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Toxic Toking

neversickanymore

Moderator: DS
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This is from the times magazine. They often post cases for people to try and diagnose.. I thought this on was pretty interesting.


Toxic Toking
By LISA SANDERS, M.D.
MARCH 14, 2014

“Dad, I’ve got to go to the hospital,” the young man croaked in a near whisper, which his father barely heard over the hum of the traffic outside the car. “I’m sick again.” The middle-aged man glanced over at his 25-year-old son. His face was drained of color and shiny with sweat despite the frigid winter day.

He took the next exit and headed toward Waterbury Hospital, in Waterbury, Conn.

The young man woke early that morning with the familiar feeling of weight in his stomach that always preceded an attack of vomiting. He forced himself out of bed and did a few quick push-ups. His mouth flooded with the taste of bile — a hint of what was to come. If he could just take his anti-nausea medication and get into a hot shower, he might still be able to fight it off. He worked with his father in his contracting business, and he hated disappointing him.

Kicking a Bad Habit

After he got out of the shower, he felt much better. On the way to work, his father drove him to the methadone center, where he received the daily dose that kept him from relapsing into his heroin habit. But, standing in line, waiting for the little cup of red liquid, the heaviness again settled in his stomach. He gulped the medicine and hurried back to the car.

He sat with his eyes closed as his father drove. Suddenly he was ice-cold; sweat streamed from every pore; acid burned deep in his throat. He knew he couldn’t work. Maybe he could make it to the hospital before he started vomiting. He knew from experience that once he got started, he wouldn’t stop for hours.

When the young man arrived at the E.R., he was drenched. In a small room, he pulled on a hospital gown and lay down next to a large pink basin to wait for the inevitable paroxysms to start. By the time a doctor came in, the patient had been vomiting for a while and had nothing left in his system. He told the doctor that he got these episodes of nausea fairly regularly — maybe a couple of times a month. Sometimes he could tough it out. But far too often, he ended up either here or at the hospital across town.

Inflammation

The young man looked tired and uncomfortable. His skin and lips were pale and dry. His blood pressure was high, and his belly was a little tender. The doctor wasn’t surprised. The results from the blood sample drawn earlier showed elevated levels of pancreatic enzymes, which suggested that his pancreas was inflamed — a condition known as pancreatitis. The pancreas makes the chemicals that break down food in the small intestines. But certain medications, diseases or alcohol can occasionally cause those chemicals, so beneficial in the digestion of food in the intestine, to be released inside the pancreas itself, causing the breakdown of the delicate tissues of that organ. The result is nausea, vomiting and extreme abdominal pain. All doctors can do at that point is to treat the pain and keep the patient from becoming dehydrated from all the vomiting.

Dr. Virginia Brady, the resident on call that day, hurried down to the E.R. after hearing about the young man being admitted with pancreatitis. When she entered his room, he was asleep, a slender tattooed arm slung across his face. He awakened quickly and, after wiping the sweat from his face, recounted the day’s on-again, off-again nausea and vomiting. It was frustrating, he told the young doctor, because he used to think his nausea was caused by alcohol — but he gave that up five years ago. Then he blamed drugs: heroin, cocaine, marijuana — he did them all. But a few months earlier he gave them up too. And the methadone program made sure he stayed clean, he added. But he was still getting sick just as often.

Other Drugs

Brady asked whether he took any drugs at all. The man reported that he took an antidepressant, an antihistamine to help him when he had trouble sleeping and a nausea pill that he was prescribed when this started about eight years earlier. And, he added reluctantly, there was this stuff sold under the name Spice — a so-called synthetic marijuana — that he smoked daily. But it was mostly just a bunch of dried weeds, which he bought at a little neighborhood store. It definitely wasn’t marijuana. Otherwise it would show up in the urine tests he had to take almost every week.

On exam, his blood pressure had come down and his belly was soft and no longer tender. His bowel sounds were quieter than normal but the rest of his exam was unremarkable.

Brady wondered what had made this young man so sick. The nausea, vomiting and elevated pancreatic enzymes certainly suggested pancreatitis. But an ultrasound of his belly showed a normal pancreas. Moreover, patients with pancreatitis usually have excruciating abdominal pain, and this man had none.

Was there something about Spice that could effect enzymes in such a way to suggest pancreatitis but without the abdominal pain? Brady wasn’t sure. But the nausea the patient described — starting in the early hours of the morning, causing unremitting vomiting that got better with a hot shower — sounded like a syndrome she had seen in patients who smoked pot nearly every day. Why marijuana, a drug sometimes used to fight nausea, should in some people produce cannabinoid hyperemesis (as the pot smoker’s vomiting syndrome was called) is not clear. Cannabinoids have been shown to slow down the gut. One theory is that too much cannabinoid in the system slows it down too much, leading to nausea and vomiting. Oddly, virtually all the people who experience the nausea feel much better while they are taking a hot shower. Somehow the water — as hot as they can stand it — makes the nausea disappear. It was the defining quality of the syndrome, described by a physician in South Australia in 2004, who noted that several patients with so-called psychogenic vomiting would get better just by being in the hospital, where they couldn’t smoke marijuana, and taking very hot showers. All were heavy marijuana users. The users who smoked again once more experienced the symptoms.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/16/magazine/16-diagnosis.html?_r=0#/#habit

Answer

NSFW:

Synthetic Pot
This patient said he hadn’t smoked marijuana in months. But maybe he had relapsed but wasn’t telling her. She ordered a urine toxicology screen; that would show if he had used marijuana recently. Then she went to a computer to investigate the other possibility — that Spice caused the young man’s illness. First she searched for a link between Spice and pancreatitis. There were a few reports suggesting a link between marijuana and pancreatitis but nothing about this synthetic marijuana. Then she considered another possibility: that the synthetic marijuana caused cannabinoid hyperemesis — even though it didn’t contain cannabinoids.

She searched for the terms “cannabinoid hyperemesis” and “Spice.” And there it was — two reports describing regular synthetic-marijuana users who developed a syndrome that was indistinguishable from cannabinoid hyperemesis caused by the real stuff.

Brady went back to the patient and asked whether he’d heard about cannabinoid hyperemesis. He had. She explained that she was concerned that the Spice he was smoking might be giving him the same symptoms. Synthetic marijuana was designed by a chemist; its molecules bind to the cannabinoid receptors in the brain — imitating the real thing — and possibly producing the same unpleasant side effects.

When the team arrived at the patient’s room the next morning, he was already dressed and ready to leave. No abdominal pain, no nausea. He hadn’t vomited in 12 hours. He was worried that he wouldn’t get out of the hospital in time to get his methadone. The doctor told him that if he went back to smoking Spice, he would end up in the hospital. Never, he promised. He didn’t want to feel that way again.

I spoke with the patient recently. He stayed off Spice for a couple of days, but then went back to smoking the synthetic marijuana. And he has been back in the hospital twice in the month since Dr. Brady met him. Unfortunately, this is a typical pattern. In the case reports of cannabinoid hyperemesis, few of the pot smokers given this diagnosis were willing to give up their drug, even when they knew it made them sick.


Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome
 
i know a friend who has developed cannabinoid hyperemesis and its a drag for sure. it doesnt surprise me that synthetic cannabinoids are causing this as well. of all the RC's that have come out the synthetic Cannabinoids are the most dangerous in my opinion. there are so many different variations that people dont even know which chem they are ingesting. the worst factor however, i believe to be the way people assume since marijuana is pretty safe that these synthetic varieties will also be safe to use. additionally, people will use these chemicals everyday, other chems like 2c-b or amt are not going to be ingested daily by many people. even the synthetic stimulants are probably safer than the cannabinoids.

Either way ingesting untested chemicals is dangerous and kinda stupid but i still do it, i know i am responsible for my own life and safety.
 
Either way ingesting untested chemicals is dangerous and kinda stupid but i still do it, i know i am responsible for my own life and safety.

Which is OK because you know what you are doing and the risks you are taking. These synthetics though are not being sold with any such disclaimer, indeed their being sprayed onto plant matter to make them seem more "natural" and that's a real problem. Most people aren't as drug-savvy as your average BLer and if they see this "natural" looking stuff, wrapped up in shiny, attractive packaging with savvy marketing techniques being sold openly in stores they tend to assume they're perfectly safe.

I dunno. It's a shitty trend but the real elephant in the room is that there's only a market for this stuff because the real natural stuff, that humans have been using for thousands of years without any physical harm whatsoever is deemed illegal and the market driven underground.

The solution is obvious really...
 
of all the RC's that have come out the synthetic Cannabinoids are the most dangerous in my opinion.

Woah there, that's a very big call. I don't like them myself, and I'm glad (in a way) that there aren't many decent RC opioids because we would definitely see bad things happen with those, such as the cases which caused instant parkinson's disease (can't remember the name of the drug) and of course, overdose from things like acetylfentanyl when accurate dosing is impossible. But calling synthetic cannabinoids the most dangerous research chemical is pretty far fetched.

Nobody should need to ingest these dangerous chemicals if they enjoy pot, they should be allowed to have pot. Nobody should need to have any of these RC's until more evidence on their use in humans is studied. It's sad, really.
 
There is also another article: "Think Like a Doctor: Sweating It Solved!", by Lisa Sanders, MD, about cannabinoid hyperemesis, dated 7th March, 2014, with some different info. Try Googling it, or if unsuccessful, message me here for the weblink. I'll try to post the bulk of it here:

"THINK LIKE A DOCTOR MARCH 7, 2014, 3:27 PM
Think Like a Doctor: Sweating It Solved!
By LISA SANDERS, M.D.

Anna Kövecses

On Thursday, we challenged Well readers to figure out why a 25-year-old man who had recently given up heroin, cocaine and marijuana had a sudden attack of nausea and vomiting so severe that he had to go to the hospital. Two big clues were provided. His nausea and vomiting eased when he took a hot shower, and he regularly used an herbal product that he bought in a neighborhood store called Spice, said to be synthetic marijuana.

We got more than 300 responses. Several of you correctly identified the syndrome as cannabinoid hyperemesis. But given that this young man had a urine toxicology screen that showed he had no cannabinoids in his system, I was also looking for you to link that syndrome to his use of Spice.

Several of you did just that, but the first was Dr. Martine Lamy, an intern in child psychiatry at Cincinnati Children’s Hospital Medical Center. Dr. Lamy told me that she had cared for a patient who had the exact same presentation. The young man she had seen, an athlete on a college team, had first developed cannabinoid hyperemesis when he smoked marijuana. Once the college started drug-testing all athletes, she tells me, the whole team switched to Spice, which does not show up on urine screens.

The correct diagnosis is…

Cannabinoid hyperemesis caused by smoking synthetic marijuana.

The Diagnosis:

Cannabinoid hyperemesis, first described in 2004, is a syndrome of nausea and vomiting, compulsive bathing and chronic marijuana use. Dr. James H. Allen, an internist in Adelaide Hills, Australia, became intrigued with a patient who had been repeatedly admitted to the hospital with what was then called psychogenic cyclic vomiting – vomiting because of psychological rather than physiological causes. Oddly, the patient was also constantly showering.

Dr. Allen noticed that the symptoms improved during hospitalization with no intervention and recurred once the patient was sent home. He also noted that at home the patient was a chronic heavy marijuana user and hypothesized that the vomiting might be caused by the drug, while easing of symptoms was linked to abstinence.

Over the next several years, Dr. Allen noted similar patterns in other patients admitted with vomiting disorders. In 2004, he published a report on 10 patients found to have with what he called cannabinoid hyperemesis.

Each patient in his case series smoked marijuana daily; each had developed intermittent nausea and vomiting. All had used marijuana for years before they developed these episodic bouts of nausea and vomiting. And remarkably, nine of the 10 patients reported that hot showers eased their symptoms when everything else failed. All symptoms resolved when these patients gave up marijuana – and then reappeared when they resumed their cannabis use.


A Marijuana Syndrome, Without the Marijuana:

Dr. Allen’s case series prompted recognition of similar patients around the world. The mechanism by which marijuana – a drug otherwise recognized for its antiemetic properties – induces vomiting in some chronic heavy users is not well understood. There are several hundred organic compounds in marijuana, and many have been noted to have complex effects on both the brain and the gut.

However, this patient had no marijuana in his system. He said he hadn’t smoked it in several months. He did, however, acknowledge using so-called synthetic marijuana. This product, sold under such names such as Spice and K2, has been sold in smoke shops and small stores throughout the United States and Europe since the mid-2000s.

The product looks like dried herbs and, though the labeling often carries the warning “not for human consumption,” it is frequently smoked or brewed into tea. The list of ingredients often includes herbal components that have long had the reputation of having marijuana-like psychoactive properties. However, when analyzed, these compounds are often not found, and the effect is provided by chemicals that resemble marijuana’s cannabinoids sprayed onto the dried plants.

Many of the most popular of these synthetic cannabinoids were developed in the 1980s by a researcher from Clemson University who created several molecules that bind to the cannabinoid receptors in the brain, stimulating it in a way that is similar to that of the original. Pharmaceutical companies were investigating these molecules to treat pain but abandoned the effort because of the difficulty of isolating the desired qualities of the drug from the unwanted psychoactive effects. Chemical analyses of the products sold as synthetic marijuana has been shown to contain one or more of these chemicals.

In the United States, the Drug Enforcement Agency has tried, with limited success, to ban these products. Several states have also passed laws prohibiting their sale. Nevertheless they are still easy to find around the country.

How the Diagnosis Was Made:

The patient had been admitted to the hospital with a diagnosis of pancreatitis, an inflammation of the pancreas. However, after Dr. Virginia Brady, the resident who talked with and examined the patient that day at Waterbury Hospital, she wasn’t sure that was what he had.

Nausea and vomiting are common symptoms of pancreatitis, and he did have very high levels of the enzymes made by the pancreas in his blood. But pancreatitis is an excruciating injury to a very delicate organ, and this patient had no abdominal pain. That made no sense to the young doctor.

Moreover, his story had a familiar ring. The nausea he described – starting in the early hours of the morning, causing terrible and unremitting vomiting that ebbed with a hot shower – sounded like a syndrome she’d seen many times before in patients who smoked pot regularly. Despite marijuana’s potent anti-nausea properties, some regular users get episodes of nausea and vomiting that is, strangely, made better when they take a hot shower. Somehow the water – as hot as they can stand it – makes the nausea disappear. It was the defining quality of the syndrome when it was first described by Dr. Allen in 2004.

But this guy said he hadn’t smoked marijuana in months. The people Dr. Brady had seen with cannabinoid hyperemesis usually smoked every day. Maybe the patient had relapsed after all.

Dr. Brady ordered a urine toxicology screen; that would show if he had used marijuana recently. However, she knew that methadone clinics like the one this young man visited since he had stopped using heroin tested their patients regularly, so she suspected that he was telling the truth. He probably hadn’t smoked pot.

But he did smoke Spice. Could that have caused the young man’s illness? Dr. Brady hurried to a computer and looked for a link between Spice and pancreatitis. Nothing. There were a few reports suggesting a link between marijuana and pancreatitis, but nothing about this synthetic marijuana. Moreover, the people in those case reports had the typical symptoms of pancreatitis – nausea, vomiting and abdominal pain. This patient had no pain.

What about the vomiting? Could this so-called synthetic marijuana cause cannabinoid hyperemesis – even if it wasn’t the real thing? It seemed unlikely, and yet his symptoms were so typical. She turned to Google to search for the terms cannabinoid hyperemesis and Spice.

Sure enough, there it was – two recent case reports describing several regular synthetic marijuana users who developed a syndrome that was indistinguishable from cannabinoid hyperemesis caused by the real stuff.


Smoking a Lot of Spice:

Dr. Brady went back to the patient. How much synthetic marijuana did he smoke? A lot, he told her. Sometimes 3 to 4 grams a day. With real marijuana, a couple of tokes in the morning would keep him relaxed for most of the day. With the synthetic stuff, the feeling of being relaxed never lasted, and he was constantly chasing it by smoking more and more.

She asked him if he’d heard about cannabinoid hyperemesis. He had. But he hadn’t smoked pot since November, he told her. She explained that she was concerned that the stuff he was smoking – the synthetic version – might be a good enough fake to give him the same symptoms.

When the team visited the patient the next morning, he was already dressed and ready to go. No abdominal pain, no nausea. He hadn’t vomited in over 12 hours. He was worried that he wouldn’t get out of the hospital in time to get his methadone.

What about Spice? the doctor asked. If he went back to smoking it, he’d end up back in the hospital. Never again, he promised. He never wanted to feel that way again. He was out the door within the hour.

How the Patient Is Doing:

I spoke with the patient recently. After several days, he did go back to smoking Spice. And he’s been back in the hospital twice in the month since Dr. Brady first saw him.

It’s strange, but perhaps not unexpected. In the original case reports of cannabinoid hyperemesis, few of the pot smokers diagnosed with this syndrome were willing to give up their drug, even when they knew it made them so sick. It’s perhaps just one more way that the synthetic stuff is like the real thing".
 
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