Sod the jubilee!

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Why are your opinions from newspapers? My opinions are my opinions.

When I say I have opinions from every newspaper, I mean you can find my opinions in every newspaper, not that they were directly taken from there. Whereas if I wanted to know what most of BL thought I wouldn't even have to ask them, I could just pick up a Guardian. That isn't a strong indicator of someone who approaches topics without bias.

 

[Marmalade]

I fully understand there is no right and no wrong in philosophy, that is why I do not get involved in those discussions. The courses that I took in philosophy did my fucking head in. It is just mental masturbation with little purpose to me. But on topics like this - the Queen's cost, there is a right and there is a wrong. There is a figure that exists that tells you her cost, and there is a figure that exists that tells you what she makes us. I know you think ideology must underpin what everyone else does and says, because it is such a strong factor in your life, but it honestly means little to me. I am fully capable of chopping and changing from one end of the spectrum to the other.

but whether you like it or not, there's a fundamental 'philosophy' running through and alongside your debate 'techniques' and approaches, and it's often more relevant to the subject matter being discussed, simply because of what it reveals, and that ideology can make the surface discourse null and void .. or at least highlight its fundamental failings more than facts found and presented to present a viewpoint

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

no, again!

when trying to take on board other people's perspectives, personally I like to engage a little trust. it goes a huge way in helping to be open and receptive, which is crucial to this kind of thing. and when I say trust, I mean trust in a persons motive for engaging in debates or discourse, not in blind trust of the information or arguement/details they present as facts

knowing and understanding a persons intent and motivation is essentially the key to everything we've been talking about. making the effort to understand other people's is essentially the key to understanting the interpersonal and interactive micro* universe.

*micro being everything that's mainly not macro (or god n religion and science and stuff ... eh, interpersonal I mean mainly)

I find it strange that you would take that approach. My experience of most people in general is that their opinions are totally baseless and therefore worthless if you lean on them even slightly. They could well be right, but they are incapable of telling you why. I really do wish you would stop placing intentions which I do not have on my shoulders, it is just unfounded slander as far as i'm concerned. I see the point that intentions play a role in getting to the bottom of why the person believes 'x', but instead of trying to find out my intentions or trusting me when I explicitly state what they are, you just keep on ascribing them to me. This is something that greatly gets on your nerves, so it should be common curteousy for you not to do it to other people.

 

[Myshkin]

My experience of most people in general is that their opinions are totally baseless and therefore worthless if you lean on them even slightly.

Just one question, please.

Why opt to 'lean on' people's opinions and not just let them be while still expressing yours? I'm sure that's just inviting conflict, and I know all about that.

 

[Marmalade]

I really do wish you would stop placing intentions which I do not have on my shoulders, it is just unfounded slander as far as i'm concerned.

I haven't placed any intentions on your shoulders

I have merely observed that we all have intents & motivations. including you. I have observed I don't know what yours are, but that I know you have them

I mainly know what mine are. and I'm certainly open for others to point out their thoughts on them

understanding your own intent and intrinsic motivation is essential before any discourse of real value can take place

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

but whether you like it or not, there's a fundamental 'philosophy' running through and alongside your debate 'techniques' and approaches, and it's often more relevant to the subject matter being discussed, simply because of what it reveals, and that ideology can make the surface discourse null and void .. or at least highlight its fundamental failings more than facts found and presented to present a viewpoint

But that simply isn't true, and I don't know where you're getting it from. The only ideology I have is that I want to get to the truth of the matter and base my opinion on that. I didn't think "I like the Queen, i'm going to go and dig up the facts that show she is an asset to the nation". I actually thought "I hate the Queen, she is a sponging worthless bitch", then I went out and looked at the facts and discovered she is in fact an asset. All I want to do is talk about the topic at hand, without an ideology behind it. If we want to work out how to feed the planet I will look at how capitalism operates and it's success and I will look at how socialism must operate and it's success, I am not ideologically attached to anything but the best idea or solution.

 

[Mailmonkey]

I am using debate as an umbrella term for - discussion, argument, disagreement, deliberate. It needn't be formal.

No, you're not, you constantly accuse people of debating incorrectly. You've been telling us how debates should be conducted, and what the outcomes of a debate should be.

 

[swedger77]

My experience of most people in general is that their opinions are totally baseless and therefore worthless

that's all we need to know.

 

[Marmalade]

indeed swedger (and that's exactly what I'm talking about). that's the underpinning intent that makes his discourse null and void and irrelevant and pointless engaging with (well, one of them anyways, there are a lot more. we all have them, but some are more relevent than others. some don't hinder debate or discourse, some do)

it's important to tease or extract these types of motivations out though, because it just saves people a lot of bother wasting time and engaging in the first place

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Just one question, please.

Why opt to 'lean on' people's opinions and not just let them be while still expressing yours? I'm sure that's just inviting conflict, and I know all about that.

I said why in the sentence; To establish the worth of their opinion and therefore extrapolate that into changing my viewpoint if necessary. If they are just a brainless Sun reader, then there isn't likely to be much thought process going on as to why they think pedos should be given the death penalty. But on the off chance that they can justify that opinion, and change mine, it's worth a little lean. I don't just state my opinion to be heard, I want to be challenged.

 

[Mailmonkey]

that's all we need to know.

Irie. :D

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

that's all we need to know.

In that sentence it isn't implied that I do not give every single person I meet and speak to a completely fresh chance though, does it? I don't just write people off. I still probe the same faces on here, who 99/100 hold baseless opinions, on the off chance that I can catch the 1 in 100 of their opinions that is actually capable of being of intellectual worth.

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

indeed swedger (and that's exactly what I'm talking about). that's the underpinning intent that makes his discourse null and void and irrelevant and pointless engaging with (well, one of them anyways, there are a lot more. we all have them, but some are more relevent than others. some don't hinder debate or discourse, some do)

it's important to tease or extract these types of motivations out though, because it just saves people a lot of bother wasting time and engaging in the first place

Read the above post for feedback on why, yet again, you are totally wrong. The fact I have come to the conclusion that most people's opinions are of little use, does not mean I don't give everyone a fresh chance.

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

No, you're not, you constantly accuse people of debating incorrectly. You've been telling us how debates should be conducted, and what the outcomes of a debate should be.

It doesn't matter which one of those interchangable words you use, I still wouldn't mind it if people could be civilised and back up their opinions with anything but reactionary brainless bullshit.

 

[Mailmonkey]

I still probe the same faces on here, who 99/100 hold baseless opinions, on the off chance that I can catch the 1 in 100 of their opinions that is actually capable of being of intellectual worth.

that's all we need to know.

Why do you come here? Again, I'm not suggesting you leave, but I really don't understand, after all the tings you've revealed in this thread why you would want to come here.

 

[koneko]

Bloody hell its some mad hatter's tea party this!

Some of you have too much time on your hands, if you can debate to this extent please make more time to pick up litter. FFS get a grip

 

[YellowPolkaDotHalo]

agreed generally. but it was a clear example of your hypocrisy with regard to you jumping in (while telling others not to) and you asked for another example, so I gave it to you

Not a clear example at all. There are no parrallells between that little venemous episode and the rucks in the Jubilee forums.

I think you know that but if you still feel you can or want to justify what you did go for it.

I'm going out now anyway.

tuttybye all

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Why do you come here? Again, I'm not suggesting you leave, but I really don't understand, after all the tings you've revealed in this thread why you would want to come here.

Well, cunts aside - You, SHM, and Sam, I do actually get along reasonably well with a few people on here. And I do enjoy taking drugs, and my viewpoints are inline with everyone's on drug legalisation on here too. Furthermore, I refuse to be bullied off the site like so many dissenters before me.

 

[swedger77]

i think you just like to be right and suffer from verbosity. BL would be dead with out your righteousness and opinions....so crack on MSB

 

[Mailmonkey]