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Opioids How bad is opiate withdrawal ?

That's like comparing indigestion to a heart attack. Sure, both can make your chest hurt, but one is way more severe. The flu does not come with the worst depression ever, either.
 
LOL I think we can close this thread now. Unless we want another 100 posts of...."NO IT'S NOT, IT'S THE WORST EVER". Yeah it's pretty bad, but we brought it on ourselves. Just detox and you won't have to worry about it. If you aren't disciplined enough to detox then be ready to suffer your own consequences...
 
People who do not have first hand experience with addiction or treating addicts spread myths like this. The 'it's like a bad flu' line is a watered down version of the same idea.

Opioid acute withdrawal syndrome is a unique physical and psychological condition that cannot be compared to anything. It is in its own category.

Panic inducing paranoia and anxiety, suicidal obsessions, shitting your pants, unable to lie down still or sleep for days at a time, etc.

You know, typical flu-like symptoms 8)

EDIT:

To add, people like the author of your lovely book are promoting (consciously or not) the debunk "moral model of addiction". The theory that drug addiction is a moral failure, a sign of immorality, anti-social behavior, psychosis, deviency and degeneracy, lack of will power, lack of inner strength, etc.

The idea that withdrawal syndrome is in fact not very serious promotes this debunk moral model by trying to remove the physiological aspects of addiction.

If withdrawal isn't that bad or serious, then opioid addiction isn't really a physical or psychological dysfunction/illness-disease. That means, to them, that it is proof that addiction is a moral failure, sign of immorality, etc.

The disease model of addiction is the currently most accepted theory to modern science. In other words, that book you've got is good for toilet paper and little else. Anti-addict propaganda, dehumanizing police-state promoting bullshit.

Yeah it's pretty bad, but we brought it on ourselves. Just detox and you won't have to worry about it. If you aren't disciplined enough to detox then be ready to suffer your own consequences...

You have no idea what you are talking about. Refer to the above about he moral model.

If 'detox' were the "cure" for opioid addiction, why do people relapse? Continue to feel physiological cravings and delayed acute withdrawal symptoms? Continue to display tolerance to doses of narcotics for months?

Oh of course, it mustn't be a physical / physiological disease, it has to be simply a moral failure and lack of willpower. If only you were a good enough person, you could force your body and mind to act in a white heterosexual Protestant fashion as God intended.
 
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Yeah it's pretty bad, but we brought it on ourselves. Just detox and you won't have to worry about it. If you aren't disciplined enough to detox then be ready to suffer your own consequences...

Are you serious? We brought it on ourselves so it's no big deal? If you smoke cigarettes and get cancer it's no big deal, suffer the consequences. :|
 
I wouldn't wish withdrawal on my WORST enemy's. its a HORRIBLE feeling.

thats how bad it is....
 
People who do not have first hand experience with addiction or treating addicts spread myths like this. The 'it's like a bad flu' line is a watered down version of the same idea.

Opioid acute withdrawal syndrome is a unique physical and psychological condition that cannot be compared to anything. It is in its own category.

Panic inducing paranoia and anxiety, suicidal obsessions, shitting your pants, unable to lie down still or sleep for days at a time, etc.

You know, typical flu-like symptoms 8)

EDIT:

To add, people like the author of your lovely book are promoting (consciously or not) the debunk "moral model of addiction". The theory that drug addiction is a moral failure, a sign of immorality, anti-social behavior, psychosis, deviency and degeneracy, lack of will power, lack of inner strength, etc.

The idea that withdrawal syndrome is in fact not very serious promotes this debunk moral model by trying to remove the physiological aspects of addiction.

If withdrawal isn't that bad or serious, then opioid addiction isn't really a physical or psychological dysfunction/illness-disease. That means, to them, that it is proof that addiction is a moral failure, sign of immorality, etc.

The disease model of addiction is the currently most accepted theory to modern science. In other words, that book you've got is good for toilet paper and little else. Anti-addict propaganda, dehumanizing police-state promoting bullshit.



You have no idea what you are talking about. Refer to the above about he moral model.

If 'detox' were the "cure" for opioid addiction, why do people relapse? Continue to feel physiological cravings and delayed acute withdrawal symptoms? Continue to display tolerance to doses of narcotics for months?

Oh of course, it mustn't be a physical / physiological disease, it has to be simply a moral failure and lack of willpower. If only you were a good enough person, you could force your body and mind to act in a white heterosexual Protestant fashion as God intended.
As a user for over 7 years on and off, I have some idea of what I'm talking about. And anyone who thinks they have addiction figured out is wrong. Yes, IMO you bring it on yourself...no one forced you to try heroin. I'm not sure if you were raised under a rock but I was told from day one that heroin is an addicting drug. If someone decides to smoke cigarettes and gets cancer from it then yes, they brought that on themselves. If someone eats fat foods all their life and gets diabetes, they suffer from their own consequences. Opiates aren't in some special category. Yes, it's very addicting. But we chose to use it...so we should be prepared to stop if needed. Even people who use it in a hospital, if they take it like their doctor prescribes...they usually come of fine. Before I even started personal use I got prescribed MS Contin for an injury resulting from a terrible car accident I was in. I never got addicted, and I used for over 3 months..the doctor detoxed me off. He wasn't there to make sure I took the right dose, I just followed his instructions. Withdraw is bad, but the cravings don't stop me from living my life. And don't give me this..."oh your habit probably wasn't as big as mine". I've been through full blown withdraws from heroin use, and they were terrible. That's why I've learned to detox. I hate how some heroin addicts feel like it's impossible to detox themselves because it's heroin, and it's too tough. Well I used to smoke cigarettes and that was harder for me to stop, it had way more mental cravings. So why is it impossible to detox heroin and come offf? Yes, it's very tempting to relapse...and I do sometimes. But then I come off again. I still have cravings for cigarettes, but I don't smoke. Is that not willpower? Or is heroin just so special it's "impossible" not to hold yourself back. You asked me why do people relapse. Umm gee...I don't know, because they give in? And I know all about post acute withdrawl symptoms. Personally, substances like weed, which I don't consider all that bad, work wonders for this problem. And don't get me wrong, I don't think heroin addicts are weak or don't have willpower. But I do think it's possible to overcome those cravings yourself, and I don't think opiates are much harder than nicotine. I know some people who actually stop having cravings after a year or so. But what do I know, I'm not specially trained in addiction...I guess I'm just some amazing human who was able to quit opiates and go on and off with it. And don't tell me I don't have an addictive personality; quitting wasn't any easier for me than it is for other people.
 
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^ Again you make tons of assumption what everyone should be similar to you. Last summer guy killed himself rather then facing ct in jail. Lets all spit on him and say what a pussy with zero willpower .. not. It's different for everyone and it's TERRIBLE. Cig's can't be compared not having cigs doesn't make people steal, cut out their antagonist implants, do anything to get their fix. Everyone is different and some have it a lot harder with withdrawals then others.

Also comparing it to flu is retarded, I mean even explosive vomiting and diarrhea are not worth mentioning compared to mental part. And getting trough physical part is terribly easy compared to what comes next, yet it's infinitely worse then "very bad case of flu".

Every wd makes me die a bit inside.
 
newbie I simply disagree with you entirely. There are numerous 'models of addiction', that is ways it is explained or interpreted. You seem to be mismashing different theories (that are opposed to one another) in a strange way that seems to only explain your own personal experience.

I've never met an addict who did not take personal responsibility for their use. I've never met anyone who ever said, "It's not my fault. Because of X reason, I use. It's X's fault, not mine".

But accepting personal responsibility is completely different from the moral model (although some users do this and put a shit load of guilt and self-loathing on top of the already horrible challanges of addiction).

The chipping you describe shows lack of will power if you are following the moral model. If it took willpower to quit, why do you lack the will power not to use again? It doesn't follow.

Some advocates of the disease model like to put it all on the physiology and say it is inevitable that people relapse, or cannot detox, etc. This is just as irresponsible as saying all addicts lack moral fiber and willpower.

The physiological changes to mind and body are not the same for everyone, and depending on an individuals neurotransmitter system, environmental background, current socio-economic status, and every other variable in their lives, it is impossible to put blanket statements about 'willpower' and 'this is how bad withdrawal is' etc concerning addiction.

Suicide rates are much higher for current and former opioid addicts than they are for the general population. Which model do you think explains this better? Is this because addicts in general do not have moral fiber or will power and are anti-social/psychotic individuals, or is it because of the drastic physiological changes to mind and body that occur due to opioid addiction? I really am curious.
 
I've cold turkeyd off codeine and it sucked ass.. no sleep, constant shiting, can't stay still, restless legs, pains and cramps... i'm currently tapering off methadone, and i'm hoping that the taper will be bearable, but from what i've read, even tapering methadone sucks...
 
Yes, IMO you bring it on yourself...no one forced you to try heroin.

Your forgetting that many, many people are physically dependent on opiates/oids WELL before they ever touch heroin.

Heroin tends to be "the end of the line".

I would argue in this case, that it is no free choice. You think that somebody deep in WD has a realistic chance of saying no to H?

If someone decides to smoke cigarettes and gets cancer from it then yes, they brought that on themselves. If someone eats fat foods all their life and gets diabetes, they suffer from their own consequences. Opiates aren't in some special category.

Wait.

You're comparing smack addiction to cigarettes and fat people?

I'm actually speechless.

I don't think heroin addicts are weak or don't have willpower. But I do think it's possible to overcome those cravings yourself, and I don't think opiates are much harder than nicotine. .

The fact that you are lumping Heroin addiction alongside smoking and over-eating, suggests that you do think H addicts are weak and have no willpower. You think addicts live the fucking nightmarish existence that they do for an addiction that is no harder to quit than giving up smoking or eating burgers?

Like Tchort, I disagree completely with everything you say.
 
People who do not have first hand experience with addiction or treating addicts spread myths like this. The 'it's like a bad flu' line is a watered down version of the same idea.

Opioid acute withdrawal syndrome is a unique physical and psychological condition that cannot be compared to anything. It is in its own category.

Panic inducing paranoia and anxiety, suicidal obsessions, shitting your pants, unable to lie down still or sleep for days at a time, etc.

You know, typical flu-like symptoms 8)

EDIT:

To add, people like the author of your lovely book are promoting (consciously or not) the debunk "moral model of addiction". The theory that drug addiction is a moral failure, a sign of immorality, anti-social behavior, psychosis, deviency and degeneracy, lack of will power, lack of inner strength, etc.

The idea that withdrawal syndrome is in fact not very serious promotes this debunk moral model by trying to remove the physiological aspects of addiction.

If withdrawal isn't that bad or serious, then opioid addiction isn't really a physical or psychological dysfunction/illness-disease. That means, to them, that it is proof that addiction is a moral failure, sign of immorality, etc.

The disease model of addiction is the currently most accepted theory to modern science. In other words, that book you've got is good for toilet paper and little else. Anti-addict propaganda, dehumanizing police-state promoting bullshit.



You have no idea what you are talking about. Refer to the above about he moral model.

If 'detox' were the "cure" for opioid addiction, why do people relapse? Continue to feel physiological cravings and delayed acute withdrawal symptoms? Continue to display tolerance to doses of narcotics for months?

Oh of course, it mustn't be a physical / physiological disease, it has to be simply a moral failure and lack of willpower. If only you were a good enough person, you could force your body and mind to act in a white heterosexual Protestant fashion as God intended.



great post .....
 
i regularly withdrwl from oc's and loratabs....anyways, i think i've done it so many times that i really don't even get sick anymore, no shit...i can eat 3 oc40's a day for 3 or 4 days strait and the next day i don't have any, i'm just sluggish and depressed, not sick....back when i used to withdrawl from dope, i was a fucking wreck. if i did it at my house, i needed vicodin or some kind of tapering pill or i just wouldn't be able to do it....coming off a 10-15 bag a day habit, i was hospitalized and i didn't sleep for 2 fucking weeks, even with sleep meds...i would be tired as hell, but just could not sleep...not to mention the vomiting and shitting my brains out for the whole first week.
 
also there is a thing i like to call a 3 day rule.....if you don't want to WD, stop doing dope after the second day, take a day off and then start again..2 days at a time....easier said than done, that's for sure, but it used to work for me until the levi broke and i became a wildman.
 
I've cold turkeyd off codeine and it sucked ass.. no sleep, constant shiting, can't stay still, restless legs, pains and cramps... i'm currently tapering off methadone, and i'm hoping that the taper will be bearable, but from what i've read, even tapering methadone sucks...

i think if it's a medical taper you should be ok, not bad at all...but from what i heard, if you quit cold turkey it's worse than dope...i was on methadone before and quit going to the clinic because i wanted to get high again...stupid mistake..follow through with getting clean
 
I've never met an addict who did not take personal responsibility for their use. I've never met anyone who ever said, "It's not my fault. Because of X reason, I use. It's X's fault, not mine".

Are you kidding? I've seen it all the time, people shooting their RX'ed pills blaming their physician for not psychically seeing through their lies that keep getting their dose upped. "Its that damn quack's fault I'm like this because he keeps prescribing!"

Hell remember that ridiculous article written by a pod addict, he blamed e**y for his addiction, even saying as long as e**y sells pods his relapse is guaranteed.
8)
 
Sorry, I was specifically talking about Heroin addicts I've met. I don't have much experience with opioid addicts who abuse prescription narcotics or quasi-legal poppy straw.
 
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