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Kratom Withdrawal

How long does it take to get hooked? RedLeader, how bad are the withdrawals after 7 days in a row? The worst thing for me is making time pass. Maybe try watching a comedy or play a video game or something.

In "Diary of a Drug Fiend," Aleister Crowley wrote something along the lines that said that if you're going to take drugs, then you must be able to start and stop at will. Being on opiates, even kratom, is like a mountain climber glissading down a steep ice field on a mountain side at 100 mph. At the end of the ice field is a 10,000 foot cliff. The mountain climber has only an ice axe to stop him/herself. One must have the self control and skill to stop before sliding off that 10000 foot cliff. Then he goes on to lecture the reader to use heroin, cocaine, etc. as tools to enhance concentration and focus on the "Great Work" (I read that as your job, your studies, your passions in life).

I get slightly different withdrawal symptoms every time I quit, it seems. For example, I saw RedLeader's post about quitting and I thought I might experiment with taking a break from Kratom again along with you. Keep in mind that I was only on 3 grams or so per day for several months. So this time, I quit without a taper and have had no Kratom whatsoever. Unfortunately, I had some nasty symptoms, including insomnia and tossing and turning. I've slept about 4 hours per night since quitting. I followed that guy's advice to take coffee. It helped restore my energy. Day 1, for example, I spent 8 hours hiking up and down mountain sides picking edible wild mushrooms. The other days, I've been doing nothing but studying, writing a grant application, and organizign the house. Those activities have largely taken my mind off it. But I really wish I could sleep.

I'm also curious about people's motivations for quitting. For me, I need to take a break for a while to remind myself what it's like not to be on it or in withdrawal. That and I'm going overseas soon and I doubt that I will have access to it. Best to quit now until I know what to expect.
 
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socko said:
How long does it take to get hooked? RedLeader, how bad are the withdrawals after 7 days in a row? The worst thing for me is making time pass. Maybe try watching a comedy or play a video game or something.
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Without previous opiate dependence, it would take a while. You'd have to put some effort into getting a kratom habit. With previous dependence, I'd say a week of daily use would create a minor WD.

At 7 days, it's completely manageable. It's nowhere near as bad as a 7 day relapse with heroin would be. It's mainly body aches (especially lower back and extremities), sweating, bowel issues, headaches, heightened anxiety and some irritability and lack of desire to do anything. I could still eat, sleep, go to work and get by in society. It was just annoying, and only really bad if I only focused on it and worked myself up over it. I feel like it would take a solid month of daily use before it would get pretty rough.

What I have never felt from kratom withdrawal is that hollow/empty/lifelessness that characterises heroin withdrawal (and IMO is the worst part of heroin WD). I've also never felt an extreme physical craving for more of the drug with kratom (rather just a notion of yes, it would be rather nice if I had more of the drug and these symptoms faded away, but I don't need it like air or water). I feel both of these after just 5-7 days of heroin use.
 
Yeah I agree, I got lightly hooked on heroin two different times and the way I felt was inhuman, it was horrible, like I was not even the same person, it really scared me. Kratom and also poppy tea do not seem to produce this effect (those are the two I've been super addicted to). I still couldn't participate very well in society, but I could work (I work at home, if I was in the office it would have been much harder and people would have known something was up). But I felt like myself, just suffering tremendously.
 
Okay, so after going two days into withdrawal, I gave in and dosed on both of my days off this week (Tuesday and Wednesday). But I'm 48 hours deep into it again, and I've planned my day today so that I won't use. If I had to characterize kratom WD by one stand-out symptom, it would be the stomach discomfort. Oddly enough, this is the one symptom that has always been absent from my heroin kicks.

Anyway, I'm doing my best to continue eating at the pace I want to for lifting (which only makes the stomach discomfort ten times worse, but at least I can eat). About to go to the gym despite feeling terrible. Work later today, which will involve a lot of heavy lifting.

The one blessing with kratom is that there's no extreme physical cravings for more of it, despite being in WD. The idea of swallowing all of those pills and waiting an hour for anything to happen does not get me excited (like the idea of heroin and instant relief).
 
Hmm, I don't get any stomach discomfort from it (or any opiates I've been addicted to). For me it's the DAMN INTENSE restlessness, far more restless than other opiate withdrawals I've gone through (heroin and poppy tea). And it makes me feel SO weak, and cold. Lucky for you though, I feel like I couldn't work out in kratom withdrawal.
 
I'm trying to not take kratom for a few days. My stomach is giving me problems and I wonder if kratom is to blame. I have a sensitive stomach after all. Today I feel fine without it and actually did more than I would have ever done if I dosed kratom. Last time there was a big period of lethargy and depression during withdrawal. I don't know why but kratom withdrawal symptoms or any drug withdrawal symptom is largely related to my mood. I'm bipolar and if I hit a manic phase I can quit solid habits cold turkey and feel fine. That's where I'm at now. Really energetic and confident. I feel like I don't even need kratom or any drug to be happy. First time in a while. I may dose tommorow but for today I'm "sober."
 
I've known lots of people with manias that can see the positives in them and that would certainly qualify as one! Hope your stomach feels better.
 
herbavore said:
I've known lots of people with manias that can see the positives in them and that would certainly qualify as one! Hope your stomach feels better.
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Ha it did. I worked for 6 hours and didn't really enjoy my shift but I wasn't jonesing. Go mania! Forgot to mention I'm also switching from 1 mg a day of klonopin to .75 and cutting back on the pot and booze a bit too over the past week or so. This is a lot at once.

EDIT: Next morning. It's been almost 48 hours since I dosed kratom and even longer since my last cig. I gotta say I don't miss the cigs unless I'm drinking and I haven't missed the kratom and I have much more energy ironically.
 
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Nicely done RedLeader.

Weekend: I had/have stomach cramps too. I thought I'd picked some bad mushrooms, but maybe it's kratom.

Does anybody have trouble thermoregulating during or after quitting kratom? I mean, I'm in the desert sun on the solstice at high noon wearing a black long sleeved shirt. It's 83 degrees and I'm freezing.
 
socko said:
Nicely done RedLeader.

Weekend: I had/have stomach cramps too. I thought I'd picked some bad mushrooms, but maybe it's kratom.

Does anybody have trouble thermoregulating during or after quitting kratom? I mean, I'm in the desert sun on the solstice at high noon wearing a black long sleeved shirt. It's 83 degrees and I'm freezing.
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As far as the thermoregulation issues - yes, definitely. Kratom withdrawal definitely causes this, as well as any other opiate withdrawal. The stomach cramps being caused by Kratom withdrawal is totally possible too. Or it could just be bad mushrooms that you picked. Or it could be both. Stomach issues during Kratom withdrawal for me only seemed to occur when coming off of higher dose/more frequent use. But so yeah, it's totally possible. Some average-slightly above average therapeutic level dosed loperamide should help that though, and that symptom should ease up after a few days in any case. Actually lope being an opiate as well, may possibly prolong the withdrawal symptom, but decrease its intensity. I would just use your judgement regarding if you really need it or not. If you don't really need it, just deal with it for a few days and it should ease up relatively quickly.

Same with thermoregulation. I have had success utilizing 98% l-tetrahydropalmatine for the anxiety/restlessness/thermoregulation symptoms with great success in the past, though it may make you more tired if you use too much. It's not addictive or harmful as far as I can tell from all the research I've done on it, but anything is possible when it comes to stuff that affects the mind/body of course, and everyone is different. Really though, from everything I've read (and experienced), l-THP seems to be anti-addictive in almost every sense - it's worked for me and I've never had any issues from its use.

The physical symptoms including thermoreg and GI issues should ease up in only a few days when it comes to Kratom anyway though, maybe 5 days max I would say, assuming Kratom is the only thing you've been using regularly.
 
Relapsed on Kratom this weekend after having quit for 2 and 1/2 weeks... was having PAWS and was at a college grad party and was the night of my birthday. Trigger on top of trigger on top of trigger. Did a couple low doses of extract from the local head shop within a ~20 hour period. And now some physical symptoms are back. From that! Will this ever go away? :/
 
Quit kratom and cigs recently at the same time. My habit was 2 teaspoons of bali kratom a day and 4-5 Pall Mall Lights a day. The kratom was very good and that was a decent dose for me.

Anyway I am good on the cigarettes so far though I had one last night after drinking too much. But thats out of five days. The kratom I only lasted 48 hours. I am about to take my last dose now just to avoid w\d. I got two days and an afternoon to recover. I should have plenty of time to get my head balanced. One day I want off this stuff and all drugs period. That's what I keep telling myself but then why do I keep using? My old therapists said because I don't know hot to not use. I know how not to I just choose to use anyway.

I don't know what to tell you whiteroom67. Lets face it kratom is a cheap mild opiod and seems to retain most of its potency if its not abused. So of course we want more. The withdrawals seem to last a good bit and are altogether not like opiod withdrawals IMO. It reminds me more of amphetamine withdrawals. A soul crushing emptyness and depression if you let yourself get caught up in it. Thing positive man no withdrawal last forever and it gets easier to quit each time.
 
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Blackvinegar2 said:
damn.... I tried kratom ONE time when I was withdrawaling from a small fentanyl and heroin binge I had like 2 summers ago.. It was some pretty weak stuff. People actually get addicted and withdrawals from this stuff???!!! hahahaha.... Seriously guys, You don't know what pure agony and suffering is untill you have had the W/D's from an IV heroin habit, and your connect is out of town for 3 days. Does kratom withdrawal leave you on the bathroom floor in the fetal position in a pool of your own diarrhea shit with goose bumps and throwing up all over yourself?
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Don't be a douche. You said yourself you don't even know what kratom withdrawal is like. No, it's not heroin but shut your fucking face YES you will get sick off the stuff.
 
I know this sounds weird but . . . Something that helped me with weaker drug withdrawals ( weed/kratom/etc ) is getting a hot bath and lots of good smells from any type of soap/fragrance AND to dunk your ears under the water - it gives this encompassing feeling - the waters wramth . . . but mainly the under water sound gives a nice feeling. . . i used to stay in a hot tub for 3-4 hours during hard core withdrawals.
 
weekend addiction said:
Quit kratom and cigs recently at the same time. My habit was 2 teaspoons of bali kratom a day and 4-5 Pall Mall Lights a day. The kratom was very good and that was a decent dose for me.

Anyway I am good on the cigarettes so far though I had one last night after drinking too much. But thats out of five days. The kratom I only lasted 48 hours. I am about to take my last dose now just to avoid w\d. I got two days and an afternoon to recover. I should have plenty of time to get my head balanced. One day I want off this stuff and all drugs period. That's what I keep telling myself but then why do I keep using? My old therapists said because I don't know hot to not use. I know how not to I just choose to use anyway.

I don't know what to tell you whiteroom67. Lets face it kratom is a cheap mild opiod and seems to retain most of its potency if its not abused. So of course we want more. The withdrawals seem to last a good bit and are altogether not like opiod withdrawals IMO. It reminds me more of amphetamine withdrawals. A soul crushing emptyness and depression if you let yourself get caught up in it. Thing positive man no withdrawal last forever and it gets easier to quit each time.
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Do you get restlessness from kratom withdrawal? For me the restlessness is far worse than ANY full opiate I've been addicted to (which includes poppy tea, oxy and heroin). It's so bad I don't just have restless legs, I get restless ARMS. It's the worst feeling in the world to be laying in bed utterly unable to sleep for days and days because all I can do is thrash my entire body and try to clench every muscle in my arms and legs as hard as possible for a few moments of relief. I've even punched myself as hard as I can in the legs and arms every 20 seconds for an entire night because the punch, though it hurts, makes the restlessness stop for 15-20 seconds. I've ever rammed my head into the wall to try to knock myself out while crying in frustration. To me it feels predominantly opiate in nature (the withdrawal), but different, less soul crushing and more jittery.

Also with opiates I found it harder to quit each time, every time I detoxed and then started again I went right back to where I started and the withdrawals would last longer and be more intense. The first time I quit was easy. The second time was harder. By the time 10 years had gone by I no longer believed it was possible to do. Though I did do it, pretty recently. With help from ibogaine.
 
Calpurrnia said:
I know this sounds weird but . . . Something that helped me with weaker drug withdrawals ( weed/kratom/etc ) is getting a hot bath and lots of good smells from any type of soap/fragrance AND to dunk your ears under the water - it gives this encompassing feeling - the waters wramth . . . but mainly the under water sound gives a nice feeling. . . i used to stay in a hot tub for 3-4 hours during hard core withdrawals.
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Agreed, hot baths or showers are standards for me when it gets really bad. I think the hot water helps your tense body let go.

Been alternating between DXM, loperamid, high dose vitamin C and black seed...today is like...about a week to ten days in to this kick...i realized at the one year mark that , holy crap, I've been taking kratom liberally for a year now...20-30+ grams a day, I'd basically dose every 2 of my waking hours...Have a history with heroin and other opiates, was clean for over a year when I got into kratom...it was legal, it seemed lighter, didn't feel like a relapse...until the kick...fuck the kick/love the kick.
 
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Xorkoth said:
Do you get restlessness from kratom withdrawal?
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Yeah me to. I am just about into the post-acute phase and it's the RLS that keeps me up at night, have been taking loperamide only for sleep. I can make it through the day on vitamin C and black seed alright, but I can't sleep without the lope. Been jumping down more each night, as too much of that I think can really prolong the kick.
 
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