ShroomySatori
Bluelighter
Also bro you said it yourself a few posts above if I'm not mistaken. You say you function better on lower doses (once you adjust to them, which I agree is fucking torture and really really tough). I could not agree more. When I lower my dose, I get much better pain relief. You would think taking 150mg oxy a day would give you better pain relief than 40mg, but it doesn't work that way. Side effects start setting in, and so does an awful tolerance. The tolerance to me means that the drug takes longer to kick in, the duration of the relief is drastically shortened, and I am left in withdrawal fiending for more. It's just an awful way to live. However, if I take 60mg of heroin a day instead of 300, it is beneficial to me. Dude... I couldn't fucking walk around the block for 2 years before I even considered opiate use, I need that shit. But, there has to be balance. I'm not sure what that means to you, but for me balance is any daily amount of oxycodone or heroin below 100mg - ideally around 50 or 60mg because you are still getting good relief that way, but it's not too too high of a dose.
So, at the moment I am fighting for 60mg heroin a day. I prefer heroin to oxy because I am willing to wait 12 hours for that hit because the hit is just so much better. Withdrawal symptoms disappear in 15 minutes, and the high lasts 6 hours... even longer before I reach withdrawal and need more. However, I am not peaking that whole time and if I chase the high even a handful of times, I lose all my progress. I start hitting withdrawal as soon as 2 hours after I dose the same amount. Dude... that's insane. I went through 3k of opiates in 3 weeks a couple months ago and it is never happening again. This is it for me. It's either get control or seek professional help which I'd rather not do because in my opinion it won't help me, I'll end up long term on subs and be a legal drug addict. Since I need that hit of relief bro, and unfortunately it has to be as strong relief as an insufflated opioid, but there HAS to be balance man. You know this dude I've heard you say it so many times. We both get down to lower doses and despite getting better pain relief, getting high off less, and getting high for longer, we keep making the same fuckin mistake and it's not a forgiving drug man. You make that mistake a couple times all your progress is lost and you feel discouraged because you suffered so much to get there right?
Well, I'm at day 3. First two days were 20mg heroin 8 hours apart so 60mg a day (a very low dose, that is equivalent to 60mg morphine daily or 40mg oxy except sniffing is the way to go unless I want to stick a fuckin needle in my arm which I never have done and NEVER will because that's asking to die in my opinion. It's self mutilation and asking to fucking ruin your life if not kill yourself, whereas sniffing quality diamorphine is very similar to sniffing like an OC40 or OC80 depending on the dose... it's when needles get involved that things get very different). Anyways, I'm just saying I could just as easily be using oxy bro so don't think we can't relate anymore. For example, I have never once come close to overdose since I'm very picky who I get it from and weighing the doses I take. If I was using needles I'm positive I would have overdosed by now, or gotten some sort of IV complication, labelled a problem user, and completely abandoned by my family forever. I will NEVER iv this drug because that's when you make the same horrible mistake again, usually for the last time. It's the nail on the coffin of the opiate user. I can't even afford to use 50mg oxy daily so I found an excellent connection for top quality H which I only ever sniff.
So today, I am not even going to do 60mg. I am going to do two 20mg doses spread 12 hours apart. This is just an experiment, tomorrow I'm going back to 60mg because that is so much progress anyway. I just know I can do it for one day so I am. Now, I'm really hoping I don't vomit, dry heave, or shit myself since those are my worst withdrawal symptoms and they are HELL. I asked around about this and I was told it is the withdrawal progressing since this never happened to me in the past. I had a lot of miserable symptoms but never hardcore puking, dry heaving, that stuff.
I think I'll be fine but I could really use some encouragement. I am getting a gram in the next day or two and I will have a lot more H then. This means the opportunity to use more but I HAVE TO REMIND MYSELF how easily I can blow through that gram. The thing is a gram is such a small amount that I will see it disappearing. I need to stick with 20mg every 8 hours when I get it. I NEED TO. It is seriously accomplish what I set out to do this time, or seek professional help which would FUCKING SUCK. And if I use it responsibly like I have the last 2 days and today, that gram will last me over 2 weeks. I will get excellent highs off very low 20mg doses too that last for a full 6 hours like they should. At that point I will have my percocet to fall back on and I'll start using oxy again in a couple weeks, continuing my taper but staying at the same dose (60mg oxy a day... which means I'll still need to supplement a little heroin that month... because I'm taking it slower this time, I'm not going to 40mg daily because I'll get extreme PAWS, freak out mentally and relapse in full). I am taking it slow and I'll be using 60mg a day of either oxy or heroin (probably 80mg oxy because the oxy I get is such shit quality tamper proofed or whatev) for the foreseeable future. Probably all year. It's still a huge improvement to be well under 100mg.
I'm already feeling better today. I actually had the energy to do something - I've been playing guitar for a few hours and recorded a couple things that I liked. I am sick as fuck but I know I can do it this time. So long as I avoid making that mistake because just once is all it takes at this point. Well into the future, I'll be able to get away with taking more on a stressful work day or shit like that but that is months from now, that is not now. If I do that even once now I'm just fucking myself.
Man we are around the same dose. 60mg of my heroin, I'd gladly trade for 105mg oxy/day if it wasn't percocet with apap or tamper-proof. Anyways, my withdrawals have been brutal this time because I was using sometimes 2 or 300 milligrams a day this year. The amount I am using seems like I am hardly using at all. It sucks. I like that I use once every 8 hours on a schedule because I never get too sick that I freak out like when I was in cold turkey, I was looking at the time seeing when I could get a fix again and then I went completely crazy with the drugs once I had a chance to use them again. So, that simply doesn't work for me I avoid that at all costs.
And yeah dude sometimes I just like to read through the old posts from last year, I was in a better place then. I was still seeing my girlfriend on and off but now that I haven't heard from her all year it has been devastating to me. It is what I think about a lot when I'm not using or haven't for a while and makes me want to use right away but I might have found someone new finally.
Watch the tylenol because I think the max safe daily dose for liver is 4 grams. Yesterday was my second day of doing this but my spine was killing me. It hurt so bad in my original pain place, much worse than the other withdrawal symptoms. I had lower pain in my spine too when it is normally mid-spine only. I know studies show that the pain can spread because it maps to the brain kind of side by side so if the neurons fire for long enough, say you have pain in your lower arm it might travel to your upper arm as phantom pain because the cells are beside the messed up ones that are constantly sending pain signals and I guess they are like F this and send them to nearby neurons and then you experience a spread in the pain. I hope that doesn't happen to me and there is that opioid condition to worry about too.... where people who quit end up experiencing more pain than the average person. Like, even taking a shower can hurt apparently.
I am getting up there, it has been half a decade and I think anything over 2 or 3 years you are pretty much screwed for life. Always a chance of relapse, post-acute problems etc. I have a habit of taking amphetamines in withdrawal because without them there are times when I could never see it through. I still managed to sleep last night taking a lot of melatonin and I woke up at 10 when I usually dose at 8am so this day should be easier. If it doesn't start getting better soon I'll raise my dose a bit. I am getting high off this amount which means I could probably get reasonably high off 3 percocets again. I'll probably switch to 30 milligrams every 12 hours once I am used to this because what I'm really trying to cut out is compulsive high frequency dosing. Or I might fall off the wagon and start using 100mg a day again at least, then my gram won't last 2 weeks it will last a week or less, and I will be searching for another. So fuck that because if I make it last 2 weeks then I'll have my new script and I can switch to oxy. It's a good chance for me to cut back and the amount I'm using presently doesn't both me. I'm not getting as many side effects and I am feeling the hits a lot better, eventually the hits will become much more longer lasting as well. I find with high dose or frequent use the doses do not last long. They take longer to kick in, and I get like an hour or 2 of relief. If I am using less H or oxy then the relief will last maybe 4 hours and I will not think about more until at least the 6th hour. It is much better to take less but I have this fiend thing going on that has to stop.
Amphetamines are oddly mild painkillers. I find it better to use those instead of taking more than I was intending to, because they don't have a withdrawal nor do they interfere with the taper very much. I can get really tired for a while if I use them too much, but for the first few days of withdrawal for me anyway, amphetamines are extremely useful. When I can't take the pain anymore and am thinking of dosing drugs that I either don't have and/or shouldn't be using more of anyway, I'll take an amphetamine instead and it helps see me through until I can dose again.
It was nice to wake up so long past my dose time and I didn't have the chance to feel sick as I never really wake up all that sick unless it's been like a really long time since I used. I guess since my body is still waking up, there is a short period of time where I can dose and avoid that feeling and this morning there hasn't been any pain. I think that it will be a much better day than yesterday. Since it is the third day, if I make it through today I will probably keep going with it. Since that means I've been through the worst of it and start getting accustomed to this new way of more controlled using.
I just want to see all 3 of us succeed squeaky me you and pokemama we set out together and we will get off this shit or find what works for us. For me, it's going to be my prescribed dose as I've realized my doctor is actually smart not to script me anymore than he has. Once I get used to not insufflating my drugs for a faster effect and better high, I'll switch back to oxy completely and I'll just take my shit as prescribed. I KNOW I CAN DO THIS. I am not powerless over my addiction or any of that shit. I am capable of analytical thought, self control, and adjusting my actions while keeping the future in mind. This is the end of the line for me though. I'm getting old to be fuckin around with heroin and if I can't beat it this time I'm gonna be forced to look into subs or some shit. I will prevail.
By the way dude, my tolerance is down even on the 3rd day. It's totally worth it if you can find the time to suffer and be useless for a couple days. You know this though. I am not telling you anything you do not already know because you are an opiate addict just like me. Of course you know these things but sometimes a reminder is helpful man. I just want to see you succeed dude. Fuck whatever surgeries you had. You know the drugs work better for pain when you don't abuse them. I know this too. But we keep fucking up. We should make a pact to seriously just fucking taper man. That's what works best for me and I think it's what works best for you too dude because we are both very emotionally unstable. So cold turkey is out of the question when you're mentally ill like this. It could lead to suicide... the first day I did this, I had suicidal ideation all day long and I was crying non-stop. This is the kind of shit that separates the boys from the men bro. You can't give in to abusing this drug. And I know I'm a hypocrite for saying this because I'm a full blown heroin addict on day 3. Not much. But I'm still trying.
So, at the moment I am fighting for 60mg heroin a day. I prefer heroin to oxy because I am willing to wait 12 hours for that hit because the hit is just so much better. Withdrawal symptoms disappear in 15 minutes, and the high lasts 6 hours... even longer before I reach withdrawal and need more. However, I am not peaking that whole time and if I chase the high even a handful of times, I lose all my progress. I start hitting withdrawal as soon as 2 hours after I dose the same amount. Dude... that's insane. I went through 3k of opiates in 3 weeks a couple months ago and it is never happening again. This is it for me. It's either get control or seek professional help which I'd rather not do because in my opinion it won't help me, I'll end up long term on subs and be a legal drug addict. Since I need that hit of relief bro, and unfortunately it has to be as strong relief as an insufflated opioid, but there HAS to be balance man. You know this dude I've heard you say it so many times. We both get down to lower doses and despite getting better pain relief, getting high off less, and getting high for longer, we keep making the same fuckin mistake and it's not a forgiving drug man. You make that mistake a couple times all your progress is lost and you feel discouraged because you suffered so much to get there right?
Well, I'm at day 3. First two days were 20mg heroin 8 hours apart so 60mg a day (a very low dose, that is equivalent to 60mg morphine daily or 40mg oxy except sniffing is the way to go unless I want to stick a fuckin needle in my arm which I never have done and NEVER will because that's asking to die in my opinion. It's self mutilation and asking to fucking ruin your life if not kill yourself, whereas sniffing quality diamorphine is very similar to sniffing like an OC40 or OC80 depending on the dose... it's when needles get involved that things get very different). Anyways, I'm just saying I could just as easily be using oxy bro so don't think we can't relate anymore. For example, I have never once come close to overdose since I'm very picky who I get it from and weighing the doses I take. If I was using needles I'm positive I would have overdosed by now, or gotten some sort of IV complication, labelled a problem user, and completely abandoned by my family forever. I will NEVER iv this drug because that's when you make the same horrible mistake again, usually for the last time. It's the nail on the coffin of the opiate user. I can't even afford to use 50mg oxy daily so I found an excellent connection for top quality H which I only ever sniff.
So today, I am not even going to do 60mg. I am going to do two 20mg doses spread 12 hours apart. This is just an experiment, tomorrow I'm going back to 60mg because that is so much progress anyway. I just know I can do it for one day so I am. Now, I'm really hoping I don't vomit, dry heave, or shit myself since those are my worst withdrawal symptoms and they are HELL. I asked around about this and I was told it is the withdrawal progressing since this never happened to me in the past. I had a lot of miserable symptoms but never hardcore puking, dry heaving, that stuff.
I think I'll be fine but I could really use some encouragement. I am getting a gram in the next day or two and I will have a lot more H then. This means the opportunity to use more but I HAVE TO REMIND MYSELF how easily I can blow through that gram. The thing is a gram is such a small amount that I will see it disappearing. I need to stick with 20mg every 8 hours when I get it. I NEED TO. It is seriously accomplish what I set out to do this time, or seek professional help which would FUCKING SUCK. And if I use it responsibly like I have the last 2 days and today, that gram will last me over 2 weeks. I will get excellent highs off very low 20mg doses too that last for a full 6 hours like they should. At that point I will have my percocet to fall back on and I'll start using oxy again in a couple weeks, continuing my taper but staying at the same dose (60mg oxy a day... which means I'll still need to supplement a little heroin that month... because I'm taking it slower this time, I'm not going to 40mg daily because I'll get extreme PAWS, freak out mentally and relapse in full). I am taking it slow and I'll be using 60mg a day of either oxy or heroin (probably 80mg oxy because the oxy I get is such shit quality tamper proofed or whatev) for the foreseeable future. Probably all year. It's still a huge improvement to be well under 100mg.
I'm already feeling better today. I actually had the energy to do something - I've been playing guitar for a few hours and recorded a couple things that I liked. I am sick as fuck but I know I can do it this time. So long as I avoid making that mistake because just once is all it takes at this point. Well into the future, I'll be able to get away with taking more on a stressful work day or shit like that but that is months from now, that is not now. If I do that even once now I'm just fucking myself.
Man we are around the same dose. 60mg of my heroin, I'd gladly trade for 105mg oxy/day if it wasn't percocet with apap or tamper-proof. Anyways, my withdrawals have been brutal this time because I was using sometimes 2 or 300 milligrams a day this year. The amount I am using seems like I am hardly using at all. It sucks. I like that I use once every 8 hours on a schedule because I never get too sick that I freak out like when I was in cold turkey, I was looking at the time seeing when I could get a fix again and then I went completely crazy with the drugs once I had a chance to use them again. So, that simply doesn't work for me I avoid that at all costs.
And yeah dude sometimes I just like to read through the old posts from last year, I was in a better place then. I was still seeing my girlfriend on and off but now that I haven't heard from her all year it has been devastating to me. It is what I think about a lot when I'm not using or haven't for a while and makes me want to use right away but I might have found someone new finally.
Watch the tylenol because I think the max safe daily dose for liver is 4 grams. Yesterday was my second day of doing this but my spine was killing me. It hurt so bad in my original pain place, much worse than the other withdrawal symptoms. I had lower pain in my spine too when it is normally mid-spine only. I know studies show that the pain can spread because it maps to the brain kind of side by side so if the neurons fire for long enough, say you have pain in your lower arm it might travel to your upper arm as phantom pain because the cells are beside the messed up ones that are constantly sending pain signals and I guess they are like F this and send them to nearby neurons and then you experience a spread in the pain. I hope that doesn't happen to me and there is that opioid condition to worry about too.... where people who quit end up experiencing more pain than the average person. Like, even taking a shower can hurt apparently.
I am getting up there, it has been half a decade and I think anything over 2 or 3 years you are pretty much screwed for life. Always a chance of relapse, post-acute problems etc. I have a habit of taking amphetamines in withdrawal because without them there are times when I could never see it through. I still managed to sleep last night taking a lot of melatonin and I woke up at 10 when I usually dose at 8am so this day should be easier. If it doesn't start getting better soon I'll raise my dose a bit. I am getting high off this amount which means I could probably get reasonably high off 3 percocets again. I'll probably switch to 30 milligrams every 12 hours once I am used to this because what I'm really trying to cut out is compulsive high frequency dosing. Or I might fall off the wagon and start using 100mg a day again at least, then my gram won't last 2 weeks it will last a week or less, and I will be searching for another. So fuck that because if I make it last 2 weeks then I'll have my new script and I can switch to oxy. It's a good chance for me to cut back and the amount I'm using presently doesn't both me. I'm not getting as many side effects and I am feeling the hits a lot better, eventually the hits will become much more longer lasting as well. I find with high dose or frequent use the doses do not last long. They take longer to kick in, and I get like an hour or 2 of relief. If I am using less H or oxy then the relief will last maybe 4 hours and I will not think about more until at least the 6th hour. It is much better to take less but I have this fiend thing going on that has to stop.
Amphetamines are oddly mild painkillers. I find it better to use those instead of taking more than I was intending to, because they don't have a withdrawal nor do they interfere with the taper very much. I can get really tired for a while if I use them too much, but for the first few days of withdrawal for me anyway, amphetamines are extremely useful. When I can't take the pain anymore and am thinking of dosing drugs that I either don't have and/or shouldn't be using more of anyway, I'll take an amphetamine instead and it helps see me through until I can dose again.
It was nice to wake up so long past my dose time and I didn't have the chance to feel sick as I never really wake up all that sick unless it's been like a really long time since I used. I guess since my body is still waking up, there is a short period of time where I can dose and avoid that feeling and this morning there hasn't been any pain. I think that it will be a much better day than yesterday. Since it is the third day, if I make it through today I will probably keep going with it. Since that means I've been through the worst of it and start getting accustomed to this new way of more controlled using.
I just want to see all 3 of us succeed squeaky me you and pokemama we set out together and we will get off this shit or find what works for us. For me, it's going to be my prescribed dose as I've realized my doctor is actually smart not to script me anymore than he has. Once I get used to not insufflating my drugs for a faster effect and better high, I'll switch back to oxy completely and I'll just take my shit as prescribed. I KNOW I CAN DO THIS. I am not powerless over my addiction or any of that shit. I am capable of analytical thought, self control, and adjusting my actions while keeping the future in mind. This is the end of the line for me though. I'm getting old to be fuckin around with heroin and if I can't beat it this time I'm gonna be forced to look into subs or some shit. I will prevail.
By the way dude, my tolerance is down even on the 3rd day. It's totally worth it if you can find the time to suffer and be useless for a couple days. You know this though. I am not telling you anything you do not already know because you are an opiate addict just like me. Of course you know these things but sometimes a reminder is helpful man. I just want to see you succeed dude. Fuck whatever surgeries you had. You know the drugs work better for pain when you don't abuse them. I know this too. But we keep fucking up. We should make a pact to seriously just fucking taper man. That's what works best for me and I think it's what works best for you too dude because we are both very emotionally unstable. So cold turkey is out of the question when you're mentally ill like this. It could lead to suicide... the first day I did this, I had suicidal ideation all day long and I was crying non-stop. This is the kind of shit that separates the boys from the men bro. You can't give in to abusing this drug. And I know I'm a hypocrite for saying this because I'm a full blown heroin addict on day 3. Not much. But I'm still trying.
