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How many Aust BLs inject (IV/IM) drugs recreationally?

Cosmic Mist

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 24, 2002
Messages
1,510
How many Bluelighters?

Ok, this is something i have been wondering for a little while now. WHat i want to know is as follows:

How many Australian bluelighters IV or IM drugs for recreational purposes?

I was just wondering this as i read one of the american forums and realised that i have never come across any BLer, who i knew was and aussie, discussing their IV/IM use.

Obviously there are people in aus who do use this method to obtain their hi, but i have never even heard a reference to it in the Aus forums of BL. :\

If this thread topic has already been discussed, or is against the guidelines in some way, then i apologise :)
 
I'm going to scoot this over to Aus Drug Discussion for you as it probably fits better over there.

I have IV'd once and IM'd twice. I'm not much for needles and all times had somebody else administer the shots for me. It is definitely not my preferred method of administration and at the end of the day my phobia for needles overrules the sweeter high achieved, although I can see myself IMing again as long as I had a partner whom I trusted to administer for me.

I have many friends (non-bluelighter though) that IV almost every time. It's not my thing, never really has been. My philosophy of try anything once was what got me to try it and I'm happy I can say that I tried it and it's not for me, anybody who I've spoken to about my IV experience will recall that I couldn't shake the "dirty" feeling.

As for not hearing a reference of it... amongst most people I know, administration through IV and IM is looked down upon as the "junkie way". It seems to be that line that many users draw, they can be total addicts, using everyday and stealing/whoring themselves for the drug but as long as they're not sticking themselves they feel as if they're not totally written off.

That's not my view on it at all, but it is a common one amongst many groups of my friends. I know people who instantly change their opinion of a person as soon as they hear that they IV meth and lets not even get started on what they say when they find out someone has or does IV harry.

It definitely does happen in Australia and it probably happens amongst Australian bluelighters more than you'd think, it just seems to be not so widely talked about.
 
I don't think you will get a great representation of the number as i doubt all people who use this method will post it on the forum for everyone to see.
 
^^^^^
Exactly, which is a shame. For all it's open mindedness, one thing that still has a bit of a stigma attached to it on bluelight (at least in the Aus forums) is needle use, and to a certain extent heroin use. I try at every opportunity to break this stigma, but often it's an uphill battle.

Sure the risks might be greater - but done with harm reduction in mind and it's just another method (a very efficient method by the way) to get drugs into your system. As with all drug use, as long as caution is taken and no other people are also adversly effected, then it's really up to the end user. Who am I to judge?
 
IM = Intra Muscular

I occasionally IV meth, and have the occasional IM ketamine. I used to be right into it, but now I prefer my meth orally.

It is definatley a very stigmatised practice. I bet there'd be many, many more people injecting than will admit it in this thread.

I stopped being surprised at who injects years ago. It really is all types of people. The "junky" stereotype is just another stereotype.
 
Couldn't agree more that there is a huge stigmatism associated with IV/IM drug use. I'll freely admit to anyone that I occasionally IV drugs. When I do, I take every precaution possible, as do all the people I know who do. And needles are NEVER discarded where they shouldn't be.

It doesn't make me hardcore (my drug use is far from what most would call hardcore)....
...it's just another method (a very efficient method by the way) to get drugs into your system
Many people are openminded in the sense that they can see through some media stereotypes/hype, but then can't see past others. To most, anyone who touches a needle is instantly a junkie.
 
Here's a thread I recently started in Drug Culture about this very topic:

For those who have never shot up.... has anyone THOUGHT about it?


There's some very interesting responses in there from both sides of the fence - those who believe needles automatically equal "junkie" and those who just see it as "another method of drug administration", medical almost.

As you'll see from my posts in there I've been considering it for a little while... seriously for the last 2 weeks. But like PsychoKitten I really only want to try it and see, for the experience. I highly doubt I could reconcile what's involved in regular drug IV use with what I want out of life and I feel pretty strongly about that. Still... I'm fascinated. Especially by those who claim to be "occasional" users who are still fully functioning, successful members of society.
 
IV is my preferred method for speed/meth/crystal. Don't take speed that much anymore, but I was on a bit of a bender for 18 months or so. Same thing would've happened if I'd snorted or ate it.

I used to IV pills (e) a bit, but really don't like it. They were filtered to a clear liquid, unlike a lot of people I've seen squirt a barrel of chalk/lactose into their veins. IV'ing MDMA powder is a lot of fun, but only have it at home or a friend's place now. Kinda tricky and makes me tired when I'm out. I've tried a few other things IV and quite liked them, but they aren't regulars in my life.

Generally I prefer my MDMA in pill form in my stomach...a nice balance of feeling good for a longer time.

I've met a few people clubbing who really had no idea that IV'ing could be a casual thing. Or that clubbers even do it. While still falling short of convincing them to try it themselves (which I certainly am not trying to do), after meeting myself and finding out other "normal" friends also indulge occasionally, they realise that it isn't necessarily the dirty junkie feeding their filthy habit. It's just another way some people choose to take their drugs.

I've heard comments such as "oh, that was quick!" or "I didn't realise it was that easy. That isn't such a big deal."

They are intelligent enough to realise the hypocrisy of bagging the practice of injecting when they pop themselves full of more pills in a weekend than I would take in a month.
 
I'm the same as Severed Psyche, IV is definitely my preferred MOA with meth. (probably my fave drug)
I have also IV'd a few pills(and a whole lot of other drugs), though doing pills without a micron filter is quite dangerous, and I prefer to snort them anyway.
I'm quite open with the fact I IV, if anyone decides to change their opinion of me (ie call me a 'junky') just due to this fact then I figure I have better things to do than spend my time with such ignorant morons.
 
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IV is my prefered method of administration, being a regular drug user id say I IV about 5 days out of the week.
 
Well, there's really only one thing that's prevented me thus far from experimenting with this form of usage for drugs. The fact that at the moment the majority of drugs that I am using are not ones that I would administrate via injection, either IV or IM. That, and my unfortunate tendancy to get somewhat woozy at the feeling of a needle travelling into my vein.

However, at some point in the not entirely distant future, I'm sure that I'll experiment with this form of administration, most likely for Methamphetamine or Ketamine, and, while somewhat less likely (only due to difficulty obtaining), stronger opiates/opioids as well.

I find it extremely objectionable the way that many people discriminate against those who's preferred method of administration for their drug of choice is injection. I find it even more objectionable when it comes from people who also use illicit drugs, yet prefer to administer them via the more socially acceptable routes. I believe those people should at least have at least more access to the information that exposes the hypocrisy in their attitudes, yet, there's no accounting for individual fuckwittedness, I suppose.

Freedom of choice, is what it's all about. If you discriminate against someone because of their prefered method of drug administration, whilst yourself using drugs via other methods, you're a hypocritical fuckwit. Its that simple.

-plaz out-
 
Yup (I'm sure you never would have guessed!)
Injection has been my preferred MOA for several drugs for the past 11 years. I've been doing myself for about 9.5 of those - since I "got serious" :) but I have gone for long periods where I have been injecting and not dpendent to any drug, and there are certainly a number of drugs I like to inject that i have never been dependent upon.

Heroin - always inject
Methamphetamine- Almost always. Find it much easier to get to the dose I need, and lasts me many hours, rather than smoking much smaller amounts and having to consume much more regularly, and much more I find, to reach the same level.
MDMA - Used to be my preferred, now I much rather swallow. Its actually quite a different experience, is very very intense when whacked, and doesn't last all that long.
MDA though - One of my favourite drugs to inject.
Ketamine - IM, of course. Much prefer it.
LSD - worth doing 1 or 3 times. Oft described as "a bit weird." It does hit very quickly, and, as there is no physical rush, which my mind has come to associate as the point at which its view on the world is about to shift, it takes you a little while to realise that "yes, I am tripping." But there's little point to the activity really.
Cocaine - very very full on rush - almost orgasmic (and I'm not using the word just for the hell of it) if you hit the perfect dose.

I guess I try and promote the idea that injecting is just another method of administration - that injecting doesn't represent a different level of drug use.
Yes - there are different issues. Absolutely.
Yes - there are different potential harms. But if done according to best practice there aren't necessarily any more actual harms than smoking or snorting.
Yes - the drug experience itself can vary - not just how fast it comes on, or duration, or intensity, but with some drugs the experience itself.
I also try and be honest with people if they ask me how I use, although, sadly, some people freak out.
Befriended on a recent night out, I was discussing crystal with my new acquaintance. She said "do you (as in me, not a generic you) smoke it?" "No, I generally shoot it but I do enjoy having the odd session with friends." "Scary" she said. "No, its really not."
Of course, its a discussion I've had many times before.
Interestingly, when the hypodermic syringe was first invented (the inventors wife became the first opiate-dependent injector), it was viewed very differently by society. It was seen as a lifesaver, and there can be no question that it has, and continues to play that role.
What is the reason for the difference in perspective? There are a few likely contributing factors.
1) 20 years ago (or right now in many other countries around the world – or, for that matter, in some Australian regional areas, or in any of our prisons), IV use was a very different proposition. If I had to get needles from hospital bins, if I had to reuse a needle that had been used 20 times before, if I had to create a fit out of a ballpoint pen, I think I would view my use very differently. And it wouldn't just eb perspective either; there are questions of physical capacity. When I compare my vein condition with that of users who have been without ready access to new equipment (either they have done time, or have used extensively in a country without NSP) I can see how much difference this makes. But I have ready access to sterile, single use equipment. I unwrap, I use each item for their various functions, I dispose of in a sharpsafe. Its all very clean actually. It will take quite a while for public images of injecting to shift to reflect a different using experience (AIVL's actually been preparing some information on the higher percentage of injectors as against the drug using population generally in Australia compared to nations of similar structure and economic dvelopment - this came up. )
2) HIV/AIDS had a massive impact on public psyche - and needle use was often portrayed as "carrying" HIV into the straight community. Misunderstandings around Hep C have also contributed to a public fear of injecting. Look at the hysteria that can accompany dumped fits - even though the chance of viral transmission from stepping on or being pricked by a dumped fit is quite miniscule - in fact there are no known transmissions of HIV through this scenario anywhere in the world. Hep C is a massive issue due to the much larger infection pool that existed before extensive peer ed & NSP. But it can be avoided – I have, and so have most of my immediate circle
3) Drug laws and negative stereotypes mean that there continue to be aspects of some user's use that contributes to negative images. Dumped fits are one - while public hysteria is over the top, they are a litter issue and they do have public health implications. But research shows the main contributing factor for why users dump fits is a fear of police harassment if they are found with equipment on them.
Unfortunately the view of injecting as dirty leads to the internalisation of this perspective by some users. When we're constantly told its dirty, it takes effort to not think "What does it matter if … I hold the fit in my mouth while I’m doing up the tornie… leave it uncapped… chuck it on the ground.. etc? Isn't that what all users do?"
And from non-injecting drug users, there's the old impact of divide and rule. "Yeh I'm using, but at least I'm not that fucked up."
4) Another "unfortunately" relates to the fact that most doctors couldn't hit a vein on The Incredible Hulk (although all that green might make it dificult. Lets say an elephant then, or the giant from Jack & the Giant Opium Poppy.) They dig around. They use needles of a much larger gauge than necessary. They end up putting the catheter in your hand where the veins are thin and it hurts like the bejeezus, because they've failed at their atttempts on the rest of your arm. No wonder a lot of people freak at the site of the things. I do all my own blood extraction now. It takes a lot of work to keep my veins in top shape. I'm not having a medical "proffesional" come along and destroy them.
5) One thing that probably contributes to the "hardcore" image amongst users ourselves is the fact that it is a more economical way of consuming some drugs. Research with Vietnamese heroin users shows that most of them start smoking it, and many prefer to smoke, but once tolerance kicks in it is just not an economically viable proposition. SO as users consume more their can be a tendency to shift to injecting to secure "more bang for the buck"

When we started Ravesafe Melb we copped a lot of flack for the "equal billing" we gave safe injection (our initial slogan was Bonk Safe! Blast Clean! Dance Proud! Doof Hard!)
But when others saw that we were willing to put our personal experiences out there, we got support from a lot of ravers who didn’t tell anyone but their immediate circles about their injecting. NSP services could vary from a couple of fits a night, right through to several hundred in the course of a weekend. We often asked what they would have done had we not been there, or not been allowed to provide injecting equipment. In (and I don’t have the stats but I would say a majority of cases) people had some equipment, but not enough, and that reuse of their own or less often of somebody else’s was often on the cards.

Some of my guiding principles for safer injecting (I’ll soon have a very detailed FAQ up on the AIVL site, this is more general):
1. If you find you like injecting and believe you will do it more than a couple of times – learn to do yourself! Being able to do yourself does not make you anymore (insert your own word… hooked…messed up… intense etc). Being injected by someone else increases the chance of Hep C transmission, it increases the chance of misses and big ugly and sore “eggs” resulting from injecting into the tissue surrounding a vein (its much quicker for you to register the pain and pressure associated with a miss and stop injecting, than for it to go through an additional step of you going Owww! Fuck! And then the injector stopping. Given that it might only take a couple of seconds to do the whole injection, additional time can result in a much bigger Ouchee); it can mean you are taken advantage of because you’re unsure of how much you’re getting (and that can increase overdose risk if you do go it alone at a later point – you think you were getting $50 but really were only getting $35 and then when you have $50 – bammo!); and finally, it can be a stress on friendships if its happening a lot.
2. It can pay to spend a bit extra on the process. Vein repair creams like Hirudoid or anything with Vitamin E can work absolute miracles; wheel filters (bacterial and pill) add a couple of bucks to the price of a hit but can have huge advantages in terms of absence of dirty hits (horrible experience) and vein care; sterile or demineralised/ distilled water if not provided by your NSP.
3. Reusing needles – and I’m talking about one that only you have used – will damage veins really quick. You can use several times a day with a new needle each time and do much less damage than one injection a day with an old, blunt one.
4. Injecting is a different proposition for men and women (this is another argument for No 1 as well) given the placement of veins above (m) or below (f) a fat layer.

Oh.. you might want to check out www.exchangesupplies.org
Its done by a company marketing - believe it or not - exchange supplies so there is a commercial angle but there is some really goood general info
I'll shut up now.
 
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i personally don't think it's a good idea to glamorise, here on BL, IV and IM use. for every "success" there are ten "failures"

i've seen more fucking failures than successes.

if you don't believe me....just contact your local rehab/methadone clinic......just for a fucken second opinion.

fuck shooting dirty shit straight into your body.
 
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