Who said Subutex was so simple?

[PaintTheTown]

After 20 years of a rollercoaster, everyday use of opiate pills I finally have sober time of one year. I used Kratom for six months and tapered of down the last two until I went to completely sober. I'm am very proud of myself which actually took me time to except as addiction makes you feel worthless. Six months ago my mother overdosed on heroin laced with fentynal. I tried to kill myself with an overdose of 80 metropolol (blood pressure medication) a few months before she overdosed. I actually used this drug to overdose because in my irrational mind I didn't want to use an opiate because I was clean. This overdose was a result of me having very hard conversations with my mother about sexual abuse I experienced as a child and in a relationship at the time of my overdose. Honestly I don't know how I stayed clean this past year except for pure will power and prayer. Because of my severe PTSD, anxity, and major depression I started with a psychologist who is also an addiction specialist. He recommended Suboxone daily after we spoke. I was surprised by this because I have a year clean even with all I been through. He feels I am not living and very raw due to I still have cravings. I definitely have them but much less then before. A lot of my cravings are because of uncontrolled pain and isolation due to severe PTSD and COVID. I go for short walks, eat clean, avoid caffeine, drink water, started medication for anxiety and insomnia. All these things help with my PAWS, mental illness, and sobriety. The doctor still feels based on my conversations that I would benefit from daily suboxone and I'm "this close" to relapse or white knuckling it. I would love advice on this and really got a brief feeling he may be one of those doctors who want me on long term Suboxone for financial gain. I don't want to trade one drug for another but also respect he may see something in me I can't due to all the trauma I experienced this past year regardless if I was able to stay sober. Let me know what you guys/girls think please.

 

[Dispatchick17]

So there is again a stigma that says suboxone/subutex is not getting and staying clean, just trading one for another. That may be true, but I know many addicts who have changed their lives thanks to subs. I feel though that if he sees you're on the line of relapse, especially as you deal with all the past trauma, perhaps he wants you to be covered so you don't. Subs also don't have to be long term. Some people need them longer. May I ask if you are now taking a benzo?

 

[PaintTheTown]

So there is again a stigma that says suboxone/subutex is not getting and staying clean, just trading one for another. That may be true, but I know many addicts who have changed their lives thanks to subs. I feel though that if he sees you're on the line of relapse, especially as you deal with all the past trauma, perhaps he wants you to be covered so you don't. Subs also don't have to be long term. Some people need them longer. May I ask if you are now taking a benzo?

Thank you for you reply. Yes, I honestly think he is right especially since I have suicidal thoughts often. He feels I am even part of my isolating to stay clean which is not okay. I worry if I start this medication and I lose my insurance I will not be able to afford it. Researched I see the withdrawal from Sub can be worse and longer then the pills I was addicted to. Nope, no benzos. I decline all benzos due to my addictive behavior and he didn't offer. I'm on celexa for anxiety and minipress/trazodone for nightmares with insomnia. Due to the severe depression I actually wondered if the Subutex would be helpful by eliminating cravings. He stated due to my 20 years of abuse my brain is rewired so even though I am not using I am not well or living. Its really hard decision with one year clean. I put the prescription on hold at the pharmacy for now. This made me think I also don't need it because the old me would have been very impulsive seeing it is an opiate. Its a mental battle dealing with this decision. Because of my mental illness I may be sober but in complete denial about what this professional sees due to my suicide attempt? I don't know.

 

[Dispatchick17]

Maybe you can discuss with him keeping the subs on hold. If/when you get the urge to relapse, start then? I can understand the fear of starting another addictive drug. I have heard horror stories of w/ds from subs and I have also heard success stories. A year sober is an amazing feat. Congratulations. Just don't allow the darkness that you're trying to rid yourself take over. Re-living some horrific stuff in therapy (necessary for me to get through & deal with it) has made me beyond ready to just tie one on and forget. Maybe that's where he is coming from.

 

[PaintTheTown]

I think you are exactly right. He has set me up with intense therapy due to several traumas. He kept repeating that the Subutex will stop the opiates if I decide to use. He also prescribed Narcan. I'm thinking he sees I am still very much in the woods due to the suicidal thoughts going into therapy. I'll talk to him about a plan. This will eliminate my anxiety of a lifetime commitment. Also speak to him about options if I lose my insurance. I feel free after one year sober and proud so thank you. He told me it is absolutely amazing I was able to get sober and stay clean. I think he also sees I am still in a very dangerous spot with all the emotional stuff that will come from therapy. Maybe he is using the Sub to prevent what he sees will happen even though I tell myself it won't because I don't want to go back on the rollercoaster. I guess this is what makes him the addiction specialist and me the addict? He sees what I unconsciously am not aware or accepting could happen.

Maybe you can discuss with him keeping the subs on hold. If/when you get the urge to relapse, start then? I can understand the fear of starting another addictive drug. I have heard horror stories of w/ds from subs and I have also heard success stories. A year sober is an amazing feat. Congratulations. Just don't allow the darkness that you're trying to rid yourself take over. Re-living some horrific stuff in therapy (necessary for me to get through & deal with it) has made me beyond ready to just tie one on and forget. Maybe that's where he is coming from.

 

[PaintTheTown]

i thing its bad decision to start subs after a year clean, you mostly will relapes, and it don't have long much long term effect for pain, the craving will be less and less over time if you stay clean, i see that adding other non-opiates meds is for sure better.

This I also agree with. I feel the subs could cause a relapse. I read sub can cause euphoria when first used and be abused so that scares me as a huge trigger to relapse or abuse the sub's. Because of the contract with the physician I would be kicked out if I abuse the subs (they count them weekly with an appointment, big money maker you think!). I also feel due to my major depression he may be trying to avoid me dying if I relapsed totally clean. I am suicidal and this I fight everday. My cravings are no where near intense as they were and get less over time. Problem is my suicide attempt was very impulsive and I'm lucky to be alive. Once I start intense therapy he may be afraid of an impulsive relapse that could kill me? I definitely feel starting subs with a year clean is almost suspicious but like I said I'm not the professional and possibly in denial of the danger ahead. Its not a simple decision for me especially since he really feels I need the subs. I don't think he will change his opinion about it but he can't force me to take them. He prescribed narcan also so this makes me feel he sees I'm in more danger then I recognize?

 

[negrogesic]

@PaintTheTown Welcome to bluelight. We are happy to have you (i encourage you to introduce yourself in the new member introductions area).

I feel like suboxone is a very bad idea if you are clean. Don't do it! It is unethical for a physician to even recommend that if you are currently clean. In fact it goes against the prescribing guidelines to prescribe it if a patient isnt currently using.

 

[ĐmantuNJofra]

Yeah it's silly patient have suicidal thoughts, PTSP,-D, and you give him substitute opiate, I dont know man psychytry isn't exact as other branch of medicine so it+s hard to know someone's mind when in appoint. but nevertheless, there are support groups, cognitial-behavioral therapy, you please stay away from buprenorphine it's for me hard to jump, have a child beautiful daughter and Corona doesn't help like earthquakes which shaking our ground near Sisak and Zagreb, where many of the people lost their home because it has a lot of PTSD.s in Sisak.Petrinja and my heart are with them and with you brother, stay away from Subutex you see it+s not every thing black when see families with babies lost their homes. and we are lucky well me maybe every morning at around now was earthquakes, Stay positive, chin up brrother!

 

[Coffeeshroom]

i have used subs many times to get of H and it worked. Only needed like 2mg to get rid of 80% of wd's so that worked for me but i always have to wait 24hrs or more just to make sure. In this time frame i normally knock myself outwith benzos and dopaquel. not very safe but i have done this before and know my body. You can do this, its just waiting that's a bitch

 

[PaintTheTown]

Yeah it's silly patient have suicidal thoughts, PTSP,-D, and you give him substitute opiate, I dont know man psychytry isn't exact as other branch of medicine so it+s hard to know someone's mind when in appoint. but nevertheless, there are support groups, cognitial-behavioral therapy, you please stay away from buprenorphine it's for me hard to jump, have a child beautiful daughter and Corona doesn't help like earthquakes which shaking our ground near Sisak and Zagreb, where many of the people lost their home because it has a lot of PTSD.s in Sisak.Petrinja and my heart are with them and with you brother, stay away from Subutex you see it+s not every thing black when see families with babies lost their homes. and we are lucky well me maybe every morning at around now was earthquakes, Stay positive, chin up brrother!

Yeah you are right and I really feel this is why he prescribed the narcan. In case I take all the sub at once maybe since they give you one month supply at a time? According to him no one has ever overdosed on sub but the narcan is for safety. My gut tells me I should not do it after a year clean and continue to pay attention to how I feel to prevent relapse. Thank you

 

[PaintTheTown]

@PaintTheTown Welcome to bluelight. We are happy to have you (i encourage you to introduce yourself in the new member introductions area).

I feel like suboxone is a very bad idea if you are clean. Don't do it! It is unethical for a physician to even recommend that if you are currently clean. In fact it goes against the prescribing guidelines to prescribe it if a patient isnt currently using.

Yes, I researched and everything I read says I should be in withdrawal not clean when I start this drug. He told me the first dose may even throw me into mild withdrawal because I have been clean a year which then he can up the dose slightly to balance me out. All this screamed NO in my head. Staying clean is not easy but I am nothing like I was today compared to when I first got clean. The craving have gone from 100% to about 30%. Starting subs scares me and my clean mind says NO. Sadly my depression and suicidal mind says maybe he is right especially with intense therapy coming up. I will go at it clean without subs and really be open about my feelings. My suicide attempt was definitely a result of keeping everything in. That has always been a trigger for relapse also.