Jackeh
Bluelighter
Isn't it phenylalanine in energy drinks, rather than phenyethylamine?
-
OD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Phenylethylamine's (PEA) potential for abuse.
- Thread starter Aaron556
- Start date
Both can be found in energy drinks but I think you're right in the sense that phenylalanine is more prevalent.
Phenylalanine is a precursor for L-tyrosine which is a precursor for dopamine. I think it would be far fetched to claim that it would actually boost dopamine levels because supplementing something that is biologically related to a neurotransmitter via 2 equilibria is not the same as acutely jacking up levels of that neurotransmitter.
β-Phenylethylamine is apparently itself active although in this case MAO activity and preservation of your equilibria would make this action shortlived.
Like I said earlier: eating β-phenylethylamine crystal had a short but unmistakeable effect for me and I would very much liken it to a more pure and intense version of the loved up feelings one can get from eating chocolate. And I did not read about this and chocolate being full of the stuff until after I tried pure PEA.
Anyway, we could keep discussing it but I think the thread is about the whole class of phens and what we could generalize from it and compulsive behavior.
The 2C phens are derived from mescaline and mescaline is anything but a compulsive drug for me. Granted 2C-T-7 is very pleasurable and euphoric and 2C-I is pretty stimulating and a lot more can be said about the sympathomimetic actions of phenethylamine drugs, but IMHO not that the addictive quality of any of the 2C's would come close to that of actual stimulants / empathogenic euphoriants.
Maybe DOX compounds that are much more speed-like could have this potential if it wasn't for the deterring psychedelic action that in some ways make the net total effect rather exhausting even if there is energy yielded in the process.
Phenylalanine is a precursor for L-tyrosine which is a precursor for dopamine. I think it would be far fetched to claim that it would actually boost dopamine levels because supplementing something that is biologically related to a neurotransmitter via 2 equilibria is not the same as acutely jacking up levels of that neurotransmitter.
β-Phenylethylamine is apparently itself active although in this case MAO activity and preservation of your equilibria would make this action shortlived.
Like I said earlier: eating β-phenylethylamine crystal had a short but unmistakeable effect for me and I would very much liken it to a more pure and intense version of the loved up feelings one can get from eating chocolate. And I did not read about this and chocolate being full of the stuff until after I tried pure PEA.
Anyway, we could keep discussing it but I think the thread is about the whole class of phens and what we could generalize from it and compulsive behavior.
The 2C phens are derived from mescaline and mescaline is anything but a compulsive drug for me. Granted 2C-T-7 is very pleasurable and euphoric and 2C-I is pretty stimulating and a lot more can be said about the sympathomimetic actions of phenethylamine drugs, but IMHO not that the addictive quality of any of the 2C's would come close to that of actual stimulants / empathogenic euphoriants.
Maybe DOX compounds that are much more speed-like could have this potential if it wasn't for the deterring psychedelic action that in some ways make the net total effect rather exhausting even if there is energy yielded in the process.
red22
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2009
- Messages
- 1,200
Yup. I'll post the entry for phenylalanine from Encyclopedia of Mind Enhancing Foods, Drugs and Nutritional Substances (2000, David W. Group)
No, it's about phenethylamine and by extension, phenylalanine. Psychedelics that have the phenethylamine moiety are a much different topic.
No, it's about phenethylamine and by extension, phenylalanine. Psychedelics that have the phenethylamine moiety are a much different topic.
Last edited:
Oh sorry, apparently I didn't read that right.
In that case it does not belong here in the PD forum so I will move it over to OD (even though it is like the TS - threadstarter - is long gone by now)
By the way a fine explanation for PEA itself being somewhat addictive is that its effect has the hint or promise of getting loved up but is super short lived and doesn't really even satisfy, so it can make you want to chase that promise hoping that you find the real payoff despite the high likelihood that you will never find it.
In that case it does not belong here in the PD forum so I will move it over to OD (even though it is like the TS - threadstarter - is long gone by now)
By the way a fine explanation for PEA itself being somewhat addictive is that its effect has the hint or promise of getting loved up but is super short lived and doesn't really even satisfy, so it can make you want to chase that promise hoping that you find the real payoff despite the high likelihood that you will never find it.
red22
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2009
- Messages
- 1,200
Phenylalanine entry in Encyclopedia of Mind Enhancing Foods, Drugs and Nutritional Substances (2000, David W. Group), pp. 72-73, Minor edits made by me (continuity). Note that phenylalanine is not the subject of this thread, but it is a chemical analog of it. It's more natural, as it's a constituent of protein.
Phenylalanine
DL-phenylalanine (DLPA)
D-phenylalanine
L-phenylalanine
Phenylalanine helps create the neurotransmitters — chiefly norepinephrine, epinephrine or adrenalin, and dopamine — that produce mental arousal, alertness, and a better emotional state. It is often used by those attending raves.
Food sources: Almonds, aspartame (NutraSweet), beef, black beans, chicken, cottage cheese, dairy products, eggs, fish, lima beans, milk, nuts, peanuts, pumpkin and sesame seeds, soybeans, sunflower seeds, watercress. Plants contain mostly the "D" form, while animal products contain mostly the "L" form.
Effects: Phenylalanine may contribute to a more positive mental state, alertness, more motivation and ambition, more energy, an increase in learning ability, better memory, and an increased ability to focus and pay attention. (Leon Chaitow, N.D., D.O., claims on the "D" form produces these beneficial results, while Mark Mayell claims that the "L" form stimulates the nervous system and libido, enhances mood and cognition, and suppresses the appetite, whereas the "D" form elevates mood and enhances memory, and DLPA combines the effects of both.) It may help counter jet lag when taken first thing in the morning or right after a long flight, as it helps regulate the body's biological clock. It is believed that DLPA activates the morphine-like endorphins in the body, hormones wich act as painkillers.
One study has shown that a significant percentage of individuals suffering from depression exhibited rapid improvements in mood when given 500 mg/day of L-phenylalanine (which was gradually increased to 3 to 4 g/day), along with 100 to 200 mg a day of vitamin B-6 to facilitate the effects of the amino acid. Another study showed significant improvements in those with depression when 250 mg of L-phenylalanine was combined with 5 to 10 mg of Eldepryl. In combination with B-6, it produces the compound phenylethyalmine (PEA), which may elevate mood based on its action as a neurotransmitter. There is some evidence that, in combination with other substances, phenylalanine can help suppress addictive behavior and cravings, but there is no evidence that is suppresses appetite or enhances libido.
A deficiency can result in mood swings, weight gain, and problems with blood circulation.
Precautions: It should not be taken by those with pigmented malignant melanoma cancer, phenylketonuria (or PKU, a genetic metabolic disorder), psychosis, or Wilson's disease (otherwise known as hepatolenticular degeneration, a rare hereditary disease chiefly characterized by a toxic buildup of copper in the organs and tissues of the body). Likewise, those taking MAO-inhibitor drugs should avoid phenylalanine, as should pregnant or lactating women. Early studies seem to indicate that phenylalanine and tyrosine encourages growth of melanomas (skin cancers — one of the most deadliest forms of cancer), and doctors usually have patients restrict their intake of these amino acids. Those with high blood pressue should only take it under the guidance of a health professional.
Some warn that the daily dosage should not exceed 2.4 grams a day. Too much phenylalanine can result in over-stimulation, nervousness, heart palpitations, high blood pressure, and irritability; if taken later in the day, it may cause insomnia. Mayell says these symptoms only occur with the "L" form, and can be avoided by reducing the dosage, switching to DLPA, or taking it only in the morning. Other symptoms include headaches and nausea.
Dosage: The RDA has not been established. It is recommended that both "D" and "L" forms be used, especially in the treatment of depression or for increased energy. A dose for 1000 to 1500 mg of DLPA may be taken in the morning without food; a second dose may be taken later in the day, this time with 100 mg of B-6, 500 mg of vitamin C, and some fruit or fruit juice to help convert the amino acid to norepinephrine. Hendler, M.D., Ph.D., recommends no more than 1.5 g/day, with 20 to 30 mg/day of vitamin B-6 (not to exceed more than 50 mg/day). Mayell advocates a more modest dose of 375 to 500 mg of the "L" form or 750 to 1000 mg of DLPA, first thing in the morning at least 30 minutes before breakfast.
Chaitow, Leon, ND, DO. The Healing Power of Amino Acids. Wellingborough, England:Thorsons Publishing Group, 1989.
Mayell, Mark. Natural Energy. New York: Three Rivers Press, 1998.
Hendler, Sheldon Saul, MD, PhD. The Doctor's Vitamin and Mineral Encyclopedia. New York: Simon and Schuster, 1990.
After typing up this phenylalanine entry, I discovered that the second result in Google for the book's name is a PDF of the book. The pages in this copy are especially long, so despite the fact that there's a page count of 55, it is in fact the entire book.
Phenylalanine
DL-phenylalanine (DLPA)
D-phenylalanine
L-phenylalanine
Phenylalanine helps create the neurotransmitters — chiefly norepinephrine, epinephrine or adrenalin, and dopamine — that produce mental arousal, alertness, and a better emotional state. It is often used by those attending raves.
Food sources: Almonds, aspartame (NutraSweet), beef, black beans, chicken, cottage cheese, dairy products, eggs, fish, lima beans, milk, nuts, peanuts, pumpkin and sesame seeds, soybeans, sunflower seeds, watercress. Plants contain mostly the "D" form, while animal products contain mostly the "L" form.
Effects: Phenylalanine may contribute to a more positive mental state, alertness, more motivation and ambition, more energy, an increase in learning ability, better memory, and an increased ability to focus and pay attention. (Leon Chaitow, N.D., D.O., claims on the "D" form produces these beneficial results, while Mark Mayell claims that the "L" form stimulates the nervous system and libido, enhances mood and cognition, and suppresses the appetite, whereas the "D" form elevates mood and enhances memory, and DLPA combines the effects of both.) It may help counter jet lag when taken first thing in the morning or right after a long flight, as it helps regulate the body's biological clock. It is believed that DLPA activates the morphine-like endorphins in the body, hormones wich act as painkillers.
One study has shown that a significant percentage of individuals suffering from depression exhibited rapid improvements in mood when given 500 mg/day of L-phenylalanine (which was gradually increased to 3 to 4 g/day), along with 100 to 200 mg a day of vitamin B-6 to facilitate the effects of the amino acid. Another study showed significant improvements in those with depression when 250 mg of L-phenylalanine was combined with 5 to 10 mg of Eldepryl. In combination with B-6, it produces the compound phenylethyalmine (PEA), which may elevate mood based on its action as a neurotransmitter. There is some evidence that, in combination with other substances, phenylalanine can help suppress addictive behavior and cravings, but there is no evidence that is suppresses appetite or enhances libido.
A deficiency can result in mood swings, weight gain, and problems with blood circulation.
Precautions: It should not be taken by those with pigmented malignant melanoma cancer, phenylketonuria (or PKU, a genetic metabolic disorder), psychosis, or Wilson's disease (otherwise known as hepatolenticular degeneration, a rare hereditary disease chiefly characterized by a toxic buildup of copper in the organs and tissues of the body). Likewise, those taking MAO-inhibitor drugs should avoid phenylalanine, as should pregnant or lactating women. Early studies seem to indicate that phenylalanine and tyrosine encourages growth of melanomas (skin cancers — one of the most deadliest forms of cancer), and doctors usually have patients restrict their intake of these amino acids. Those with high blood pressue should only take it under the guidance of a health professional.
Some warn that the daily dosage should not exceed 2.4 grams a day. Too much phenylalanine can result in over-stimulation, nervousness, heart palpitations, high blood pressure, and irritability; if taken later in the day, it may cause insomnia. Mayell says these symptoms only occur with the "L" form, and can be avoided by reducing the dosage, switching to DLPA, or taking it only in the morning. Other symptoms include headaches and nausea.
Dosage: The RDA has not been established. It is recommended that both "D" and "L" forms be used, especially in the treatment of depression or for increased energy. A dose for 1000 to 1500 mg of DLPA may be taken in the morning without food; a second dose may be taken later in the day, this time with 100 mg of B-6, 500 mg of vitamin C, and some fruit or fruit juice to help convert the amino acid to norepinephrine. Hendler, M.D., Ph.D., recommends no more than 1.5 g/day, with 20 to 30 mg/day of vitamin B-6 (not to exceed more than 50 mg/day). Mayell advocates a more modest dose of 375 to 500 mg of the "L" form or 750 to 1000 mg of DLPA, first thing in the morning at least 30 minutes before breakfast.
Chaitow, Leon, ND, DO. The Healing Power of Amino Acids. Wellingborough, England:Thorsons Publishing Group, 1989.
Mayell, Mark. Natural Energy. New York: Three Rivers Press, 1998.
Hendler, Sheldon Saul, MD, PhD. The Doctor's Vitamin and Mineral Encyclopedia. New York: Simon and Schuster, 1990.
After typing up this phenylalanine entry, I discovered that the second result in Google for the book's name is a PDF of the book. The pages in this copy are especially long, so despite the fact that there's a page count of 55, it is in fact the entire book.
Code:
http://elearning.zaou.ac.zm:8060/Health/Encyclopedia%20of%20Mind%20Enhancing%20Foods,%20Drugs%20and%20Nutritional%20Substances%20-%20David%20W.%20Group%202000.pdf
Last edited:
the_real_drewc
Greenlighter
I just ordered some PEA today. Excited to try it out. I will be taking it without anything else, starting at 1g. Can anyone tell me what its effects are like?
bmwdriver
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2013
- Messages
- 52
I have tried PEA it was a bit weird. I took my dose of it and waited a bit, all of a sudden it felt like my body was vibrating it was pretty intense. I couldn't function that well, it really wasn't relaxing. It slowly faded away after about 12-18 minutes. I don't think I would buy any more of this for me lol.
CloudyFluffy
Ex-Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2014
- Messages
- 11
I remember buying BETA-PEA online, I ended up buying the beta because it was very cheap (thinking I was getting a good deal). note; only the beta's were cheaper than non-beta's.
experience: EVERY TIME I took it I FREAKED OUT. I felt like I was the devil walking on the earth but it was burning. it felt awful, POINTLESS IN FACT. All it does is cause a MAJOR freak out anxiety attack for 30-40 minutes. Did not feel good what so ever. its just the NAT and it sucks. you know?, feeling cold tired but scared all that stuff. POINTLESS.
my point is:
well, what I did was put under half a teaspoon of the powder into the water and drank it. AND THE EFFECTS WERE BEYOND insane. I felt so scared. I really did feel like the devil walking on a burning earth (but did not feel good. just felt so scared,bad,etc. I could not do anything).
experience: EVERY TIME I took it I FREAKED OUT. I felt like I was the devil walking on the earth but it was burning. it felt awful, POINTLESS IN FACT. All it does is cause a MAJOR freak out anxiety attack for 30-40 minutes. Did not feel good what so ever. its just the NAT and it sucks. you know?, feeling cold tired but scared all that stuff. POINTLESS.
my point is:
well, what I did was put under half a teaspoon of the powder into the water and drank it. AND THE EFFECTS WERE BEYOND insane. I felt so scared. I really did feel like the devil walking on a burning earth (but did not feel good. just felt so scared,bad,etc. I could not do anything).