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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

Help Me Get Some Sleep, BL.

Phil.McKeer

Phil.McKeer

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 20, 2015
Messages
905
Question - say I'm withdrawing slightly off both low-dose, high-duration buprenorphine and low-dose, low-duration alprazolam, and have only slept ~8 hours in the last week:

I know throwing more drugs at my problems won't help me, but if the only non-opioid, non-benzo drugs I can get are zopiclone and gabapentin, which should I take to get some damn sleep? I know they both act on the GABA receptors in some way which might be counterproductive in combating benzo w/d, but insomnia is bad torture. I'm starting to hallucinate a little from lack of sleep, and there's also this magnetic ballast that won't stop buzzing 24/7 somewhere just behind my head and I'd pay anything for someone to turn it off. I have to be able to drive, and at this rate my motor reflexes are getting a little unreliable.

Note that I don't even want to get any more opioids or benzos, haven't wanted to in some time, and want to keep it that way. Would just riding this out be best in that case? Board up my windows and weather this? That would teach me a fucking damn good lesson in fucking with this stuff like I'm a man-bear-pig-god (I'm just a man - a weak man that needs to sleep). I fucking tap out, Morpheus, you asshole! Give me back my sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeep!

...

So...zopiclone? Gabapentin? Or should I try OTC first and get some melatonin and some fucking herbal teas?

Z or G? Or OTC? Or "fuck it, CT"? Help me, BL!

Edit: The first line needs a bit more detail. I was taking 0.25mgs bupe/day (something of a maintenance dose, not opioid maintenance, but depression maintenance - worked like a fucking charm, but now I have a debt to pay), and took about 0.5-1mg alprazolam a night for about a month when the bupe w/d presented so I could sleep. That bit me in the ass and for the first time ever, I think I kindled myself into benzo withdrawal by taking it too soon behind the last binge and for too long. I'm having like 25 myoclonic jerks a night when attempting to sleep, and my right hand has an intention tremor when I make precise movements with it. That's benzo w/d, right?

Edit II: I also am not planning on taking any particularly large doses of the zop/gaba, probably just a 1/2 dose, and probably just for the next 3 nights and will return to whatever awaits me on the weekend when I know I can just stay home.
 
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Fuck it, let's make this into a blog. I'm going to start with the OTC stuff first. I'm going to the store now to get some melatonin and whatever tea looks the most somnolescent. I will report back tomorrow. If I didn't sleep, I'll then try 300mg gabapentin tomorrow, and if that doesn't work, maybe, maybe, unless someone comes in here with a "Noooooooooo dooooooon't it'll kiiiiiiiiiiiiill youuuuuuuuuuuuu" then I'll go with 7.5mg zopiclone the night after that. We'll reserve that as the last resort since I'm sure zopiclone is pretty much just like the benzos in almost all aspects.

Stand by please.
 
The old school antihistamines like doxylamine usually work for me, at least on a short-term basis, although they make me wake up feeling groggy and "hungover". They knock me right the fuck out, though. Some Nyquil ("Nyquil Cough", just doxylamine + dextromethorphan, is what I use) usually does the trick.
 
Where would one begin to find uncommon weaker opiates?
I doubt direct sources are allowed but im 2 yrs off chemo and still feel half myself and the meds i get do fuk all more useless than my doc.

Ive tried searching for kratom, opium etc and no luck just a pm that could 'point' me towards a 'potenial' source im really desperate dont even feel like living these days
 
Im not gonna lie, Id consider both. Dont make a habit of it and dont redose, but the combo may relieve other symptoms other than insomnia making rest that much better.
 
Burnt Offerings said:
The old school antihistamines like doxylamine usually work for me, at least on a short-term basis, although they make me wake up feeling groggy and "hungover". They knock me right the fuck out, though. Some Nyquil ("Nyquil Cough", just doxylamine + dextromethorphan, is what I use) usually does the trick.
Click to expand...

Really? I got the wrong OTC stuff. I hit the wall with diphenhydramine (100mgs dries my sinuses and stops all the allergy-like w/d symptoms but doesn't promote any sleep at all), but I've never taken doxylamine. I'll try to find some. It's OTC right? I can't remember ever having seen it on the shelf. I would kill a minimum of seven babies right now to "wake up feeling groggy". And I'm talking good, healthy WHITE babies, not like some shitty Nigerian babies that nobody wants (sorry, Nigerian babies).

Pacman86 said:
Where would one begin to find uncommon weaker opiates?
I doubt direct sources are allowed but im 2 yrs off chemo and still feel half myself and the meds i get do fuk all more useless than my doc.

Ive tried searching for kratom, opium etc and no luck just a pm that could 'point' me towards a 'potenial' source im really desperate dont even feel like living these days
Click to expand...

Yeah we can't source here. I do hear that kratom works wonders though, provided that you find a good source and have a low enough tolerance. I was thinking about getting some, but I don't know a reliable source and it would take some days to get to me anyways, by which time I might not even want it. Also, if it binds to the opioid receptors, (although I'm not an expert on kratom and have never even used it I think it does) it will fuck with my convalescence plan.

Also, I doubt you'll be able to find any opium online, or even IRL for that matter. The vast majority of opium is used to produce heroin, which is sort of like making crack from cocaine if I understand it correctly. Very profitable. Weight is reduced for easier trafficking, and of course potency increases, and whoever runs the show "gets two birds stoned at once" as they say.

If you're trying to find a good source for kratom, I would use Google to find a website where sourcing is allowed; you'll probably find a wealth of information and reviews on kratom vendors out there. Good luck, let us know what happens. I'll be awake :-/


Kittycat5 said:
Im not gonna lie, Id consider both. Dont make a habit of it and dont redose, but the combo may relieve other symptoms other than insomnia making rest that much better.
Click to expand...

Sweet. Melatonin is either worthless as a sleep aid, or it's not strong enough for my needs, or the herbal supplement fucks that make the ones I got are packing their tablets with nothing but inert fillers and binders. That means it's gabapentin and zopiclone tomorrow. You don't think the zopiclone (or even gabapentin) will re-kindle the benzo thing going on, do you? I've never had tremors before. I feel like Muhammad Ali, and not in the cool, young way, either.


Thanks for the replies guys. As you may have guessed, I'm sitting at my computer, wide awake. I had a yawn a second ago which was very welcome, but was not accompanied by any of the other sleepy-time happenings, like sleep.

I'm going to spend an hour or so in "Best of Bluelight". That should lift my spirits a bit.

Edit: If I could just get some carisoprodol or cyclobenzaprine, this would be done. But no, I can't walk into my doctor's office and tell him what to give me. Bastard. You know what he gave me for a ruptured vertebral disc? Diclofenac. Bastard. That's actually what led me to the black market in the first place. Had he just given me codeine...just codeine...I'd never have touched heroin. Good job doc, you really saved a life there. /rant
 
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Yeah it's OTC. If diphenhydramine didn't do anything for you I'm not sure how well it'll work, but it might be worth a shot. It worked for me, anyway. It's the ingredient in "Unisom" (the non-diphenhydramine Unisom, anyway).

I've been a "sleep medicine" patient for a while (been through everything from trazodone to zolpidem to diazepam for my "condition"...zolpidem alone I took for about 2 or 3 years)...used to live in Fairbanks AK, a city that is dark as night almost 24 hours a day in the winter, so I definitely know sleep disruption and feel your pain.
 
my doctor used to prescribe me phenegran, some super strong anti-histamine, but it does potentiate opiates, so he took me off it.
mate if your suffering just reach for a bloody zopiclone and get some rest, sounds like you need it, but it is cross-tolerant with traditional benzos soooo... yeah.
 
Thanks for that, Burnt. I'll return this crappy melotonin and get some doxylamine. Worst case scenario, I'll just rotate diphenhydramine out for a little while and enjoy the renewed antihistamine properties.

Keeping, I think Phenergan is the brand name for promethazine right? I wish I could get that. I'd need a cooperative doctor for that. I can only get a limited supply of zopiclone and gabapentin through my black market pharmacist :-/

Halah, kind of. I exercise every day (and I'm usually spurred on to double the routine morning and night while in withdrawal), and I know I'm tired as hell. My legs hurt. I'm exhausted. But there's this restlessness where I know I can just spring up and do it again, and it loves to remind me it's there right when I go to bed. I can feel that exercise will start to make a difference soon, though. Many of the other symptoms seem to at least be plateauing a little. Unfortunately, my back pain makes me a bit of a shitty runner, and I don't have a gym membership ATM otherwise I'd be swimming laps or be in the sauna right now. Gods, I wish I was in a sauna right now. I'd even dive right now if I could.

Previously, it was always my experience that I couldn't go without sleep for more than two days, and that I'd enter a deep sleep eventually if I did. I know this is coming, I just don't know when. And it's so weird...during the day, I almost feel fine, just tired from lack of sleep, maybe runny nose, maybe a little depressed and overly emotional. It's at night when the physical symptoms get all crazy.
 
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^ yep that's prometh, its actually an OTC med here in the UK (pharmacist's discretion), but i got a Rx for it anyway. how about hydroxyzine?
 
Hydroxyzine. My dude! I will find it. Looks like its OTC in the US. I'll try to get some once that bastard sun is up. Now...get some sleep!
 
Hydroxyzine works wonders imo for sleep but don't overdo it. As it is antihistamine the effects are dose relative. Smaller doses for sleep and larger for others.
 
Alright, I now have approximately 3 grams of gabapentin, 40mgs of zolpidem (NOT zopiclone), and 40mgs of cyclobenzaprine.

I just ate 20mgs of the cyclobenzaprine.

That should knock me out.

Any glaring potential contraindications I should be aware please let me know. Thanks guys. I think I'm going to finally sleep tonight. I can feel it!

Edit: Don't try 20mg of flexiril at home, kids. I've taken that stuff plenty of times so I knew how much I could take safely, and anyways I took 10mg first, waited about 2 hours, and then took the other 10mg. Note that 20mg is a double dose, so if you have no experience with this substance, start with 10mg or even less and wait. It may be enough.
 
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That was nice. I hibernated. Four stars.

Mods can either close this thread, or if they don't, what I'll do is I'll take nothing tonight and see what happens. I'm guessing I'll only get a couple hours of sleep. If I'm right, I'll just deal with it, and then the next night I'll try either gabapentin or the zolpidem and report back. At the end, I'll grade each one for posterity's sake.
 
Phil.McKeer said:
That was nice. I hibernated. Four stars.

Mods can either close this thread, or if they don't, what I'll do is I'll take nothing tonight and see what happens. I'm guessing I'll only get a couple hours of sleep. If I'm right, I'll just deal with it, and then the next night I'll try either gabapentin or the zolpidem and report back. At the end, I'll grade each one for posterity's sake.
Click to expand...

I have tried Benzos and Z drugs and Seroquel is the only thing that puts me out 12.5 to 25 mg for first time. I am not sure you want to go that route, but it's the only thing that works for me.
 
Phil.McKeer said:
Question - say I'm withdrawing slightly off both low-dose, high-duration buprenorphine and low-dose, low-duration alprazolam, and have only slept ~8 hours in the last week:

I know throwing more drugs at my problems won't help me, but if the only non-opioid, non-benzo drugs I can get are zopiclone and gabapentin, which should I take to get some damn sleep? I know they both act on the GABA receptors in some way which might be counterproductive in combating benzo w/d, but insomnia is bad torture. I'm starting to hallucinate a little from lack of sleep, and there's also this magnetic ballast that won't stop buzzing 24/7 somewhere just behind my head and I'd pay anything for someone to turn it off. I have to be able to drive, and at this rate my motor reflexes are getting a little unreliable.

Note that I don't even want to get any more opioids or benzos, haven't wanted to in some time, and want to keep it that way. Would just riding this out be best in that case? Board up my windows and weather this? That would teach me a fucking damn good lesson in fucking with this stuff like I'm a man-bear-pig-god (I'm just a man - a weak man that needs to sleep). I fucking tap out, Morpheus, you asshole! Give me back my sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeep!

...

So...zopiclone? Gabapentin? Or should I try OTC first and get some melatonin and some fucking herbal teas?

Z or G? Or OTC? Or "fuck it, CT"? Help me, BL!

Edit: The first line needs a bit more detail. I was taking 0.25mgs bupe/day (something of a maintenance dose, not opioid maintenance, but depression maintenance - worked like a fucking charm, but now I have a debt to pay), and took about 0.5-1mg alprazolam a night for about a month when the bupe w/d presented so I could sleep. That bit me in the ass and for the first time ever, I think I kindled myself into benzo withdrawal by taking it too soon behind the last binge and for too long. I'm having like 25 myoclonic jerks a night when attempting to sleep, and my right hand has an intention tremor when I make precise movements with it. That's benzo w/d, right?

Edit II: I also am not planning on taking any particularly large doses of the zop/gaba, probably just a 1/2 dose, and probably just for the next 3 nights and will return to whatever awaits me on the weekend when I know I can just stay home.
Click to expand...
Damn Phil! 8 hours sleep in a week? I guess u just got some flexeril sleep too :)
 
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