do less further damage. If it does, great. Even though I'm quite sure it won't.

That's my take on it. yeah the economy's great. So what? China owns us financially, heavy sanctions could really fuck up our economy. And they are massive and sophisticated now. There's some high-level stuff going on, and Trump is just not the guy to be leading us through this.
 
totach said:
The one thing I can’t comprehend currently is why liberals are pro this impeachment hunt if they are %100 sure it won’t pass the senate . You even have dems that have stated they will vote against and so far we got one to flip parties cuz of this hunt . Now where I’m confused is why are they ok with all this wasted time and money .
Can someone explain this to me ? And please don’t say cuz it’s due process . It’s not like he got caught getting a blowjob underneath his desk . This is about interpreting what was said on that phone call which should have never bin made public in the first place .
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It's not about the phone call, it's about the fact that there were multiple attempts to get Ukraine's government to announce the beginning of an investigation into Joe Biden's supposed influence on Hunter Biden's career in return for a White House meeting with Zelensky and several hundred million dollars in aid disbursements.

In particular, Gordon Sondland, who was named by Trump as his Ambassador to the European Union, has admitted to participating in this scheme. Fiona Hill, who worked closely with John Bolton, the former head of Trump's national security team, has testified that Bolton was aware of the scheme and chagrined by its iniquity. While this is hearsay, John Bolton is a public figure (and a committed American nationalist, with all the good and bad thereunto appertaining) who has been aware of her testimony for weeks. Bolton has been active on Twitter but has not cast doubt on Hill's claims. Together with the whistleblower complaint there is plenty of evidence for the allegations of improper requests made with consideration to be provided by the US taxpayer.

This announcement would have an immediate impact on Joe Biden's reputation and therefore an impact on the Democratic primary and the 2020 election. The announcement that Trump asked for would hurt Joe Biden in the election even if the subsequent investigation turned up no evidence of wrongdoing. If anyone's due process rights are violated there, it's Joe Biden's. The reason that Democrats are pursuing the impeachment is to ensure that there will always be consequences for attempts to interfere with US elections using Presidential power. Even if the impeachment does not lead to removal, it still sends the message that people care about manipulation of our elections and will do whatever they can to prevent it. Like Xorkoth said, doing nothing will make future Presidents think they can do it too.

I'd like to take this time to say I really dislike Joe Biden and I don't want him to become the Democratic nominee. He sponsored the RAVE act, and furthermore, have you seen his debates? Half the time he can't remember what he's saying and talks in concatenated sentence fragments.

Nonetheless I don't want his campaign derailed by Presidential misconduct. Trump's attempt to trade US taxpayer money and Presidential prestige for campaign PR is an attack on our democracy and it must be opposed.
 
We most certainly cannot vote Biden in!
my God the guy can’t even make a coherent sentence.
not to mention his creepy weird child molesting tendencies.

I would knock that guy out if he was touching my daughter like I have seen him do with others right on camera and in front of the parents!
 
I really do not want Biden either. Nevertheless, it's about doing the right thing here. Interference with presidential elections by the president by enlisting a foreign power is essentially the very thing the founding fathers wrote impeachment into the American system for.
 
If Democrats would go more to the center on abortion they'd make republicans basically extinct. They would carry both houses and the presidency every cycle.

I don't think they know how critical that is to a lot of people. I've heard a LOT have people throughout my life say "I like _________, but I cant vote for a baby killer/pro abortion person" or something to that extent.

I'm just talking strategy here but Dems seem to have no interest in actually winning elections. I don't mean banning abortion, either. Just going to the center on that one issue.

Yeah republicans would still call them baby killers, but if their position was a little more sensible, that would be enough for a lot of people.
 
mal3volent said:
If Democrats would go more to the center on abortion they'd make republicans basically extinct.
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56328580_10218332051361974_8579925540083859456_n.jpg

Democrats have never won an election by capitulating to the right, the only time they win is when they run a progressive platform

also what's the "center" between government making an ownership claim on people's bodies or not tolerating slavery?
 
Biden has fallen behind for me too.

Warren is still way up there for me, but I could easily turn to Bernie if it meant solidarity for the left.
 
tathra said:
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Democrats have never won an election by capitulating to the right, the only time they win is when they run a progressive platform

also what's the "center" between government making an ownership claim on people's bodies or not tolerating slavery?
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When did I say they had to change their entire platform? That's exactly the point I'm trying to make. If they move to center on this ONE issue they could afford to move further left pretty much everywhere else.

Don't lecture me about ownership of bodies or slavery. There are a thousand other ways the government already owns us. I'm talking politics here. Besides, unless you believe in free abortions for everyone in literally every circumstance you are just as much taking "ownership" as me. If you DO believe that, be glad those running for office don't. They'd never win another election again, anywhere.
 
mal3volent said:
When did I say they had to change their entire platform? That's exactly the point I'm trying to make. If they move to center on this ONE issue they could afford to move further left pretty much everywhere else.
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I disagree. The larger concept of 'make it on your own' vs 'tax everyone to help those in need' is a larger issue in that it ripples out to how citizens see one another (not a uniting view in either case, IMO). Abortion is a very strong issue with a minority, and an easy pinata point of argument against liberal politicians, but to regain the majority of American minds I think the left needs to change a LOT more than just their position on abortion, and that doesn't mean going 'more left' on the other topics.

Don't lecture me about ownership of bodies or slavery. There are a thousand other ways the government already owns us. I'm talking politics here. Besides, unless you believe in free abortions for everyone in literally every circumstance you are just as much taking "ownership" as me. If you DO believe that, be glad those running for office don't. They'd never win another election again, anywhere.
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Calm down. Tathra's point isn't directed at you personally, he's sharing a view he's shared many times in general - that there is no left and right in the original context. Both parties have shifted from the original definitions, it's a game at this point where the terms 'left' and 'right' only have context in contrast to the other party and not to a true left-center-right view of the world. His asking of the difference between abortion and slavery when it comes to gov't claiming decision power isn't intended to be a personal lecture for you, but a general question to all on where does gov't control end and personal control begin. It's not a challenge or a statement, but a question for others to consider.
 
TLB, tathra is a big boy. I think he can handle me asking him not to lecture me. It was mostly tongue in cheek and not a big deal. I made a cogent argument about the use of the word ownership. If tathra wants to respond why don't you let him instead of refereeing. :)
 
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