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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

The Psychoactive Substances Act - Update: Illegals R Us

F.U.B.A.R. said:
Wasn't the NZ situation you're referring to BZP, not methylone? Methylone was one of Shulgin's iirc. The guy who created the BZP market in NZ did so after seeing his friend disembowel himself with a samurai sword in the grip of meth psychosis. However, BZP is not exactly safe either...
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There is definitely no legal methylone in NZ and they still have a MASSIVE problem with meth or P as they call it. Not sure where you got your info from but you need to check your sources (not you FUBAR, you need to check your fishnets ;) )
 
Yes it was BZP, but he was also the first to synthesize Methylone. I guess they were so desperate at the time they thought anything could be better than Meth, and just went with it... obv BZP aint no herbal tea. There was an interseting documentary about him, and the RC market on Vice, not sure if u have seen it?
 
yea no doubt, i never said that BZP saved new zelands youth from the treacherous grips of meth, and that NZ is the most drug free paradise on earth.
i was just talking about something that happened many years ago over there, which i found quite interesting. we were discussing pro's and con's of banning RC's?
just thought it was an interesting point to bring up TIS' ALL
 
coz111 said:
Yes it was BZP, but he was also the first to synthesize Methylone. I guess they were so desperate at the time they thought anything could be better than Meth, and just went with it... obv BZP aint no herbal tea. There was an interseting documentary about him, and the RC market on Vice, not sure if u have seen it?
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Sorry, methylone was first synthesised by Alexander Shulgin and Peyton Jacob III - both Americans - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methylone in 1996.

The guy in NZ (can't remember his name) didn't create BZP either, he just touted it as a safe 'Party Pill'. BZP is also now illegal over there https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzylpiperazine


Edit: If you're getting your information from Vice, that could be the problem ;)
 
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BZP was never discovered in NZ. It was researched as a anti parasitic drug for livestock in the 1950's and used recreationally in California in the early 90's before it was used in NZ. It was never pitched to the govt and legalised. It was sold because there was no law covering it much like the current rc situation. It eventually got banned in 2007. It never had any major effect on NZs meth problem...they still have a massive meth problem.
 
i wonder why they made it illegal..? did it... it get.. people high??? good gosh..... then why legalize it to begin with. i've never heard of this BZP..
But i remember when methylone was around, and i was too young, i didn't have my own 'dealer' then, i iused to buy methylone for me and my mates to go out to raves too.. haha
 
'Vice!?' mehehehehe 'did u hear that consumer' 'he got his info from Vive' mehehehehe
jeeez, u old timers on here don't have to sneer down on some of the more un-informed of us for getting a few facts wrong.
i'm pretty sure that there was a lot of packaged, branded BZP being openly sold in nightclubs in NZ up until 2008, when the government banned it.
 
You post was full of misinformation. Excuse us for correcting you. Yes BZP was sold as Charge in nightclubs and shops in NZ. Methylone was briefly sold too. That does not mean the govt approved or legalised it as you stated nor did it have any effect on NZs meth problem as you also stated. Nor were either of these drugs discovered by some guy in NZ. So basically your post was complete nonsense.
 
anyway the point i was trying to make, using those (now i know) false examples, is that there are chemists who experimenting with new substances in hope to replace many of the more harmful, addictive, drugs with less harmful, more effective alternatives. And I think they rely on The RC scene to do that.
maybe it's all bullshit, i donno
 
coz111 said:
anyway the point i was trying to make, using those (now i know) false examples, is that there are chemists who experimenting with new substances in hope to replace many of the more harmful, addictive, drugs with less harmful, more effective alternatives. And I think they rely on The RC scene to do that.
maybe it's all bullshit, i donno
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That point is worth discussing now we have the facts sorted.
Maybe there are chemists out there with aims and goals like you stated. I am personally not so sure. The RC scene seems to me to be driven by a lust for money...i dont think the labs in China are out to create chems for the betterment of man...they are money making ventures as are the RC suppliers vending the stuff. A lot of the rcs are no safer than classic street drugs and some like the nBome series are down right dangerous when taken under the impression that they are lsd.

You may be right though. This is just my opinion
 
The only drug that springs to mind as made for the sake of being a safer alternative to a street drug is MXE, which according to wiki was actually invented for grey market distribution, with the specific goal of being less damaging to the urinary system than K is. In general though, the approach to RCs is to find whatever minimal modification to a current drug makes it able to skate past the current state of the law, with a secondary consideration to making sure it actually works. Indeed, most RCs are less effective than the street drugs they're knocking off, with the notable exception of the NBOMe's, although as a tangent, they are horribly less safe than LSD, which alongside weed is probably one of the safest drugs around in terms of therapeutic index.

I'd definitely side with consumer here, greed is the motivator, not any sort of utopian view towards creating safer drugs. I believe NZ did have a proposed law at some point to allow legalised NPS's after their safety was proved in a proper clinical trial, but IIRC that didn't make it through parliament.
 
I am not sure but i thought NZ did adopt that law. The problem there is the RC companies are unwilling or cant afford to conduct proper clinical trials...so no drugs have been approved. They should run trials on some of the lysergamides as these would certainly pass any clinical trials regarding toxicity and physical safety.
 
i've heard that it's mostly foreigners who use those factories in china to produce their own chemical molecules for them. The chinese factorie's don't give a shit what the chemical is then going to be used for, I don't think they even ask. They get paid, then get to work. for all they know it could be a chemical used to make up a shade of orange in a can of paint, not a lethal new cannabinoid thats gonna send hundreds of kids into Emergency rooms nationwide..
 
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