Lysergamides The Teeny and Tiny IPr-LAD Thread

[Didgital]

As a theoretical SAR chemist, I have to wonder why we've never seen IPR-LAD (6-isopropyl-6-nor-LSD) in the wild, especially as AL-LAD and even ETH-LAD are popular. My understanding of the IPR group is that it shares similarities to the Ethyl group.

I am always wondering such things. It's essentially a nor-LSD compound but instead of an allyl (AL-LAD), ethyl (ETH-LAD), or propyl (PRO-LAD), there is an Isopropyl group. It has the same potency as AL-LAD, but aside from that hardly anything is known..

 

[MsDiz]

Apply for funding and go on the search?

 

[Xorkoth]

My speculation is twofold: first, the 6-subs have been determined to be quite wasteful of precursors, as their yields are far lower than the 1-subs, and the synths are more difficult. The producers of ETH-LAD and AL-LAD stated some time back they would not be making more because the profit margins were too narrow or something. That said, someone did make AL-LAD again since it was so popular.

The other reason, I think, is that generally, isopropyl groups are wild cards on psychedelics, causing unpredictable changes to what you might expect from the molecules. So they're risky, especially with difficult and low-yield (and expensive) lysergamide synths. Take 2C-iP... it is very impotent, with generally no real positive reports and some negative pones. Seems like a dud. It was available for years and there are only a few reports. DOiP is less of a dud, but Shulgin himself stated that he took it up to 4mg and had absolutely no effects. I have some and me and some friends have tried it, and all of us get effects, but I find it rather jittery and much less good than other DOXs, and also entirely non0-visual. Some of my friends liked it better.

Now, look at 2C-T-4, which is 2C-iP but with the sulphur bridge of the 2C-T-X family. 2C-T-4, instead of being impotent, is extremely potent, and has unique effects, some people find it one of their favorites, other hate it. Most describe it as somewhat dissociative. it's also very long-lasting, unlike 2C-iP and DOiP, which are shorter than their related brethren.

And finally, look at DiPT... this one is the craziest of all, as it produces a profound and unbelievable shift in hearing rather than visuals. It's like DMT for your ears. That's just so strange! And unpredictable, who would have guessed? And MiPT is unus7al too, though not as much so.

Anyway my point is that isopropyl groups are strange, and kind of a crapshoot. In the case of complex lysergamides with difficult synths, the risk probably outweighs the potential reward. And Shulgin never made isoPRO-LAD in TIHKAL so there is nothing to go off of, unlike the other 6-subs we're seen.

I expect we'll see PRO-LAD before isoPRO-LAD. But I hope we see them both!

 

[Delsyd]

My speculation is twofold: first, the 6-subs have been determined to be quite wasteful of precursors, as their yields are far lower than the 1-subs, and the synths are more difficult. The producers of ETH-LAD and AL-LAD stated some time back they would not be making more because the profit margins were too narrow or something. That said, someone did make AL-LAD again since it was so popular.

Off topic:
They actually just came out with 1cP-AL-LAD. I don't know enough about chemistry to say whether this is a 1 or 6 position. But it's nice to know that AL-LAD in some form is sticking around.

 

[Xorkoth]

It's a 6-sub with a 1-sub tacked on it

 

[DrumTripper]

Well they certainly do pass the cost on to the consumer; these aren’t cheap, like the parent 25.

 

[cosmic charlie]

Very true I can get regular L cheaper.

But I love to have novel drug expériences so will gladly pay à bit more to make that happen. Would love to try this 1cP-AL-LAD that just hit the scène.

IPR-LAD could be great and I would try it in a heartbeat as well just recently tried DOiP and I loved it so im obviously curious about what that substitution will do on other compounds. Hopefully they will bring it to us eventually.

 

[Didgital]

The other reason, I think, is that generally, isopropyl groups are wild cards on psychedelics, causing unpredictable changes to what you might expect from the molecules

True but theres def some lovely isopropyl tryptamines out there, and since the tryptamine skeleton found within lysergamides, I speculate it could be a real gem...

 

[Bitchniggaz]

needs another 6!
Something like (6-isopropyl-6-nor-6-blablaLuciferSatanDevil)

 

[DrumTripper]

After enjoying 1cp-lsd, I'm curious to see if 1cp-eth-lad will ever come out. I'm a believer in eth-lad because it is just a touch more potent than the other Ls.
I have found the 1cp-lsd to be very easy on the onset, in terms of nausea; whereas eth-lad always gives me a tummy trouble ride (worth it for the crisp visuals!).
But like mentioned above, precursors and production might make that a non-starter. But 1cp-al-lad though, right?!?

 

[perpetualdawn]

I always thought this one would be nicknamed IP-LAD which just sounds delicious, and rolls off the tongue nicely.. and sounds like the son of kung-fu master Ip Man. But either way I'd _love_ to sample IPR-LAD.

And Shulgin never made isoPRO-LAD in TIHKAL so there is nothing to go off of, unlike the other 6-subs we're seen.

I vaguely remember reading that Nichols synthed IPR-LAD.. not sure if I'm fabricating that, anyone else recall?

 

[izo]

Anyway my point is that isopropyl groups are strange, and kind of a crapshoot.

You cannot make such estimates based on isopropyl groups located on such different positions such as 6-lsyergamide, on the 4 of psychedelic peas or the n,n,-dipt molecules.

But as you mentioned 2c-t-4. I found it quite hard and not that worthwhile, would compare it somehow to 2c-e. Now that I heard such glowing reports on 2c-t-7 with it being on par with 2c-b recreational wise I have to remark that this rec. potential totally gets lost with 2c-t-4. it’s more like a hard and stressful psychedelic with not that much that you can gain from it insight wise, compared to 2c-t-4.

Now IPR-LAD I would suspect to be a bit weaker than the other alkylated lsygergamides, more like AL-LAD, perhaps something really soft and beautiful like 4aco-dipt. But that’s just a wild guess.

 

[Psychestim]

But as you mentioned 2c-t-4. I found it quite hard and not that worthwhile, would compare it somehow to 2c-e. Now that I heard such glowing reports on 2c-t-7 with it being on par with 2c-b recreational wise I have to remark that this rec. potential totally gets lost with 2c-t-4. it’s more like a hard and stressful psychedelic with not that much that you can gain from it insight wise, compared to 2c-t-4.

I found 2C-T-4 to be very worthwhile at a higher dose, just as much of a gem as 2C-T-7 but not nearly as user-friendly. The strong headspace, the physicality, the very long duration and the strong stimulation on the comedown were quite something. 2C-T-7 has a much clearer headspace, more OEV’s and a more sensible duration. It’s a much better recreational drug than T-4 which is why it got so much more popular I think. I can’t really see the T-4/2C-E comparison, except they’re both intense and demanding psychedelics which should be treated with caution.

Now IPR-LAD I would suspect to be a bit weaker than the other alkylated lsygergamides, more like AL-LAD, perhaps something really soft and beautiful like 4aco-dipt. But that’s just a wild guess.

My mouth waters at the thought of new N6-substituted lysergamides. Feed me IP-LAD, PRO-LAD, PARGY-LAD, CN-LAD, YN-LAD, V-LAD, FE-LAD, TFM-LAD, even BU-LAD, I really don’t care.

 

[izo]

I can’t really see the T-4/2C-E comparison, except they’re both intense and demanding psychedelics which should be treated with caution.

Yeah that’s true, had 10mg of t4 3 or 4 times. Then I had 2c-t-21 100mg. That were my only thio 2c‘s.

 

[Psychestim]

Yeah that’s true, had 10mg of t4 3 or 4 times. Then I had 2c-t-21 100mg. That were my only thio 2c‘s.

The one time I took 10mg 2C-T-4 I didn’t enjoy it either. I was confused, nauseous and in general discomfort for hours but when I took 15mg I loved it. It was completely different at that dose.

Would love to try 2C-T-21, I’m sure I’d like it very much. How’s the T-21 bodyload and headspace compared to T-4?

 

[izo]

Found 2c-t-21 Not partculary interesting. The best thio 2cs seem definitively to be 2c-t-2 and 2c-t-7 (about as equally good) and the best there is seems to be 2c-t-13, a good Bit better than t2 and t7.

 

[Psychestim]

and the best there is seems to be 2c-t-13

Why’s that? Was it ever available?

 

[izo]

I friend got some hands on it, got it recommended by some old drug guy, tested it along with 2c-t-2 and 2c-t-7 and found it better a fair bit. He said t2 and t7 are on par with doc which I rate as high as 2c-b and these both both are along the best psychedelic peas I know. So 2c-t-13 takes the cake, never seen it publicly sold though.

 

[Xorkoth]

Interesting, the PIHKAL observations don't really stand out, though it does make it sound worthwhile.

 

[Xorkoth]

I decided to make this our "Big and Dandy" for this drug. It's both teeny and tiny at the moment, though.