Bupe Told My Bupe Doc That the Bupe Dosages Commonly Scripted are Unnecessarily High

[fluckimissed420]

off topic slightly yet i wanna know who here on bluelight actually had the 16/32 suboxone daily dose and it was necessary and i wanna know how much and what kind of opiates they were on and how long... all the general details.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

OBVIOUSLY YOUR JUDGEMENT OF MEDICATING YOURSELF IS WAAAAAYYYYYY FUCKED UP OR YOU WOULDN'T BE THERE

nuff said

That's 100% incorrect, I don't see how you could say such a thing.

For example, if you have no ability to self-medicate, you would go to a methadone clinic. Or, you would go to the pharmacy on a daily basis to pick up 1 pill of Suboxone/Subutex at a time.

The point of going to a doctor's office once a month is because you can self-medicate as needed, which is a lot easier than going to a methadone clinic.

I am sorry if you don't have that level of self-restraint that I know I and others do, but that's the idea behind out-patient ORT.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Most junkies just want as much as they can get, if a doctor suggested 2 mgs a day they person would be outraged as well

Do you have a study to back that up, or is that just an opinion?

Most people would be outraged at a 2mg/day prescription because most people need more than that.

Well it does actually make them knowledable. If we knew so much about being a doctor then why are we junkies. look, this OP's best efforts in life have gotten him a seat in a shrinks office taking subs, as I said before. Discuss with your doctor, don't just lower your dose or up it as you feel. The doctor thinks "what an idiot". If you were so good at being a doctor then you would be one. Everone should do what they are good at, and you my friend are good at being a junkie, not a doctor. Don't mean to anger anyone although I am sure it will as it's the junkies other favorite thing justifiable anger, yipeee

You're just plain retarded/trolling.

You may be a junkie (that's what you implied with the word 'we'), but I am not one. You don't spend 15 months of your life not using heroin if you're a junkie. How do you know what the doctor thinks?

The qualifications for becoming a doctor are not "you have to be good at being one".

I'm not angry at you. You're making yourself look ignorant, and no wonder junkies get such a bad reputation; it's because of people like you. I would be angry if I was still using heroin, but I'm not. I'm embarrassed for you, I really am. If I were you, I'd find it hard to come back to face the perpetual ridicule you'll receive if you keep posting so ignorantly here.

thats just ridiculous.

who in here has said they're shooting dope and coke every weekend on maintenance? noone.

even if they were, that's their perogative and not for discussion in here, so keep it on topic.

Thank you.

fuck me man, we're not all drug fuelled junkies in here, some are in or studying in the medical fields. *cough*one of our OD mods is a pharmacist*cough*

In his logic, DJSim either would be or would not be a pharmacist because he's "so good at being one". There's no "process" to becoming a pharmacist. You either are or aren't one in his mind.

Which, obviously is ignorant to assume, and blatantly false/not correct at all.

Disregarding the offensiveness and inaccuracy of this statement, don't you think most "junkies" would rather take a dose of a drug that is actually enjoyable and doesn't have a ton of unwanted side effects?

ZING.

off topic slightly yet i wanna know who here on bluelight actually had the 16/32 suboxone daily dose and it was necessary and i wanna know how much and what kind of opiates they were on and how long... all the general details.

I was given 16mg/day at first. 6mg was all I needed for the first few days, then I was on 2mg or less from there on out.

 

[lozgod]

I also find this hard to beleive..everyone is different thats for sure

but just from personal experience even at a 300-400mg habit that you have goin for a while 2mg aint gonna do the trick to get me well if im withdrawin bad. maybe after 4-5 dyas id be totally stable on 2mg

600mg is to get off. It is about 90-120 to get un-ill. But on Wednesday I woke up sick in the middle of the night and broke a half of a half and 45 minutes later I was sleeping again. I wasn't 100% well when I woke up. Still had nausea but no sweats, RLS, diarehha, etc.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

A friend of mine shot heroin for about 3 years, pretty heavy use, at least $100+ per day. He's now on 16 mg per day bupe (has been for about a year now), and that hasn't stopped him from having cravings for heroin occasionally, and sometimes acting upon those cravings. That said, he's a lot better off than he used to be, so maybe the high dosage of buprenorphine is in fact helping him have less cravings than he would with a lower dose...I honestly don't know, though. Simply informed? speculation on my part.

Shooting a G+ worth of good quality heroin per day for 3 years is a case which might actually require 16mg to 32mg per day.

Buprenorphine may never fully satiate a long term/heavy user. This is why some people are prescribed up to 32mg per day.

However, for someone who used more conservatively and took breaks here and there, 8mg or less is a better dose range.

Individuals are different though, and there's many many many more factors than this that go into how much you need to use, so it's fair to say it's hard to "determine" how much one needs with a limited amount of information.

It is *possible* that your friend was taking too much buprenorphine, and that's why he had drug cravings. A lower dose of buprenorphine is typically more euphoric than a higher one. However, it may not have to do with that at all, it's hard to know without fiddling around with your dose to see what works best for you.

600mg is to get off. It is about 90-120 to get un-ill. But on Wednesday I woke up sick in the middle of the night and broke a half of a half and 45 minutes later I was sleeping again. I wasn't 100% well when I woke up. Still had nausea but no sweats, RLS, diarehha, etc.

How long have you used oxycodone to get to such a high tolerance?

 

[lozgod]

How long have you used oxycodone to get to such a high tolerance?

10 years but my daily habit has been about 3.

 

[sixpartseven]

Shooting $100 worth of good quality heroin per day for 3 years is a case which might actually require 16mg to 32mg per day.

Buprenorphine may never fully satiate a long term/heavy user. This is why some people are prescribed up to 32mg per day.

I disagree. I was using about 2 grams a day (over $200) in my 6th year of addiction and when I switched to Suboxone, I was fine with 2 - 4mg a day.

Everyone, no more mentioning prices, even when explaining your tolerance. I know I just did, and I shouldn't have, but stick to to listing quantity if needed, not price. The price doesn't always equal the same quantity for everyone anyways, so it's best to list quantity.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I disagree. I was using about 2 grams a day (over $200) in my 6th year of addiction and when I switched to Suboxone, I was fine with 2 - 4mg a day.

I see, well I guess there's more variables and how much you used for how long is just one of them.

Everyone, no more mentioning prices, even when explaining your tolerance. I know I just did, and I shouldn't have, but stick to to listing quantity if needed, not price. The price doesn't always equal the same quantity for everyone anyways, so it's best to list quantity.

I changed over to listing a quantity. That's a good request. Naming quantities is OK, prices have to go in the price thread.

10 years but my daily habit has been about 3.

I see. I imagined something along those lines, just was curious. It would be harder for me to imagine someone getting up to that tolerance level in a month or something.

 

[Jabberwocky]

How long have you used oxycodone to get to such a high tolerance?

10 years but my daily habit has been about 3.

to put that in perspective. it took me 3 months of fentanyl abuse and one month of oxy use to reach a 600mg dose to get high. before the fentanyl i'd really only had a habit to no more than 1mg of bupe for around 18months or however long i used those patches for PM.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

to put that in perspective. it took me 3 months of fentanyl abuse and one month of oxy use to reach a 600mg dose to get high. before the fentanyl i'd really only had a habit to no more than 1mg of bupe for around 18months or however long i used those patches for PM.

Oh wow, that's interesting. I have never had such a high opiate tolerance. My H use never exceed 0.2-0.4g per day at the worst of it.

 

[oliphill]

yep, i've come off a few high dose fent binges and 2mg (IV mind you, so 100% BA) held me just fine, it even alleviated all my pain symptons.

Hi, would 2mg IV in 1 dose hold you for 24 hours? I am switching to subutex next week and will probably be prescribed 2mg. I want to IV it, but want to make sure my prescribed dose will hold me 24 hours a day.

What do you guys think is better; 1 X 2mg subutex IV in the morning or say 4 X 0.5mg hits spread through the day. Bear in mind this is just an example if I am prescribed 2mg per day. I want the best results for being 'held' consistently throughout each day. (I know for that I would probably get better results sublingually, but if I can achieve the same IV I would prefer that)

 

[oliphill]

So I agree that these Docs may overprescribe, although I did say I still had cravings in order to get more to help out friends. He ended up prescribing me the max dose of 32mg/day, for a vicodin habit mind you.

AND OVER A MONTH CLEAN! Wtf. He should have just prescribed you Naltrexone (sp?).

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Hi, would 2mg IV in 1 dose hold you for 24 hours? I am switching to subutex next week and will probably be prescribed 2mg. I want to IV it, but want to make sure my prescribed dose will hold me 24 hours a day.

What do you guys think is better; 1 X 2mg subutex IV in the morning or say 4 X 0.5mg hits spread through the day. Bear in mind this is just an example if I am prescribed 2mg per day. I want the best results for being 'held' consistently throughout each day. (I know for that I would probably get better results sublingually, but if I can achieve the same IV I would prefer that)

four 0.5mg IV hits throughout the day for sure. No questions asked.

You'll probably be prescribed 8mg per day or more.

 

[oliphill]

four 0.5mg IV hits throughout the day for sure. No questions asked.

You'll probably be prescribed 8mg per day or more.

You reckon? I'm only on 20mg Methadone.

Off topic-ish..I have been using 1g + a day Heroin for the last year and less, more spaced out for the last 2 - 3 years. Stupidly I cut down from 40mg to 20g methadone while I was still using, saving up all my doses (so not actually lowering my tolerance!). But I've been back at home with my parents for 10 days now, with no gear and have adjusted to 20mg methadone just fine. It was quite hard, but no where near as bad as I was expecting. I've been taking Devils Claw herbal supplement for my muscle pain problem I get with withdrawals and it seems to have worked wonders!

Anyway,, so yeah I'm fully adjusted to 20mg methadone, so you u think that equates to 8mg Sub a day?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

You reckon? I'm only on 20mg Methadone.

Off topic-ish..I have been using 1g + a day Heroin for the last year and less, more spaced out for the last 2 - 3 years. Stupidly I cut down from 40mg to 20g methadone while I was still using, saving up all my doses (so not actually lowering my tolerance!). But I've been back at home with my parents for 10 days now, with no gear and have adjusted to 20mg methadone just fine. It was quite hard, but no where near as bad as I was expecting. I've been taking Devils Claw herbal supplement for my muscle pain problem I get with withdrawals and it seems to have worked wonders!

Anyway,, so yeah I'm fully adjusted to 20mg methadone, so you u think that equates to 8mg Sub a day?

Most doctors prescribe at least 8mg of Suboxone a day. Some actually know not to prescribe that much, but it's just common for doctors to RX that much.

For you though, you can probably get by on 2mg per day. At first you may want up to 4mg or 6mg per day but I think 4mg would be the most you'd want to take.

As for how much methadone equals how much Suboxone, I have no idea. I know my friend was 100% unimpressed with 20mg methadone but liked Suboxone doses (equivalent to 2-4mg/day) but it's hard for me to say since I've never had methadone.

 

[Cane2theLeft]

^I have repeatedly heard that its very difficult to state with any certainty what doses of full agonists are equipotent to buprenorphine due to its unique partial-agonist properties.

I think its fair to say however that due to the doses prescribed, many users (especially those sans-tolerance) often underestimate bupe's potency.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

^I have repeatedly heard that its very difficult to state with any certainty what doses of full agonists are equipotent to buprenorphine due to its unique partial-agonist properties.

I think its fair to say however that due to the doses prescribed, many users (especially those sans-tolerance) often underestimate bupe's potency.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

It depends on a lot of things, like tolerance, etc.

 

[Blackvinegar2]

you are COMPLETELY right! I was on suboxone for 5 months up untill thanksgiving.. I was on 8MG a day, which I thought was a completely ridiculous dose. Me being an addict, naturally when I first met with the doctor, I told him I was using WAYYY more than what I really was to try and get started on more suboxone to get high. Well what blew my mind is he took my word for it and started me out on 8MG.. And despite what lies the sub doctors tell you, I DID INDEED get high off the suboxone for the first 2 weeks of taking it. actually REALLY high. The reason they prescribe you so much suboxone, is so they can get more money out of you. Thats how they make money off of you, I seriously could be "held" over with just like 2 MG a day, and not the 8mg I was on. Then this croak of a doctor decided I needed to get off the suboxone (its a long story why) and "weaned" me off of 8MG down to 0MG in A WEEK AND A HALF! thats right, a week and a half. And told me I was going to feel NO withdrawals. Well I had one of the toughest withdrawals I have ever had, and I have withdrawaled off of MS-contin, Oxycontin, Dilaudid, Heroin, Vicodin, Etc. before! So then I full blown relapsed on heroin to combat my withdrawals and be normal. Fast forward to 4 days ago, I got started at the methadone clinic. And I couldn't be any happier! People that are on suboxone maintenance have been arguing with me on youtube comments lately, And you know what? Suboxone sucks. Yeah thats right, IT SUCKS. They tell me "have fun being a slave to methadone blah blah" and stuff like that. Well IMO suboxone sucks, And doesn't even really hold you over. Suboxone is good for someone with a vicodin habit, or a percocet habit. But when you are coming off a heroin habit, methadone is the way to go. Its WAYYY cheaper, The people at the clinic actually know what they are talking about, and know alot about the drug methadone, And methadone very very effectively holds me over. It doesn't really get me high, But it def gives me a buzz that I need to kill any cravings I have. Suboxone didn't give me this buzz and made me feel like why the hell am I on this suboxone if all its doing is just making me feel not sick in the morning and not doing anything for cravings? suboxone is a huge waste of time and money, I will gladly be a "methadonian junkie" than to waste money on a garbage maintenance drug! If you are on suboxone and it works for you, Then please don't take this message as negative.

 

[KnowBudz]

The old saw about doctors "being only in it for the money" is bullshit. There are surely those few shysters, but the notion that they prescribe higher doses to make more doesn't hold water.

There are guidelines for prescribing suboxone but, simply stated, the doc wants a dose that adequately controls symptoms and has a blocking effect. With methadone, you start low and the dose is slowly titrated up until the patient is stable. Suboxone works differently and many patients are simply dosed at some level, wiith perhaps a later uptick for coverage. Many of us have been able to slowly taper down, learning that we can get by with less. Most do so on their own rather than following something imposed by their doc.

 

[Blackvinegar2]

yeah whatever dude. You must know everything right? Since you have met my old suboxone doctor and know how he works right? He was completely in it for the money dude. You think these doctors just have hearts and wan't to desperately help some drug junkie? NO WRONG!!! they are in it for the cash bro. Thats is all they care about! suboxone sucks, It is on of the biggest drug treatment scams there is here in america. Sure methadone clinics are just as worse for money, But at least they know what they are talking about, and you get an effective opiate maintenance drug for a reasonable price!