Very IMPORTANT Info Regarding MYLAN Generic Fentanyl Patches

[ktx49]

^dude thanks for putting this out there....i am so sure that my patches(sandoz) when worn as directed DO NOT RELEASE FENTANYL in reasonable such as what is listed on the insert/patch/box/wrapper for my case 75mcg/hr after 36-48hrs.....i even notice my pupils getting larger and stuff.

having worn the mylans once or twice i cant really give the full schmeal on them when worn as directed but they seemed less consistent(ie. sometimes it seemed to be releasing little to no fent and other time releasing more than listed)...however they were worthless after 48hrs.

phreex is it possible that this issue with ALL the patches not working properly after 48rs is more to do with skin/skin type issues rather than a flaw with the patch.

my personal theory(and im just throwing this out...eat me apart if u wish), is that after 48 hrs of not cleaning the surface area where the patch is, the skin simply does not absorb the fentanyl the same as it would on a fresh area of clean skin....ex. oils/dead skin/osmosis/sweat are messing with the mechanism of fentanyl release.

later

 

[sixpartseven]

Well, to be accurate, there isn't a person on these forums that can say that... however, I have been on Duragesic for over 5 years and have tried the Mylan and Sandoz generic brands... Mylan is total shit - even my doctor won't write a script without first telling the patient that if Mylan is all they have (and they don't have brand-name coverage) then to go elsewhere ...

The Sandoz are the closest as you get to the name-brand, but even so, while they may look identical, it seems the membrane is NOT the same ... it sems you get a steady flow for the first 24 hours or so then it drops off...

Now I am back on these (as Duragesic has worked the best for the chronic pain) and thankfully my doctor writes "DO NOT SUBSTITUTE FOR GENERIC" on the scripts and my insurance allows for the brand-name as long as my doc first phones in an over-ride for brand-name only... I have been on 2 of the 100mcg/hr patches (every 48 hours, so thats 30 a month) and only get the brand name... so while no one is the be all and end all, when it comes to fentanyl transdermall systems I have tried them all andeven have a doctor and a nurse practicioner along with my pharmacist (of 6 years) that says the Mylans are garbage (even for those that don't want to abuse them but just get pain control) and the Sandoz, while better, are still not perfect .... and trust me, I had to go for a period of a few months waiting for my insurance to cover the brand name and I tried both the generics to great extent ...

If you have a choice and it has to be a generic, go for the Sandoz (pharmacies can order a specific generic FYI) ... fuck the Mylan patches.....

But the idea is that generics are supposed to be identical to their brand-name originals, yet the Mylans are not and the Sandoz still has yet to master the membrane so absorbition ofthe drug (rather distrobution) is as equal as the Duragesic brand (and even those die after about 48 hours, hence the reason I get 2 of the 100mcg patches every 48 hours)

I didnt mean any offense when I said that. I know you know your shit. I cant remember what comment I made that reply to, and am too tired to look back right now, but thanks for sharing that information. Thats definitley good stuff to know.

 

[PhreeX]

my personal theory(and im just throwing this out...eat me apart if u wish), is that after 48 hrs of not cleaning the surface area where the patch is, the skin simply does not absorb the fentanyl the same as it would on a fresh area of clean skin....ex. oils/dead skin/osmosis/sweat are messing with the mechanism of fentanyl release.

I would have to say you are partly right, but what I have been told from talking to drug reps from Janssen in the past and reading things on Medline (a subscription database for doctors and such) - in short, the backing/membrane simply gums up and wears out... there is plenty of fentanyl and its totally viable (its the delivery system that fails, not the drug) ....

Now I shouldn't say this because some idiot will probably kill themselves, but ok, you wear your patch(es) for the FULL 72 hours, no heat, no added alcohol, nothing to push the drug through the membrane faster then intended ... well, take it off - ok, it should be dead, worthless - right? Well, take say a 3cc syringe (Lure-Lock so you can remove the needle) ... cut the patch open and scrape out all the gel and scrape it into the syringe ... use some K-Y jelly as the end is rough and anally push that "dead gel" into yourself - BAM - yer blasted into another world... now there isn't as much as there was when it was new (obviously) but there can be as much as 50%~ of the original amount of fentanyl left ....

DISCLAIMER -

I Just gave 2 ways to abuse a patch and one way you can use a "dead" patch to get a super intense high, ANY OF THESE WAYS CAN KILL YOU ... everything I post is to liberate the free flow of information ... and as for smoking the gel - I have heard mixed reasults, I never really got much ... oops, there is a 4th way ... and puting the contents of a NEW PATCH up yer ass, well, that can be fatal in a super fast way ... please, don't do it unless you know what your doing ... my advice has already been the reason for 2 deaths, I removed that "guide" that was responsible (Guide to IV Injection) and dealt with a father that just lost his son over it... please, don't be a dumbass and kill yourself because you take my words as some "safe way" of getting high ... YOU CAN DIE!

//p

 

[ktx49]

^yea i injected gel before and got mixed results but i do not recommend it.....

plugging...i never thought of that honestly....

i smoke the gel off foil with GREAT results....however, when i was an amateur at it, it did seem very wasteful but now i can get high off a 75mcg/hr patch atleast 4 or 5 separate times via smoking but it wears off quick as shit(2 hrs or less)

 

[PhreeX]

^yea i injected gel before and got mixed results but i do not recommend it.....

PLEASE tell me you are somehow isolating the fentanyl from the gel and not pushing that jell that is thick as grape jam into your arm.... anyway, itwould be so thick you would need to be using a fucking tent-spike size needle to push that, no way a 29 or 30 gauge needle would work ...

You CAN isolate the fentanyl but I am not about to post ... do some internet research ...

I still stand by - smoking it is a waste, plug it all anally and you get a nice smooth comeup and anywhere from 45 minutes to a few hours of warmth ... (again, make sure you know you can handle it before you get that goo up yer ass that will kill you faster then the AIDS you get from getting other goo put up yer ass!)

But to each his own.... smoke it, eat it, slam it, plug it... whatever ...

//p

 

[ktx49]

it was half dried out patches and i added warm saline water....still i only tried it 3 or so times and would never do it again....btw 29g.

later

 

[joekker]

Fentanyl transdermal system releases fentanyl from the adhesive matrix at a nearly constant amount per unit time. The concentration gradient existing between the adhesive matrix and the lower concentration in the skin drives drug release. Fentanyl moves in the direction of the lower concentration at a rate determined by the diffusion of fentanyl through the skin layers. While the actual rate of fentanyl delivery to the skin varies over the 72-hour application period, each system is labeled with a nominal flux which represents the average amount of drug delivered to the systemic circulation per hour across average skin.

While there is variation in dose delivered among patients, the nominal flux of the systems (25, 50, 75, and 100 mcg of fentanyl per hour) is sufficiently accurate as to allow individual titration of dosage for a given patient.

Following fentanyl transdermal system application, the skin under the system absorbs fentanyl, and a depot of fentanyl concentrates in the upper skin layers. Fentanyl then becomes available to the systemic circulation. Serum fentanyl concentrations increase gradually following initial fentanyl transdermal system application, generally leveling off between 12 and 24 hours and remaining relatively constant, with some fluctuation, for the remainder of the 72-hour application period. Peak serum concentrations of fentanyl generally occurred between 24 and 72 hours after initial application (see Table A). Serum fentanyl concentrations achieved are proportional to the fentanyl transdermal system delivery rate. With continuous use, serum fentanyl concentrations continue to rise for the first few system applications. After several sequential 72-hour applications, patients reach and maintain a steady state serum concentration that is determined by individual variation in skin permeability and body clearance of fentanyl (see graph and Table B).

After system removal, serum fentanyl concentrations decline gradually, falling about 50% in approximately 17 (range 13 to 22) hours. Continued absorption of fentanyl from the skin accounts for a slower disappearance of the drug from the serum than is seen after an IV infusion, where the apparent half-life is approximately 7 (range 3 to 12) hours.

Seems accurate but I can't find the passage that pertains to mylan alone.

 

[PhreeX]

Fentanyl transdermal system releases fentanyl from the adhesive matrix at a nearly constant amount per unit time. The concentration gradient existing between the adhesive matrix and the lower concentration in the skin drives drug release. Fentanyl moves in the direction of the lower concentration at a rate determined by the diffusion of fentanyl through the skin layers. While the actual rate of fentanyl delivery to the skin varies over the 72-hour application period, each system is labeled with a nominal flux which represents the average amount of drug delivered to the systemic circulation per hour across average skin.

While there is variation in dose delivered among patients, the nominal flux of the systems (25, 50, 75, and 100 mcg of fentanyl per hour) is sufficiently accurate as to allow individual titration of dosage for a given patient.

Following fentanyl transdermal system application, the skin under the system absorbs fentanyl, and a depot of fentanyl concentrates in the upper skin layers. Fentanyl then becomes available to the systemic circulation. Serum fentanyl concentrations increase gradually following initial fentanyl transdermal system application, generally leveling off between 12 and 24 hours and remaining relatively constant, with some fluctuation, for the remainder of the 72-hour application period. Peak serum concentrations of fentanyl generally occurred between 24 and 72 hours after initial application (see Table A). Serum fentanyl concentrations achieved are proportional to the fentanyl transdermal system delivery rate. With continuous use, serum fentanyl concentrations continue to rise for the first few system applications. After several sequential 72-hour applications, patients reach and maintain a steady state serum concentration that is determined by individual variation in skin permeability and body clearance of fentanyl (see graph and Table B).

After system removal, serum fentanyl concentrations decline gradually, falling about 50% in approximately 17 (range 13 to 22) hours. Continued absorption of fentanyl from the skin accounts for a slower disappearance of the drug from the serum than is seen after an IV infusion, where the apparent half-life is approximately 7 (range 3 to 12) hours.

Seems accurate but I can't find the passage that pertains to mylan alone.

Why did you post the Duragesic/Transdermal Prescribing Instructions? It isn't even on topic.... the issue is why a GENERIC brand of a drug is not as quality a product as it's brand name counter part when generic drugs are supposed to be the same in every way but the maker and price - that is the issue!

//p

phreex.com Forums - NOW ONLINE!

 

[Beans]

^Yeah they are supposed to be the same. I'll post this tidbit again for all you non-believers:

A generic drug is bioequivalent to a brand name drug with respect to pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic properties, but is normally sold for a lower price. Generic medicines must contain the same active ingredient at the same strength as the "innovator" brand, be bioequivalent, and are required to meet the same pharmacopoeial requirements for the preparation. By extension, therefore, generics are identical in dose, strength, route of administration, safety, efficacy, and intended use.

From the FDA:

"A generic drug is identical, or bioequivalent to a brand name drug in dosage form, safety, strength, route of administration, quality, performance characteristics and intended use. Health professionals and consumers can be assured that FDA approved generic drugs have met the same rigid standards as the innovator drug. To gain FDA approval, a generic drug must:

1) contain the same active ingredients as the innovator drug (inactive ingredients may vary)
2) be identical in strength, dosage form, and route of administration
have the same use indications
3) be bioequivalent
4) meet the same batch requirements for identity, strength, purity, and quality
5) be manufactured under the same strict standards of FDA's good manufacturing practice regulations required for innovator products"

Office of Generic Drugs

FDA Ensures Equivalence of Generic Drugs

Generic Drugs: What You Need To Know

 

[joekker]

'Why did you post the Duragesic/Transdermal Prescribing Instructions? It isn't even on topic.... the issue is why a GENERIC brand of a drug is not as quality a product as it's brand name counter part when generic drugs are supposed to be the same in every way but the maker and price - that is the issue!'

'a thousand pardons... . I was just trying to point up the applications that doctors might follow when prescribing fent patches and how pharmacists take it upon themselves to dish out the cheapest or most profitable item.

 

[arcarsenal]

so i have a 100mcg/H mylan fentanyl patch.

i've consumed somewhere between a quarter and an 8th of it by sucking and chewing on it.

definately caugh a buzz, but definately not as effective as the gel patches.

since i have most of it left, i wanted to create a tincture to more efficiently use the rest. i would really appreciate it if anyone had better ideas or could answer some of my questions.


****

the process I am probably going to do will consist of soaking the patch in a warm liquid solution of known at a low pH, either using citric acid (or lemon juice) or hydrochloric acid.

does anyone know what the optimal pH would be for converting fentanyl base into the salt? is either citric or hydrochloric acid more effective?

i have also considered using not just an acidic solution, but one also spiked with ethanol to perhaps expedite the conversion and solution.

does this process seem appropriate to anyone? i might do it for several days to maximize the chemical in solution.

are there any downsides? with the current unprocessed sublingual method being so poorly cost-effective, it really seems like there arent really any downsides to this proposed method.

i guess the biggest question is, if the patch is put in this warm acidic alcohol/water liquid, WILL THE FENTANYL ACTUALLY DISSOLVE?

 

[sudbury_101]

smoke the fent

I signed up here pretty much , just to post this message, and will continue to come here, are the mylan matrix different than the ratio-fentanyl mylans?
Because, I peal the plastic off and razor the thin layer into balls, and I'm pretty sure I have a buzz, and me off all people have a very good understanding of what a buzz is. I looked on the net for days trying to find extraction methods, and finally scraped it and smoked it. 75's, cool man!

REPLI if your HIGH

 

[unsui]

so you can smoke these things with noticable effects? anyway to get rid of the silicone adhesive?