benzos...

[smokeymcpot42088]

so, I've finally found myself over my head, an inevitability really. Especially with the one for you one for you one for me attitude. To get straight to the point I've managed to become addicted to the equivalent of between 17 and 30 mg a day of clonazolam, this little foray has lasted nearly two years with etizolam coming before this.

Now of course I was a much more clever cat than those who would order the pellets and blotters. It was all powder, well liquid first but it was quickly realized that my source was getting powder PG'ing it and doubling the price. I am no chemist but for half the price of what I was paying, and a 1/10th of what the pellet people were paying, hell I was getting this for a song. The whole time I'm sure someone was laughing as I got more clever I could afford more for myself having a habit of 70mg clonazOLAM a day. Well the source is dry, he plans not to fuck with this anymore do to publicity and im left with about a 5g bag of flubromazolam which was my parachute given it's extremely high half life.

initial testing indicates I can go as low as 17 c-lam (I know that is very bad but I have descended from 70 and am fairly confident I can survive this) but I cannot stay at 17 currently, 22-23mg ish is what currently is sustaining with no pain but no buzz.

What do you guys recommend F-lam dose wise considering 5 g is what I have to work with.

 

[manboychef]

I would highly suggest doing this under a doctors supervision...be honest about it...not the f-lam or anything...but you are in the risk of death category of dependence.

 

[GregSmith20]

In that case I guess just say your dependent and need to taper off.

 

[Mmp85]

I would suggest a medical detox, at this point I'm not even sure if tapering would be safe.
I went to rehab for alcohol but I had a low benzo script that I never abused and took even less than as prescribed because it was "daily as needed" and I wasn't even always taking it daily but they still told me I had enough in my system that it was dangerous not to give me detox meds.
Now that could have been the kind of bullshit rehabs feed you but a medical detox would get you off the benzos quicker than tapering on your own from such a large amount.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

Edit* I don't mean to be one of those guys that asks for suggestions than doesn't take them but ive kicked dope before (i know this is harder) but I am making progress. Just dilute more and have trusted person administer same amount.

I respect both of your opinions but right now my reputation is golden and I don't want to red flag myself at the hospital. Im down to 15. Than again the scale is + - 5 mg on 150. ^That sounds very conservative but probably the best way. I have a script to klonopin 3 mg a day, my goal of course being to taper low enough that the 3 mg of klonopin a day keeps me from seizures. Obviously there are hard times ahead but I'd really like to keep it in the family so to speak.

 

[GregSmith20]

If you acknowledge that your at risk of seizures I wouldn't risk it. It's more than seizures too. You could have a protracted withdrawal of sorts that could last up to a year.
I don't think it's worth it just to hide your habit.
And if you are going to do it on your own then maybe you should get more to work with.

I mean your plan seems well intentioned and maybe honorable but you might regret it later. That's how I felt.

If you don't have any mental health problems than youll likely fare better than some others.
But there's Benzo forums where people are talking about experiencimg withdrawal symptoms for years.

I think the tougher your withdrawl is the harder it is to get back to normal. Your putting your chemical structure through a lot when you go at it hard like that.

I am biased on this topic based on my beliefs of what happened to me but I'm not the only one who's saying to be cautious here.
Things may not just go back to normal after the drugs leave your body.

I dont mean to encourage you to take more drugs I'm just saying there's more to it then you might expect.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

For YEARS! That I was not aware of, however I do have a 3 mg clonazepam prescription, I feel like if I could get down to 2-3 mgs of this than the switch would be quite doable, currently at 15 mg a day and not feeling great but not that heavy opiate withdrawal nor the twitchy emotional benzo withdrawal either, stages before either of those. I guess since I didn't really listen too well this is more of a journal at this point. I plan on acquiring more but you can imagine what this has done to my funds.

You don't seem bias and cautious is the the very least I will. That years thing spooks me but it is what it is i suppose, the clonazepam should keep the serious serious w/d at bay as long as I taper right.

 

[THECATINTHEHAT]

The only sensible answer here is going to the doctor and being 100% honest about the situation.

I don't think you realise just what serious shit you are in if the goods you have been buying are anywhere close to pure. At this stage if you get to the other side of this with the worse thing that happens to you being a red flag on your medical records then you should get down on your knees and pray for thanks. Getting clean from any benzo addiction is unbelievably hard and frankly something of a life changing experience. Getting clean from a habit of the size you claim to have is a gargantuan undertaking, it will dominate your existence for years most likely.

Seriously, think long and hard about this.

 

[GregSmith20]

Yeah so I just want to again highlight that people who use benzos (legitamately or not) for long periods or in high doses (basically if you develop a dependence) can experience years of difficulties either trying to come off or from discontinuation.

I think it causes changes in your brain and it can be pretty significant.

I still have troubles I associate with quiting alcohol and benzos five years ago. I did not taper either of them.

I started psych meds at age 13 though so I might not be the typical example.

I did not consume/overuse/abuse benzos daily for but a few months (less than 3 I'd say) before I developed a dependence.

 

[GregSmith20]

So how exactly do you feel at 15mg would you say?
That's a pretty quick drop from 70.

No Pain but no buzz doesn't sound terrible..
Even a bit of comfort or buzz probably wouldn't hurt if you're able to do it. Just treat it like medicine that you need for the time being... but not forever.

 

[Soulgasm]

On one hand, what you're doing is pretty dangerous and you should at least have a knowledgeable third party overseeing things. On the other, I doubt they'd be able to give you anywhere near enough benzodiazepines to come off a 70mg/day clonazolam habit (Jesus tittyfucking christ that's a lot!) or even the 15mg you're at in any inpatient setting. 15mg clam is roughly equivalent to 40mg clonazepam ime. Rock and a hard spot.

Be fucking careful man. It's gonna take a while to stabilize on 3mg clonazepam a day. At least have a super solid support system and some oversight so you're not all alone in this. I'm not in any position to be handing out taper plans but I'd suggest you make something solid and stick to it. Get one of those weekly dose dispensers. And some gabapentin. Godspeed man.

 

[jl82]

Hi first off I'd just like to say (as others have done) to definitely try and seek a professional's opinion and expertise as that will be infinitely helpful and will tailor their care to you specifically.

For your case it's pretty big... as the above says, 15mg clonazolam roughly equals 40mg clonazepam (if we assume 1mg clonazolam is about 3x potent as clonazepam - again this can differ in others). I myself have tapered from clonazolam but from a much lower daily dose - I just didn't want to be on it anymore. Next year I have to work and thus drive so I wanted to be off clonazolam.

I spoke to my friend, who is a qualified doctor and working towards her residency - she's an old online friend and one I rely on absolutely. She said that it is advisable to taper down by 20-25% of your original dose every 1-2 days. So for me - I took about 4-6mg clonazolam daily; I stated I wanted to use diazepam as a taper as it has a longer half life. So we did some calculations; 4-6mg clonazolam = roughly 12-18mg clonazepam daily.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/bzequiv.htm Here's an equivalence table.

0.5mg clonazepam = 10mg diazepam so 1mg clonazepam = 20mg diazepam. This meant I was taking about 240-360mg diazepam daily. My eyes almost bulged out my head. Anyways I had some diazepams 20mg, quite a lot of it, and have been tapering with diazepam ever since. I reduce my diazepam dose by about 20-25% of 240mg every day, and at the moment I am making progress. Some days have been harder than others; the shakes, the brain zaps, the jitteriness, insomnia, anxiety, etc - and she said that I could take an extra 10mg diazepam on those days. I elected not to but that option is there.

So I guess my conclusion is pretty inconclusive, I'd say:
- It's different for everyone
- Definitely try to seek advice from a pro; if not, then do you have any friends who are qualified doctors?
- Definitely don't do it cold turkey. You would risk stuff like seizures and that is nasty nasty nasty.
- It's definitely possible, it's not a short term fix it's more like a long and winding road but I am hopeful you will feel much better at the end of it.
- I've found it helpful to taper using one benzo (diazepam) rather than the clonazolam, but my friend says that it is beneficial, if in case you need it, to have an emergency stash in case it all goes balls-up, but that is up to you.
- I've found that keeping a diary of my dosage regimen is helpful both in marking my progress and also to double check I am tapering on a steady level!
- But mainly: TAPER TAPER TAPER!

Best of luck, and happy holidays!

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

J82--Thank you for all of your advice, a slight backslide due to holiday stress I think I will do what is usually best and listen to my BL community......but like soulgasm said, noones gunna believe my tolerance is almost 60 klonopins a day, a red flag is one thing, a red flag and like 30 1 mg ativans to "taper with" is a double screw and truly what I am most worried about. red flags go up I can't get my other ish cuz now there staring at me checking my levels and expect me to be taking.....well I seriously doubt there gunna toss me 60 kpins a day for a week, than 55 the next week and so forth?

Yes rock and a Hard Place. Oh I thought I was so smart to. " i have like 10 thousand klonopins worth muahhahahah" and the b side.

Greg Smith 20- I'm afraid that is the only plausible option, a third person has them in a safe and gives me my dose and I'm sorry if I mislead you Greg, it took about three four months to get from 70 to 15, although lately the holidays have had that more like 20-30.

I think I'm in uncharted waters and you can all watch and learn what happens to dummies. just LEARN.

the journal of doses taken that day will help alot I think, Thanks! I seeked advice from a professional and they told me id be dead if i took that much. and im like mofo wanna see it and as you can imagine i was told to leave. (old family friend, I think he thought i was tryin to doc shop him on an epic level lol)

Hey Happy Holidays World.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

TheCatinTheHat-- Believe me I know the seriouslness of my situation....next few years are is going to be horrible but i can't walk into a detox center and tell them I take the equivalent to 40-60 some kpins a day. They are gunna send me into seizures. (at least around here.) (never believe it) or write me up in the paper and i'll be the douche that gets this shit on the map and id rather die.

I agree if a red flag is all I end up with than I am a lucky lucky fool.

Now I do not intend to get myself locked in a junkie pen getting clonodine and 2 xanax a day and being told im fine. Have you ever heard of such an extreme case and how was it handled if so?

absolutely on board for tapering with higher halflife drugs.

WELL AWARE OF THE SEIZURES and they are of course my main concern. I dont wanna go out twitching kickin buckets in a hospital bed or at home. MERRY XMAS to the christians. Sorry about the 3 posts in a row.

 

[Morrisseyjunkie]

Damn you folks. I've taken 150 0.5mg. Klonopins with the intent of falling asleep and not waking up. I woke up alright. 15 days later in the ICU after being in a coma. The point is. All it did was make me very uncoordinated and very very sleepy. Till my friend found me face down in the living room. I still take Klonopin at a safer more effective therapeutic dose. 1mg. In the morning and 2mg. In the evening. Then in the evening I smoke pot. Like till i'm really baked. Best way to enjoy a chill night.

 

[jl82]

TheCatinTheHat-- Believe me I know the seriouslness of my situation....next few years are is going to be horrible but i can't walk into a detox center and tell them I take the equivalent to 40-60 some kpins a day. They are gunna send me into seizures. (at least around here.) (never believe it) or write me up in the paper and i'll be the douche that gets this shit on the map and id rather die.

I agree if a red flag is all I end up with than I am a lucky lucky fool.

Now I do not intend to get myself locked in a junkie pen getting clonodine and 2 xanax a day and being told im fine. Have you ever heard of such an extreme case and how was it handled if so?

absolutely on board for tapering with higher halflife drugs.

WELL AWARE OF THE SEIZURES and they are of course my main concern. I dont wanna go out twitching kickin buckets in a hospital bed or at home. MERRY XMAS to the christians. Sorry about the 3 posts in a row.

Hey Smokey hope you had a good holidays, hows your progress ?

Im from the UK so I have zero understanding of what will happen if you go detox centres (would they not taper you down professionally??) but yes because of the amount of clonazolam you actually took it's... really off the charts. I don't know it works across the pond but I don't think here we get prescriptions for RC chemicals. I spoke to my friend - and I do trust her absolutely but take of that what you will - and she said you can take clonazolam to taper, or if you can't get diazepam, then maybe diclazepam is quite cheap to buy isn't it? It's just that I stressed that when I was tapering I did not want to buy anything new to save the temptation, but I do believe diclazepam has a t1/2 of about 42-45h. NB: Diclazepam rumoured to be 5-10x potent as diazepam? About 3 days ago I was on 300mg diazepam/day - now I am on 150mg/day. Still a long way to go and still some shitty days (and the alcohol consumed at xmas probably has confounded this) but thats just my personal experience.

Sorry for waffling because I am quite unfamiliar with your healthcare system but if you cannot get any professional help then tapering with the longer t1/2 drugs seems like a sensible idea and from a personal experience it is working for me. Keeping a diary for me has been super helpful too just to keep on top of what you've taken for the day. You sound like you really wanna go into it with a sensible programme so best of luck with that. Just make sure you have enough pills on hand for this, and - most difficultly- don't feel tempted to beyond your daily dose on the taper.

If you need any specifics to your case answered just let me know I'll ask my friend again because I'm not a doctor (training to be a pharmacist haha) so I can kind of only offer limited info/knowledge and personal experience, but I hope some of it helps somewhat! happy holidays!

 

[jl82]

Damn you folks. I've taken 150 0.5mg. Klonopins with the intent of falling asleep and not waking up. I woke up alright. 15 days later in the ICU after being in a coma. The point is. All it did was make me very uncoordinated and very very sleepy. Till my friend found me face down in the living room. I still take Klonopin at a safer more effective therapeutic dose. 1mg. In the morning and 2mg. In the evening. Then in the evening I smoke pot. Like till i'm really baked. Best way to enjoy a chill night.

Sorry to hear about this Morrissey thats a lot of klonopins! Hope you are feeling much better today, have you had the chance to talk to anyone about it? Take care friend

 

[thelung]

I would highly suggest doing this under a doctors supervision...be honest about it...not the f-lam or anything...but you are in the risk of death category of dependence.

I agree 100%. You're on such a high dose that you're risking death if you don't do a medically supervised withdrawal . be careful man..

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

Hey, sorry to bring this thread back from the dead but I have tapered down to 7 clonazepams a day with a prescription of 4 per day. This is all the way from 70mg a day clonazolam about 3 years ago when the nbomes were big.........It is possible. Follow the Ashton guide and keep a steady supply. Right now this problem can be fixed with money and willpower but once those windows close....(not saying I'm ok now, well aware 7 mg of clonazepam isn't nothing, but no doctor supervision and I have gone from 70 clonazolam. (yes vendor was legit, sent to lab, etc etc) SO YOU CAN DO IT!

 

[Larimar]

Wondering how op made out ?