ForEverAfter
Ex-Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2012
- Messages
- 2,836
In order to avoid being accused of creating one of these endless back and forth debates, this will be my last post on the subject. I may have got slightly carried away yesterday. It was my first sober day in about three months. I am quitting everything. I apologize if I offended you, Mr. Grunge. Please feel free to respond. Keep in mind, though, if you ask any questions I cannot reply, as I have been warned. I would appreciate it if moderators gave me the benefit of the doubt. Don't delete these posts. I assure you, I will not continue to ramble on. Thanks.
The characters are more complex than you give them credit. They are alluding to homosexuality. Tim’s make-up is done like a drag queen. He is not made up to be a woman. He is made up to be some weird grey area between man and woman. This is where a lot of the comedy lies in those sketches.
I made it very clear in my dissertation, which took less than ten minutes to write, that by impersonating it, they are also contributing to it; because the satire is one-dimensional, they become what they are satirizing.
No you didn’t use the word clever. You used the word brilliant. You said Tim and Eric are today’s Monty Python, and Monty Python are brilliant. Ipso facto, Tim and Eric are brilliant which is higher on the scale than clever. You also referred to Tim and Eric (the show) as brilliant directly.
They are not literally Chaplin or Python, no. You were the one that drew the comparison in the first place. My point was that Tim and Eric are not pioneers. They are given credit for pushing the boundaries of comedy when really they aren’t pushing it further than it has already been pushed. (Note: I am talking about conceptual/theoretical advancement, not magnitude.) Chaplin and Python were two examples off the top of my head. I could give you two hundred if you like.
Gilliam’s animations are grounded in high art. He is a contemporary version of Svankmajer. His animations, while they seem absurd, make reference to – and pay homage to – the entire history of art. Tim and Eric are much closer to Johnny Carson skits than they are to Gilliam.
No, dude. Your vocabulary is impressive. Your words are eloquent. My point is that despite being your analysis being sophisticated, the show itself is not sophisticated.
My theory is that intelligent people want to like stupid things. This is the niche that Tim and Eric fill. They create something completely inane, under the guise of being clever, so that clever people who cannot admit outright to being fans of something utterly mindless have an excuse to switch of their brains and giggle.
The first thing that pops into my head is Garth Marenghi’s Darkplace. Richard Ayoade has a habit of making intentionally incompetent shows. Man to Man with Dean Learner also fits the bill. They use bad acting, poor set design and production values, editing mistakes, etcetera for comedic effect. What separates Tim and Eric from Darkplace, is the fact that Darkplace both functions as competent and incompetent. (Note that both these shows are post-2000, both existed before Tim and Eric, and neither exist on Adult Swim. If you need more examples let me know.)
What season is Jersey Shore up to? I’m not saying that Jersey Shore is on the same level as Tim and Eric. Personally I can’t stand watching either of them, but Tim and Eric is admittedly a much better show. Jersey Shore is like something the Devil forgot to flush. My point is that you can’t gauge the quality of a show on how many seasons it reaches.
Adult Swim is given far more credit than it deserves. Tim and Eric is alternative comedy. It appeals to people who don’t want to put up with clichés and laugh tracks, people who are sick to death of normal comedy. And, that’s fine. But it isn’t a new thing, alternative comedy. It has existed in many forms for decades, and in many other forms for centuries.
If somebody starts painting like Picasso, today, their work means nothing. What they are doing is derivative. Anti-comedy is well established. Pushing it further and further it until it eventually snaps isn’t worthy of applause; taking alternative forms of comedy to the nth degree, as far as I’m concerned, has no purpose. What comes after Tim and Eric; an even more intentionally incompetent show about unintentionally incompetent people; a man wearing even more outlandish make-up; worse acting; lazier scripts; more retarded cameramen? If somebody comes along, and they will, and does this: will you tune in?
The characters are more complex than you give them credit. They are alluding to homosexuality. Tim’s make-up is done like a drag queen. He is not made up to be a woman. He is made up to be some weird grey area between man and woman. This is where a lot of the comedy lies in those sketches.
I made it very clear in my dissertation, which took less than ten minutes to write, that by impersonating it, they are also contributing to it; because the satire is one-dimensional, they become what they are satirizing.
No you didn’t use the word clever. You used the word brilliant. You said Tim and Eric are today’s Monty Python, and Monty Python are brilliant. Ipso facto, Tim and Eric are brilliant which is higher on the scale than clever. You also referred to Tim and Eric (the show) as brilliant directly.
They are not literally Chaplin or Python, no. You were the one that drew the comparison in the first place. My point was that Tim and Eric are not pioneers. They are given credit for pushing the boundaries of comedy when really they aren’t pushing it further than it has already been pushed. (Note: I am talking about conceptual/theoretical advancement, not magnitude.) Chaplin and Python were two examples off the top of my head. I could give you two hundred if you like.
Gilliam’s animations are grounded in high art. He is a contemporary version of Svankmajer. His animations, while they seem absurd, make reference to – and pay homage to – the entire history of art. Tim and Eric are much closer to Johnny Carson skits than they are to Gilliam.
No, dude. Your vocabulary is impressive. Your words are eloquent. My point is that despite being your analysis being sophisticated, the show itself is not sophisticated.
My theory is that intelligent people want to like stupid things. This is the niche that Tim and Eric fill. They create something completely inane, under the guise of being clever, so that clever people who cannot admit outright to being fans of something utterly mindless have an excuse to switch of their brains and giggle.
The first thing that pops into my head is Garth Marenghi’s Darkplace. Richard Ayoade has a habit of making intentionally incompetent shows. Man to Man with Dean Learner also fits the bill. They use bad acting, poor set design and production values, editing mistakes, etcetera for comedic effect. What separates Tim and Eric from Darkplace, is the fact that Darkplace both functions as competent and incompetent. (Note that both these shows are post-2000, both existed before Tim and Eric, and neither exist on Adult Swim. If you need more examples let me know.)
What season is Jersey Shore up to? I’m not saying that Jersey Shore is on the same level as Tim and Eric. Personally I can’t stand watching either of them, but Tim and Eric is admittedly a much better show. Jersey Shore is like something the Devil forgot to flush. My point is that you can’t gauge the quality of a show on how many seasons it reaches.
Adult Swim is given far more credit than it deserves. Tim and Eric is alternative comedy. It appeals to people who don’t want to put up with clichés and laugh tracks, people who are sick to death of normal comedy. And, that’s fine. But it isn’t a new thing, alternative comedy. It has existed in many forms for decades, and in many other forms for centuries.
If somebody starts painting like Picasso, today, their work means nothing. What they are doing is derivative. Anti-comedy is well established. Pushing it further and further it until it eventually snaps isn’t worthy of applause; taking alternative forms of comedy to the nth degree, as far as I’m concerned, has no purpose. What comes after Tim and Eric; an even more intentionally incompetent show about unintentionally incompetent people; a man wearing even more outlandish make-up; worse acting; lazier scripts; more retarded cameramen? If somebody comes along, and they will, and does this: will you tune in?
