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Benzos Getting Restful Sleep on Clonazepam

D

Daedalus237

Greenlighter
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
15
Hello, I am new here so I apologize if I offend anyone or break any rules. i have read the rule guidelines and scanned the search to the best of my ability but haven't found the answer i'm looking for.

well, i'll begin. i'm sure we all know that benzodiazepines tend to reduce the amount of deep restful sleep (Stage 4 and 5 i believe) that will occur when a person sleeps.

i have been taking .5mg klonopin to deal with social anxiety issues, for about 3 days now. tolerance does not seem to be much of an issue (yet) however I find that i am waking up extremely groggy and have a massive headache, and tend to sleep through all my alarms. the worst instance of this effect however was when I used .1mg sublingually around 3-4 hours before bed, not taking into account the long half-life.


my question is whether there are any drugs or supplements one can take pre-bed to help produce more deep, restful sleep and counteract the benzodiazepines to some degree? I was thinking something along the lines of perhaps GABA, ZMA, and Melatonin. Also anything that can lower tolerance will help as well.

I plan to stick to my .5mg dose for a week or so, taken in the morning so that hopefully some of it's effects will be diminished by bedtime (as we all know clonazepam has a very long half-life).

thanks:D
 
I would try and use Melatonin or Valerian Root as a first course of action, as they are not habit forming in the way that benzodiazepines and Z-drugs (zolpidem tartrate and Zopiclone), and other GABAergics are. I too have a problem with sleep, and am being forced to taper off of clonazepam. While neither melatonin nor Valerian will feel as effective as say, xanax, they do help, and are more benificial than anti-histamines which also have a tendency to build tolerance and leave you feeling hung over and groggy the following morning.
 
Znegative said:
I would try and use Melatonin or Valerian Root as a first course of action, as they are not habit forming in the way that benzodiazepines and Z-drugs (zolpidem tartrate and Zopiclone), and other GABAergics are. I too have a problem with sleep, and am being forced to taper off of clonazepam. While neither melatonin nor Valerian will feel as effective as say, xanax, they do help, and are more benificial than anti-histamines which also have a tendency to build tolerance and leave you feeling hung over and groggy the following morning.
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Thanks. Just bought some Melatonin, will try it out tonight and see if it helps. Would you recommend GABA, 5HTP or L-dopa? Also just to clarify, you are saying Melatonin will help sleep in the presence of clonazepam? I have not yet taken the time to research all of the mechanisms on which Clonazepam works and various interactions, but I will as time allows.

My end goal is to be able to use it 2-3x week for social anxiety while keeping the doses low (.5-1mg) to avoid the dreaded withdrawal effects.
 
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yes, it works well with benzo's IME. Make sure you take the melatonin at the same time each night, as one of the cool things about it is that it helps reseet your circadian rythm.
 
+1^ about taking at the same time and the use of melatonin.. when i was addicted to k pins (clonazepam) i would take melatonin to help me get at least a little REM sleep throughout the night.. good luck with your intentions OP, dependence creeps up on you so be vigilant if you feel you need it to function i suggest not taking it or it will feed into addiction.
 
Thanks guys, one more question what kind of "starter" dose would you guys recommend with the melatonin, and administration method (just orally is fine)?

Regarding the tolerance, thanks, I'll do my best. I don't really need it to function per se, usually I'll force myself to do something if it is required but sometimes my anxiety gets the better of me and I'd rather just stay indoors all day.

Mostly I'm using it as a "bandaid" to help me be more social, so far it's been amazing. The other day I went to Starbucks, got a drink, sat outside and talked to some people, smoked a cigarette and checked the news on my phone while totally relaxed. Normally I would never do this, and if I do I constantly have thoughts racing through my head about how everyone is staring at me and such, how I could do this just as easily at home, etc.

I have read all the horror stories and much-dread side effects/withdrawals so I am keeping a close eye on my tolerance.

BTW I just wanted to say I'm happy to be part of this community, lurked for a while before but everyone is very courteous and informative, you can't say that about a lot of other online forums.
 
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Benzodiazepines lower sleep quality and IIRC suppress REM and deeper stages of sleep, so after a while you won't wake up feeling "rested".

Also, benzodiazepines are indicated for SHORT TERM INSOMNIA (+/-2 weeks or less), yet most people end up taking them for life, as they are extremely habit forming, lethal when combined with a strong enough CNS depressant (opiates, alcohol). You have been warned.
 
tricomb said:
Benzodiazepines lower sleep quality and IIRC suppress REM and deeper stages of sleep, so after a while you won't wake up feeling "rested".

Also, benzodiazepines are indicated for SHORT TERM INSOMNIA (+/-2 weeks or less), yet most people end up taking them for life, as they are extremely habit forming, lethal when combined with a strong enough CNS depressant (opiates, alcohol). You have been warned.
Click to expand...

I have read up on their negative properties beforehand so I do feel that I know what I am getting into (famous last words right?), but thank you for your concern. I'm actually not using it so much for insomnia as social anxiety, since the long half-life would sabotage my restorative sleep as you have mentioned. I have battled with insomnia to some degree before but nothing too crippling.
 
Using benzodiazepines for social anxiety is even worse. Take it from someone who was on Benzodiazepine therapy for over 9 years.

I've been on every benzodiazepine available in the USA, at varying doses, low, to extremely high.

It is CRIMINAL for doctors to prescribe benzodiazepines for social anxiety, but big pharma wants $$$ and to push more pills, and man, do they push these pills. Just like Big Tobacco got everyone hooked on their cancerous product, and is a Billion dollar industry. They don't care about your health, Big Pharma is no different from Big Oil, it's all about their holy dollar and what their market shares are worth.

If you are not at the point where you would be institutionalized at a psych ward due to your anxiety, then you should not be on benzodiazepines. They are for DEBILITATING anxiety, yet are handed out like candy and no doctors ever warn you what you're getting into. I doubt you'll heed my advice, I know that ten years ago I would have thought "Well, I'm different, I will use benzodiazepines in a safe way", and likely would have repeated all these mistakes that got me where I am today.

Seriously reconsider using benzodiazepines for social anxiety. I learned more about how to cope with social situations and anxiety in the year I've been off benzodiazepines than in almost a decade of benzodiazepine therapy. You have been warned.
 
tricomb said:
It is CRIMINAL for doctors to prescribe benzodiazepines for social anxiety,
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unless all other treatments have failed. I know i was prescribed benzos for anxiety but i am also bipolar so that might be why i was able to get them due to horrible anxiety accompanying my depression.. i have learned to deal with it now without them but i still can't be in crowded areas or i flip out and am like "i gotta get outta here" and those are the situations where a benzo would be nice but i just go get fresh air now.
 
Daedalus237 said:
Hello, I am new here so I apologize if I offend anyone or break any rules. i have read the rule guidelines and scanned the search to the best of my ability but haven't found the answer i'm looking for.

well, i'll begin. i'm sure we all know that benzodiazepines tend to reduce the amount of deep restful sleep (Stage 4 and 5 i believe) that will occur when a person sleeps.

i have been taking .5mg klonopin to deal with social anxiety issues, for about 3 days now. tolerance does not seem to be much of an issue (yet) however I find that i am waking up extremely groggy and have a massive headache, and tend to sleep through all my alarms. the worst instance of this effect however was when I used .1mg sublingually around 3-4 hours before bed, not taking into account the long half-life.


my question is whether there are any drugs or supplements one can take pre-bed to help produce more deep, restful sleep and counteract the benzodiazepines to some degree? I was thinking something along the lines of perhaps GABA, ZMA, and Melatonin. Also anything that can lower tolerance will help as well.

I plan to stick to my .5mg dose for a week or so, taken in the morning so that hopefully some of it's effects will be diminished by bedtime (as we all know clonazepam has a very long half-life).

thanks:D
Click to expand...

Ask to switch to something else. Clonazepam is a strong one to start of on, id be thinkin more diazepam one a day kinda thing. imo
 
tricomb said:
Using benzodiazepines for social anxiety is even worse. Take it from someone who was on Benzodiazepine therapy for over 9 years.

I've been on every benzodiazepine available in the USA, at varying doses, low, to extremely high.

It is CRIMINAL for doctors to prescribe benzodiazepines for social anxiety, but big pharma wants $$$ and to push more pills, and man, do they push these pills. Just like Big Tobacco got everyone hooked on their cancerous product, and is a Billion dollar industry. They don't care about your health, Big Pharma is no different from Big Oil, it's all about their holy dollar and what their market shares are worth.

If you are not at the point where you would be institutionalized at a psych ward due to your anxiety, then you should not be on benzodiazepines. They are for DEBILITATING anxiety, yet are handed out like candy and no doctors ever warn you what you're getting into. I doubt you'll heed my advice, I know that ten years ago I would have thought "Well, I'm different, I will use benzodiazepines in a safe way", and likely would have repeated all these mistakes that got me where I am today.

Seriously reconsider using benzodiazepines for social anxiety. I learned more about how to cope with social situations and anxiety in the year I've been off benzodiazepines than in almost a decade of benzodiazepine therapy. You have been warned.
Click to expand...

Hmm... I've been taking various benzo's now for 10 years, all in therapeutic doses and PRN. I don't want to say I'm different but I have been using them very carefully since my doctors told me that it was habit forming, and that was before I've really started reading up on them. Without benzo's my life would be even shittier than it is today and I've had a heap of therapy.

So yeah, saying that doctors are criminals and that you need to be in a psych ward if you need benzo's.. That's not true IMO.

That being said, one shouldn't rely on clonazepam, any other benzo or a z drug for sleep. And if you have real issues you should go to a doctor.
 
Daedalus237 said:
Hello, I am new here so I apologize if I offend anyone or break any rules. i have read the rule guidelines and scanned the search to the best of my ability but haven't found the answer i'm looking for.

well, i'll begin. i'm sure we all know that benzodiazepines tend to reduce the amount of deep restful sleep (Stage 4 and 5 i believe) that will occur when a person sleeps.

i have been taking .5mg klonopin to deal with social anxiety issues, for about 3 days now. tolerance does not seem to be much of an issue (yet) however I find that i am waking up extremely groggy and have a massive headache, and tend to sleep through all my alarms. the worst instance of this effect however was when I used .1mg sublingually around 3-4 hours before bed, not taking into account the long half-life.


my question is whether there are any drugs or supplements one can take pre-bed to help produce more deep, restful sleep and counteract the benzodiazepines to some degree? I was thinking something along the lines of perhaps GABA, ZMA, and Melatonin. Also anything that can lower tolerance will help as well.

I plan to stick to my .5mg dose for a week or so, taken in the morning so that hopefully some of it's effects will be diminished by bedtime (as we all know clonazepam has a very long half-life).

thanks:D
Click to expand...

I also feel this groggy effects in the morning, the effects linger for a while. The deepest sleep are stages 3 and 4 by the way. I have read studies that say it doesn't lower the quality of sleep, but its debatable.
 
I think that klonopin is like THE benzo prescribed for sleep in many cases. I know it was in mine by a neurologist but my asswhipe psych wouldn't prescribe it after a brain scan and 1 1/2 hr testing by a neurologist who recommended THIS as THE drug for my sleep problems. Your situation could be completely different though. I get crap/ next to no sleep rahter than some good sleep. thanks psychiatrist for being a dick
 
tricomb said:
Point I was making: Doctors overprescribe benzodiazepines instead of recommending actual therapy to over come the root of their problems.
Click to expand...

Doctor's WHO PRESCRIBE DRUGS might do this. Dr's who can't prescribe drugs prob recommend the ways that make THEM money, ways they are trained in. And there are pro's and con's to both.

How about going to talk therapy, exploring your childhood.... and then turning into someone with chronic homocidial ideation due to the digging around in the psyche that has been burried for 4 plus decades? Open a pandora's box much without having the way to lock it back up, let alone the foresight to see this possibly coming? And this was from a PhD which sepcialized in trauma and had decades of experience.

Threre are pro's and con's to both and some things are best left alone with a drug thrown in to keep someone stable and not a menace to society.... just food for thought on the other side of that coin bro
 
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