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Sativa psychosis and effective counter-measures

I have had psychotic symptoms for years. Before i ever did drugs. I found that decent mid (good as hell in the south nice and fresh from the border!) are the way to go cuz of the diff. chemical make up.CBD CBN, and others we prob. dont know about. Also THC thats a good one theres a decent amount but not too much. anyway i also always eat the seeds (there arent any in the bag but there are some in the buds).

Back on topic mids and eating seeds have reduced my symptoms. If I don't smoke i go crazy. but i'm still a little off...but a lot better. Damn this is some strong coffee I wasn;t planning on posting this much with my injured finger. Anyway thats just me.
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How many seeds and how often are we talking about here?

Also, I've noticed that with my psychological tendencies, overdoing caffeine tends to bring out negative symptoms. I'm calm off it or with low doses but tend to get too anxious after roughly a week of daily use. Combining sativa's and coffee seems to be especially bad.

I wonder what causes a brain to become so sensitive to stimulation like this in the first place. I guess the answer is either in the genes or environment in which one grew up in/currently lives in.
 
From what I know of the pharmacology of Cannabis, delta-9-THC is a psycho-stimulant, that is not recreationally (consciously noticeable) active on it's own. Combined w/ Cannabinoids, however, such as the main one in Cannabis; CBD (Cannabidol, a CNS depressent, and anxiolytic) the effects of weed can become enjoyable.

But now a days, growers are trying to maximize their THC content because they don't know about the pharmacology, they just think; oh, more THC, the higher you get. NOT true. In fact, if you have around 5% THC in your bud, but 35% CBD, you'll get wayyy higher and more of the positive effects of weed than you would if you smoked ganj of the opposite (35% THC and 5% CBD).

CBD is needed to counteract the negative effects of THC. CBD is not active, THC is not active; but combined they are a perfect drug, when in balance, of course.
 
Your argument would be better if you were talking about weed causing anxiety. When I take a couple months off and start smoking again I usually get really good highs and not much anxiety. I would say after a couple months of smoking some of the benefits go away and i'm more prone to getting anxious when I smoke. But I just counter that by picking strains that I know work.

What i'm trying to say is after awhile it's probably best to take a break. Some take smoking weed very lightly though and it's just like drinking a glass of water. That's usually how it is for me. It's something I don't think about. It helps me eat and get a good sleep at night so that's all that matters, music sounding better is a nice benefit to. After I feel like i'm smoking to much and am not having fun with it, I do prefer to quit for a few months. Then I know when I start again the effect will be better.

I dont agree with you Baphe, when strains have 5% thc and are high in cannaboids they tend to loose there euphoria and mainly be body highs. When strains are high in THC they are going to have more euphoria, that's when it comes down to picking strains that work for you. They all affect me differently.
 
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ProducedRaw said:
Taking a pragmatic and greedy approach to the problem (I want to have my cake and eat it too, dammit), the solution is to supplement with anti-psychotics. I previously tried to address the symptoms by supplementing with various vitamins, minerals and amino acids but they seem to treat the effects and not the causes. The most readily available anti-psychotic is probably a nice indica strain, though this is not always possible to procure. I recently found out that hemp and hemp seed oil contain significant quantities of cannabidiol, which means that there is a legal, easy to get remedy. I've already experimented with using indica strains to bring me back down after a sativa session and they work great. The psychotic symptoms of several days' worth of sativa usage can be reversed within a day of smoking an indica.
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Effective countermeasure = CBD.

Black hashes, especially handrubbed...

A 2008 study published in the British Journal of Psychiatry showed significant differences in Oxford-Liverpool Inventory of Feelings and Experiences scores between three groups: The first consisted of non-cannabis users, the second consisted of users with Δ9-THC detected, and the third consisted of users with both Δ9-THC and CBD detected. The Δ9-THC only group scored significantly higher for unusual experiences than the Δ9-THC and CBD group, whereas the Δ9-THC and CBD group had significantly lower introvertive anhedonia scores than the Δ9-THC only group and non-cannabis user group. This research indicates that CBD acts as an anti-psychotic and may counteract the potential effects of THC on individuals with latent schizophrenia.[9]
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from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabidiol

http://www.scielo.br/pdf/bjmbr/v39n4/6164.pdf

I know you have already mentioned this - just providing some extras.

I've never had a problem with it - Sativa doesn't make me go paranoid or anything, slightly edgy and overwhelmed at times, but then I just need to remember to use pranayama... but I have used pure Indicas to bring me down from Sativa dominant strains, sure. I've also used black hash to bring me down... I know someone who is schizophrenic, and he found this out by experimenting with ganja...he now only smokes black hashes, and he has no schizo episodes really.
 
If your smoking so much bud you expirience psychotic effects. You might wanna think about what you are doing. I smoke budz everyday. If i thought it was making me crazy or was expirienceing negative effects id think deeply about my current life choices. Thats just my opinion though u can do what you want.
 
Every 2nd thread on this board is about how Cannabis is supposedly "unsafe" or how people don't like it's effects and try every possible counter-measure out there to no avail. There's even a kid who claims to be physically addicted for fucks' sake.

Jesus Christ, just give it a rest and stop smoking if it isn't for you.
 
Voxide said:
Every 2nd thread on this board is about how Cannabis is supposedly "unsafe" or how people don't like it's effects and try every possible counter-measure out there to no avail. There's even a kid who claims to be physically addicted for fucks' sake.

Jesus Christ, just give it a rest and stop smoking if it isn't for you.
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Doesn't make it any less credible nor important, if you enjoy it without problem thats good but not everyone is the same.
The ignorant responses that come out of cannabis discussion are ridiculous at times.

I can relate to wanting to combat the negative effects, also to the physical addiction part.
 
Personally I don't believe in this notion that sativas are somehow psychotic and indicas the opposite. The fact is, almost everyone smoking indoor commercial weed is smoking either indicas or hybrids with indica genes in them. Why? Because indica flowers much faster, yields more bud and is just as strong if not stronger than pure(r) sativas. Indicas also grow shorter and bushier making them more suitable for indoors. Proper flowering of sativa plants can take up to 16 weeks opposed to some 8 weeks for indica. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize indicas are much, much more profitable to grow indoors.

So relatively few that say indica is better than sativa have even tried true, properly grown sativas I reckon. Unless ofcourse you're buying them from a source that sells connoiseur type weed probably for very high prices, growing your own or live in an area where there's plenty of outdoor production with the climate being suitable for pure sativas (thailand or mexico for example).

I don't believe there are big differences in the THC/CBD make up of various cannabis strains. Production of cannabinoids depends on genes and what I have read is that the genes work in a manner such that you get either high thc and low cbd (regular cannabis), low thc and high cbd (hemp) or a balanced mix of the two (certain hash strains mostly these days, used to produce hashish in poorer countries). It's simply impossible to get something like 20% thc 5% cbd. If you have 20% (or 18% or 15%) THC it automatically means there will be something like ~1% CBD, because the genes will tell the plant to produce EITHER thc OR cbd.

Sativas can be mellow as hell too, like some nice gentle thai weed. Definately not as psychotic as some of the afghan (indica) I've had. Sure it can be the other way around too, not all sativas are mellow and gentle. Therefore I do not like this generalization (or groundless mocking of sativas hehe). The most mellow smoke that would be my first choice of recommendation to a green virgin is a sativa strain, hawaiian snow.

Anyway, with modern vaporizers YOU decide how much thc and how much cbd you want to ingest by properly managing the vaporizing temperatures. You can turn 90%/10% THC /CBD weed into 50/50 THC/CBD by blowing hot but not too hot air through your plant material for a long enough time, vaporizing mostly THC (and everything with an equal or lower boiling point) leaving most of the CBD intact in the source material.

All this said, I sincerely believe there is more to this subject than different ratios of THC/CBD. Differences between certain strains can NOT be attributed simply to thc and cbd, we just don't know much about other psychoactive cannabinoids in cannabis yet.
 
I smoked quite some of charas sativa and do not developed any psychosis, for me it very relaxed near opiod experience. but previously I smoked Sativa from Mongolia, I would not recommend it to anyone with tendency with psychosis.

I have seen many people with different kind of abnormalities developed after charas, but in most cases it is cured by smocking some more charas. that fact very well recognized by local peoples.
I have seen recently one guy, he is totally in space, not orientation in time and place, remained in such state for last 3 years. not sure if it is psychosis, his face expression like frozen and very curious.

one more observation, it never happens with those who are habitual/regular user.
 
yteek said:
Doesn't make it any less credible nor important, if you enjoy it without problem thats good but not everyone is the same.
The ignorant responses that come out of cannabis discussion are ridiculous at times.

I can relate to wanting to combat the negative effects, also to the physical addiction part.
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It sort of does, because the people who actually do enjoy it end up having to sift through this garbage with no real discussion going on. Kids smoke too much and they get hypochondria. It's normal. You'd have to already be predisposed to psychosis in order to develop anything close. Not smoking as much weed might help you overcome your "physical" addiction. Just throwing that out there. If you really think you're addicted to something as menial as weed, maybe you're right. It just isn't for you. This is exactly why irresponsible people should not smoke marijuana; because no matter how seemingly harmless, someone will have 1 too many bowls and start thinking up weird conjectures that make no sense to the rest of the educated community. It's really just a buzzkill is all it is.
 
The thread title says it all though, if you don't want to read into it and call it garbage...ignore it.

There are plenty of happy go lucky marijuana topics for you to participate in and theres topics like these...I think they serve equal importance.

Just cause you're one that doesn't suffer any downsides, I don't think you should minimize the problems of others.

Thats on you though.

I believe people without any previous predisposition could easily have marijuana induced anxiety/psychosis .... its just in the nature of drug.

For some it does the opposite of whats intended, and its not always smoking too much either. Some people even after consuming minuscule amounts of cannabis still are plagued with symptoms like this.

I know when I stopped smoking...I would wake up every night with cold sweats....no appetite....and insomnia.

Some argue, but the withdrawal was physical for me.

These weren't preexisting conditions either.
 
yteek said:
I don't think you should minimize the problems of others.
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Uh, I wouldn't exactly call those "problems". It's an illegal drug. Last I checked, nobody is shoving a bong near your face and forcing you to milk it. If you don't like to smoke marijuana, a still illegal drug, you don't have to. What about the people who face psychosis without any drugs involved whatsoever? Those are problems. What you do to yourself is your own wrongdoing. Some people get red in the face and start puking after a few shots of hard alcohol. These people don't go to their doctors and ask them for advice on how to drink. They stop, because it obviously doesn't agree with them. Is the biggest problem in your life the fact that you can't comfortably smoke? Let's face it: It isn't.
 
It being illegal is really irrelevant to the discussion, its still a problem rather its substance induced or not.
Most people who suffer ill-effects aren't trying to do so to themselves....looking for solution to it seems rational.

Nobody is going to their doctor with this and some despite the obvious would like to enjoy just as much as everyone else does without giving it up.
 
yteek said:
It being illegal is really irrelevant to the discussion, its still a problem rather its substance induced or not.
Most people who suffer ill-effects aren't trying to do so to themselves....looking for solution to it seems rational.

Nobody is going to their doctor with this and some despite the obvious would like to enjoy just as much as everyone else does without giving it up.
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Nobody is being forced to smoke it either. I don't see the point of looking for a "solution" when there is no problem to begin with.
 
Of course no one is being forced, still an issue...there's people that have issues with other drugs, food, gambling, and other things that aren't forced upon but solutions aren't always this easy.

If weed does give you ill effects, of course stopping is logical.....but for some littered with occasional issues they look at it as throwing the baby out with the bath water.
 
fact is that serious mental deviations some time transit some time near permanent is possible with users of sativa, seen it too many times. I'm curious about it too, if we can try to establish some criteria or signs of development and solutions to reverse this effect that can be in some use.

besides of smoking some more and that way reversing psychotic incident acute symptoms can be controlled almost immediately by buspiron. in chronic cases LSD therapy or milder drug like TMA-2 can be a solution.

fact is that people coming back to normal life in both cases of transient psychosis and in case of chronic schizophrenia like conditions. perhaps sativa can be helpful to cure common psychosis too. it may seems like irrational but fact that LSD therapy was was working and helped 1000s of people, with no hope schizophrenia. LSD therapy initially appeared very irrational to me, what is the point to make crazy person more crazy. well there is more to it. when there is no way out there always way in.
 
ProducedRaw said:
Sauce: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/04/050419105717.htm

THC is clearly a psychosis inducing compound. It is therefore rational to assume that the primary effect of strong sativas, which have almost no cannabidiol to counter the psychotic effects, is in fact a mild psychosis. It is not unreasonable to assume that long term dosing will transform this into a moderate or even strong psychosis. We have countless anecdotes of people developing transient anxiety spectrum disorders after prolonged cannabis usage on this board.

Taking drugs to experience symptoms usually associated with mental illnesses is nothing new. They are often fun and enlightening when they are temporary. Ketamine reliably creates conditions which are similar to schizophrenia. Psychedelics do something of a similar effect. Stimulant highs are basically mania. Highs from CNS depressants resemble clinical depression. Let's stop beating around the bush and call a spade a spade.
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You sound like you're an anti-drugs aficionado and here to preach the evils of drugs to us all?
 
^well he's not that far off, too much THC makes me feel a bit crazy while low thc/high cbd usually relieve such feelings. Schizophrenia is more like a bad trip than a good one though but essentially i agree.
 
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