Stimulants What ever happened to flakka? (Alpha-PVP)

[anythinganywhere]

Good thread topic. I had been wondering this myself, actually, but I don't have any firsthand experiences with Flakka to relate (though I've tried similar drugs, like MDPV in 2008-era "bath salts.")

Other places around the country had local waves of a-PVP use, but I think it was only called Flakka in South Florida. I wonder why that was? It also seemed to be the biggest a-PVP scene by far, with more organized distribution. I knew some people who injected a-PVP around 2013, but it was in a rural area and someone would just order 10g from China to supply the circle of users.

The rise and fall of the drug in So. Florida is confusing to me. Cocaine and methamphetamine were already pretty widespread/cheap/pure in that region back in 2015 and not much has changed, AFAICT. I wonder who was responsible for the decision to double-down on Flakka in So. Florida and where/how they got their supply....

Alpha - Pvp is currently being produced in the most intensive China. This is already one of the reasons for America's zombie propaganda. I used meth and I'm using a-pvp right now. I felt the physical harm of Meth much more.

 

[Decalcified and Dopesick]

It is very widely consumed in Belarus and Russia. An average of $ 25 per gram . As you dec, it is among the most sold products on the Russian Darknet Market. I've been in this terrible situation for a while.

Interesting, I figured that it must have sprung up in large numbers somewhere else because there was so much of it being produced and shipped to South Florida and it become popular very fast.
Keep your head up. I've felt hopeless so many times but I try to remember that the drugs mess with my brain chemistry and sometimes things can seem even worse than they actually are for me due to lack of dopamine being produced. There is always hope as long as we are still breathing. I'm trying to bounce back from opioids again myself right now.

Alpha - Pvp is currently being produced in the most intensive China. This is already one of the reasons for America's zombie propaganda. I used meth and I'm using a-pvp right now. I felt the physical harm of Meth much more.

That makes sense. I remember when a homeless guy in Miami was trying to eat someone's face and the media blamed "bath salt" for it. It turns out that the guy only had weed in his system. It seems like A-PVP can just trigger mental illness in people who already have underlying mental health issues, like most other stimulants. I had some really dark days on A-PVP but I was also homeless and that was probably the closest I came to somewhat borderline psychosis due to lack of sleep for days on end. I've mostly been more of an opiod/benzo kind of guy through the years. I did have a few runs with IV Meth and I IV'd the A-PVP. I felt more euphoria from the Meth but I never did it for more than a day or 2 in a row. I couldn't afford it with my H habit at the time so I don't know what it's like to be totally strung out on it but I have heard more than enough cautionary tales. I binged on the A-PVP for a while because I had nowhere to sleep and was wandering around the streets at the time.

 

[negrogesic]

Alpha - Pvp is currently being produced in the most intensive China. This is already one of the reasons for America's zombie propaganda. I used meth and I'm using a-pvp right now. I felt the physical harm of Meth much more.

Yeah i felt like A-PVP was much less toxic feeling than methamphetamine. I would rather take A-PVP than methamphetamine (then again i am the type of person that prefers cocaine over methamphetamine). However it does clearly have a unique delusional state that occurs which is quite different than methamphetamine psychosis. There is a strange delirium that occurs with A-PVP that doesn't occur with methamphetamine.

Methamphetamine however feels more neurotoxic than A-PVP.

 

[izo]

Methamphetamine however feels more neurotoxic than A-PVP.

I would never agree with this statement. With every route the apvp high is rougher, harsher and more jittery than meth could ever be.

 

[JTemperance]

I binged on the A-PVP for a while because I had nowhere to sleep and was wandering around the streets at the time.

The dynamic between homelessness and stimulant abuse is more complex than people give credit or at least not always reducible to "abuse stims->lose home->stim harder."

7-8 years ago, before the recent meth surge (or before it got attention), I read something that stuck with me, an interviewee who said that crystal meth was ideal for coping with life on the streets, watching your back all night and staying in perpetual motion with nowhere to go...

 

[Decalcified and Dopesick]

The dynamic between homelessness and stimulant abuse is more complex than people give credit or at least not always reducible to "abuse stims->lose home->stim harder."

7-8 years ago, before the recent meth surge (or before it got attention), I read something that stuck with me, an interviewee who said that crystal meth was ideal for coping with life on the streets, watching your back all night and staying in perpetual motion with nowhere to go...

Very true. I was never really one to binge on stims for multiple days. The only times that I did was when I was homeless and for that exact reason of being more aware and staying in motion. Also to try to suppress the hunger when going long periods of time without eating. I never liked to do stims without some heroin or at least benzos to come down but when on the street, I needed to stay alert. My A-PVP experiences were pretty awful but I also brought up the homelessness because it was very relevant to those experiences. I was surrounded by a lot of violence and it would be weird if I wasn't paranoid, regardless of being on drugs.

 

[plumbus-nine]

I loved alpha-PVP but it had a rebound / redosing cumulation much like methylphenidate. Now this one is widely prescribed so it can't be too bad but for me it was too intense. Meth indeed felt cleaner but I'd attribute that to both serotonergic affinity as well as the overall very low dosages I've used.

Best stim so far for me was really prolintane, the desbetaketo variant of ... alpha-PVP, lol. This one has a short enough duration for nice timing (just stop redosing when you want to sleep) and it set the bar for focus pretty high, I could stay on computer for the whole night and the next day without feeling bored, distracted or tired. And the result was actually usable.

They should better invest in resurrecting methoxetamine than ""flakka"".

 

[JTemperance]

I loved alpha-PVP but it had a rebound / redosing cumulation much like methylphenidate. Now this one is widely prescribed so it can't be too bad but for me it was too intense. Meth indeed felt cleaner but I'd attribute that to both serotonergic affinity as well as the overall very low dosages I've used.

Best stim so far for me was really prolintane, the desbetaketo variant of ... alpha-PVP, lol. This one has a short enough duration for nice timing (just stop redosing when you want to sleep) and it set the bar for focus pretty high, I could stay on computer for the whole night and the next day without feeling bored, distracted or tired. And the result was actually usable.

They should better invest in resurrecting methoxetamine than ""flakka"".

Prolintane was some good stuff IMO too, though I never sampled as many stims as you (seem to) have. Besides the Rx (d-amp, amp/d-amp, lisdexfetamine, methylphenidate), the OTC (propylhexedine), and the common American street drugs (crystal meth, powder coke, crack rock), it was just ethylphenidate, MDPV, 2-fluoroamphetamine, and prolintane, IIRC. Not counting the weak stuff.

 

[plumbus-nine]

Prolintane was some good stuff IMO too, though I never sampled as many stims as you did (or seem to have)/

It was sold as Katovit until some crazy guy drove his car right into a pharmacy demanding for more of it, lol. A stimulant for the elderly(! granted, this speaks for its safety). But unfortunately now it almost disappeared, for once without illegalization so I could acquire some (seriously overpriced though, given its short duration) from a local reseller. But now it's sold out and isn't restocked. Was the only stim so far which didn't come with cumulated side effects upon redosing which I see as a hallmark for dopaminergic toxicity. Really, if I had the money, this'd be a chem where I'd invest in a custom synth but guess the risk of being ripped by Chinese wannabe-labs or the local customs seizing everything suspiciously looking like drugs isn't worth it.

Would be interested to know what difference the beta-ketone makes. The cathinones differ in metabolism afaik and create a pretty toxic x-methylephedrine metabolite which the related amphetamines lack. Will going to try 3-MMA to see whether it is better than 3-MMC or not.

 

[JTemperance]

It was sold as Katovit until some crazy guy drove his car right into a pharmacy demanding for more of it, lol. A stimulant for the elderly(! granted, this speaks for its safety). But unfortunately now it almost disappeared, for once without illegalization so I could acquire some (seriously overpriced though, given its short duration) from a local reseller. But now it's sold out and isn't restocked. Was the only stim so far which didn't come with cumulated side effects upon redosing which I see as a hallmark for dopaminergic toxicity. Really, if I had the money, this'd be a chem where I'd invest in a custom synth but guess the risk of being ripped by Chinese wannabe-labs or the local customs seizing everything suspiciously looking like drugs isn't worth it.

Would be interested to know what difference the beta-ketone makes. The cathinones differ in metabolism afaik and create a pretty toxic x-methylephedrine metabolite which the related amphetamines lack. Will going to try 3-MMA to see whether it is better than 3-MMC or not.

Yeah, I got some Katovit pills back around 2015... well, "Katovit" pills, really. But the first bottle I got really was filled with prolintane tablets. I'm 90% certain anyways, since I later ended up with powder from another source I could compare with.

IMHO at the time, they were damn good. And I have to admit, the oral formulation was helpful for me - it facilitated the exercise of self-control. [I can't remember the supposed milligramage per pill anymore... I want to guess 10mg -- does that sound right?)

Naturally, I ordered another bottle after the first round had been polished off. Not much time had passed and the same listing from the same vendor was up, displaying a product that looked identical to the previous one, and which other folks still appeared to be purchasing with regularity.

All in all, I started to get my hopes up for a repeat experience... but as you might have guessed, what I bought myself this time was Grade A bunk, not prolintane. Nor was it any other kind of stimulant drug, for that matter -- these pills contained, AFAICT, cathinothing whatsoever.

The total absence of effects convinced me that their maker hadn't even bothered with pressing in some caffeine for half-assed misdirection. I'd call them "sugar pills" but they weren't even sweet, just flavorless pieces of cardboard mush, although it has to be said that they were still nicely bright and colorful in appearance.

It was enjoyable on the first go-round at least, and the nearly full "Katovit" bottle I've still from the second will be a nice souvenir of my feckless efforts to assemble the ultimate smorgasbord of clearnet narcotics and all the debit cards I sacrificed to hackers along the way.

 

[FreakOffTheLeash]

man I almost forgot about that shit. I fucking HATED it. I've never been so goddamn paranoid in my life. it's wasn't just regular bad paranoia, this was . . . advanced paranoia

 

[FreakOffTheLeash]

Interesting, I figured that it must have sprung up in large numbers somewhere else because there was so much of it being produced and shipped to South Florida and it become popular very fast.
Keep your head up. I've felt hopeless so many times but I try to remember that the drugs mess with my brain chemistry and sometimes things can seem even worse than they actually are for me due to lack of dopamine being produced. There is always hope as long as we are still breathing. I'm trying to bounce back from opioids again myself right now.


That makes sense. I remember when a homeless guy in Miami was trying to eat someone's face and the media blamed "bath salt" for it. It turns out that the guy only had weed in his system. It seems like A-PVP can just trigger mental illness in people who already have underlying mental health issues, like most other stimulants. I had some really dark days on A-PVP but I was also homeless and that was probably the closest I came to somewhat borderline psychosis due to lack of sleep for days on end. I've mostly been more of an opiod/benzo kind of guy through the years. I did have a few runs with IV Meth and I IV'd the A-PVP. I felt more euphoria from the Meth but I never did it for more than a day or 2 in a row. I couldn't afford it with my H habit at the time so I don't know what it's like to be totally strung out on it but I have heard more than enough cautionary tales. I binged on the A-PVP for a while because I had nowhere to sleep and was wandering around the streets at the time.

fuck that. over the course of just 24 hours, A PVP had me acting like I would up on meth for a week. and it made me so beyond paranoid I still am a little shook. by it. hated that drug

 

[izo]

I guess you can still find it in the darknet, but thats it.

 

[Isavela]

I really miss this substance! The IV Rush is absolutely the best rush i have ever experienced besides Crystal meth Amazing! But comedown is pure Hell.. it is worth The high though.

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

Agree a-pvp and a-php were amazing. Following cathinones were less good. Hexen wasn't bad tho thankfully.

 

[negrogesic]

I would never agree with this statement. With every route the apvp high is rougher, harsher and more jittery than meth could ever be.

Yeah definitely far more jittery and edgy, but a-pvp is a stimulant you can smoke for a while and still have a good chance of getting some sleep that night. Can't say that about methamphetamine.

Reuptake inhibitors like a-pvp definitely get pretty white knuckled at times, as they are short acting with intense but short lived comedowns. Methamphetamine depletes monoamines in the way that drugs like a-pvp do not. The serotonin action of methamphetamine is what makes it particularly poisonous.

A-pvp will bring you to stimulant psychosis far quicker than methamphetamine and the compulsive dosing is on the crack-cocaine end of the spectrum, but I would take a-pvp over methamphetamine any day. The again, I also prefer cocaine to methamphetamine so clearly I am a reuptake inhibitor kind of person.

 

[izo]

but I would take a-pvp over methamphetamine any day

But why, on it’s it’s own it’s more jittery, laasts shorter and is incredeblymreinforicing. 100,mg pvp let ,e grave just for more whereas i have q100mgm meth and in have a nice evening.don’t understand me wrong , I loved the pyrrolidino ketones, but nowadays only only with some benzos. Best thrown into the mix, it’s aswsome them.

 

[Decalcified and Dopesick]

fuck that. over the course of just 24 hours, A PVP had me acting like I would up on meth for a week. and it made me so beyond paranoid I still am a little shook. by it. hated that drug

Yeah, it fucked me up pretty bad too. I also had just gotten out of jail and was homeless so I didn't think things could really get worse, but I guess I found out shooting "flakka" wasn't the best way to deal with it. Great rush, absolutely awful, jittery high after that I just wanted to end. I was always a downers guy though. I would try to do smaller shots sometimes to stay up but it gave me an "impending doom" feeling that I hated.

I really miss this substance! The IV Rush is absolutely the best rush i have ever experienced besides Crystal meth Amazing! But comedown is pure Hell.. it is worth The high though.

The IV rush was up there with my favorites of all time. Oxymorphone, raw coke, and MDMA I would probably like better. Hydromorphone too probably lol. I was a dope head. I didn't even like Meth. The rush was nice but I though A-PVP was much better.

After the rush is when A-PVP was fucking me up bad. Even fistfuls of benzos wouldn't calm me down but I have to keep mentioning I was also on the street and in south Florida where it's almost always ridiculously hot and people constantly do crazy shit anyway.

 

[Decalcified and Dopesick]

Yeah definitely far more jittery and edgy, but a-pvp is a stimulant you can smoke for a while and still have a good chance of getting some sleep that night. Can't say that about methamphetamine.

Reuptake inhibitors like a-pvp definitely get pretty white knuckled at times, as they are short acting with intense but short lived comedowns. Methamphetamine depletes monoamines in the way that drugs like a-pvp do not. The serotonin action of methamphetamine is what makes it particularly poisonous.

A-pvp will bring you to stimulant psychosis far quicker than methamphetamine and the compulsive dosing is on the crack-cocaine end of the spectrum, but I would take a-pvp over methamphetamine any day. The again, I also prefer cocaine to methamphetamine so clearly I am a reuptake inhibitor kind of person.

Very interesting stuff. I also prefered A-PVP to Meth because I like the rush but I don't like my stimulant highs to be too long. I always wanted a smooth and quick comedown. I would've prefered a couple shots of some good coke followed by a shot of actual dope (pre fent days) to probably anything.

 

[Isavela]

I enjoy the long meth highs. IMO it should last even longer... BUT i also enjoy the short high of cathinones, especially a-pvp. It's a little bit deceiving drug because The high feels sooo short but actually lasts quite long (when The comedown phase is over The high is still there, different but present) if consumed amount per session is more than 300mg. I usually IV 30-45mg once in a hour or hour and a half, but The longer i binge The longer are The gaps between doses.