• DPMC Moderators: thegreenhand | tryptakid
  • Drug Policy & Media Coverage Welcome Guest
    View threads about
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
    Drug Busts Megathread Video Megathread

The link between weed and schizophrenia is way more complicated than we thought

slimvictor

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
6,483
Study finds genetic overlap between cannabis use and schizophrenia

The association between marijuana and schizophrenia is historically fraught. In the 1960's and 1970's, scientists thought that smoking weed could trigger psychosis in just about anyone. Today, these findings are more nuanced, but researchers still think that cannabis can trigger schizophrenia in people who are predisposed to the disease — meaning those with family histories of the disorder. Yet, in the last decade, some scientists have actually started to look at the effect in reverse. The resulting studies suggest that the neurobiology underlying schizophrenia might also put people affected by the disorder at increased risk for smoking pot. But these results haven't garnered nearly as much attention as studies suggesting the opposite.

Now, a new study, published today in Molecular Psychiatry, lends further support to the idea that schizophrenia plays a role in an individual's likelihood of smoking weed, by showing that the genetic variants predicting schizophrenia can also be used to predict a person's tendency to smoke pot, regardless of their mental health history. This, researchers say, demonstrates that the causal relationship between cannabis use and schizophrenia might not be clear cut, and that at least a small part of the association might be caused by genetic overlap, where the same genes that predispose certain people to enjoying weed might also predispose others to developing schizophrenia — or both.

To tease apart this relationship, researchers took genetic data from recently published studies of schizophrenia, and identified genetic variants associated with the disease. Then, they applied that information to a random sample of about 2,000 healthy Australians to see if those variants could also predict cannabis use.

cont at
http://www.theverge.com/2014/6/24/5...nd-schizophrenia-is-way-more-complicated-than
 
"Furthermore, some studies have found that smoking pot accelerates the development of schizophrenia in those who are genetically predisposed, but that association took a hit in 2010, when researchers found that accounting for things like gender, lifetime mental health history, and socioeconomic status erased the effect." <- excerpt from article

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2900481/ <- This study being refered to

((scathe scathe scathe))

I looked into the "erasure" claim made in this portion of the article and found out a few things in the research that make me wonder. There were 4 variables to predict a lifetime history of cannabis use disorders in first-episode subjects (one more than the 3 mentioned in the article): male gender, lower subject socio-economics status, better premorbid childhood social adjustment, and more severe positive symptoms at study entry. I see no need to leave that last one out, other than to give the article some sense of balance.

So, these variables predict whether or not a young adult schizophrenic patient had a lifetime history of cannabis use disorder NOT whether or not they had used cannabis. They used multivariate logarithmic recursion, which I have some untrusting familiarity with. The claim in question is that of the article. The study has some clever things to say about smoking dope... and I have some equally ingenious questions, however, this claim really boils down to the strength of the mathematical recursion model. This plot describes 32% of the variation. This model would certainly give you erroneous results. I would not use it for anything.
 
Last edited:
Anyone who has a family history of schizophrenia would be well advised to avoid cannabis use, but if they continue to use, they may well benefit from the following:

"A study from the Orygen Research Centre in Melbourne suggests that omega-3 fatty acids could also help delay or prevent the onset of schizophrenia. The researchers enlisted 81 'high risk' young people aged 13 to 24 who had previously suffered brief hallucinations or delusions and gave half of them capsules of fish oil while the other half received fish-tasting dummy subtitute. One year on, only three percent of those on fish oil had developed schizophrenia compared to 28 percent from those on the substitute, but the result has not yet been published in a peer reviewed journal.[13]"

View: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fish_oil & http://www.oilofpisces.com/depression.html#depression Check out: http://www.google.com/search?q=niac...qgv1NRI&oq=niacin;+psychosis&aq=0&aqi=g1&aql=

A post on natural treatments for psychosis (visual / auditory hallucinations, and / or delusional beliefs) may be found at https://au.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140525052114AAO7Lf0
 
^
If omega 3 really stopped the onset of Schizophrenia I think we would know it by now. Or there would be very little if any at all cases of Schizophrenia in people from regions of Southern Italy, and Japan where people eat diets with a lot of fish.

I know someone who grew up as a child and teenager with a diet rich in omega 3 straight from fish and seafood, and they still became Schizophrenic, and so did two of their children, and one grandchild. It all happened to them at different stages of life. The original person was diagnosed as a young teenager, their one child was diagnosed during their pre-teen years, their other child had a psychotic break in their early 40s and was diagnosed then, and the grandchild was diagnosed in their young adult years at 19 or 20.

This person originally became Schizophrenic from either their father or grandfather. They told me how they smoked pot once but how being high just made everything slow down, and it was difficult to concentrate. So they never smoked it again. They did take medicinal THC like marinol that was prescribed to them so they would gain weight after having a surgery; but they said all it did was make them crave and eat too much junk food, and they would feel tired from the synthetic THC.
 
Last edited:
It might have to do with where those people in the study live, not enough fish in their diet?

Are you getting enough Omega 3, with the way they prepare fish?

Don't know much about it.
 
It might have to do with where those people in the study live, not enough fish in their diet?

Are you getting enough Omega 3, with the way they prepare fish?

Don't know much about it.

I'm not Schizophrenic. The mental illness does not run in my family, or our heritage.

The people I mentioned ate a lot of fish because they lived near the ocean in various countries. They also would take OTC Omega-3 supplements, and ate foods rich in omega-3 besides fish or seafood like nuts, tofu, and vegetables that have a lot of it yet they still became Schizophrenic since it runs in their family.
 
I should point out - though I feel certain that both Priest and Pnose are acutely aware of this - that just a few counter-examples don't say anything about the larger trends. Statistically valid trends > case studies as far as trustworthiness and general applicability.

(Not to say that your story is meaningless, Priest. In fact, it is very relevant to the study ClickHere cited, which got such robust results that it should be questioned. And, of course, it is interesting as a case study. I am just saying that we need more data, more than anything...)
 
I think this is the takeaway: The link between weed and schizophrenia is way more complicated than we thought
 
But personally I don't believe that there is a specific link between weed and schizophrenia
 
But personally I don't believe that there is a specific link between weed and schizophrenia

You should read more about it then. It's not just hype and correlation many Schizophrenics have their first psychotic break high on marijuana. Weed causes psychosis more often than you'd think (more than once a century).
 
I will definitely read more into it. Please by all means tell me more. I'm really trying to begin a blog about my route I'm taking with opiate addiction and would like to start a thread. But do to the "50" post rule I can't just yet
 
I'm about ready to say to hell with attempting to begin a thread for some input. This 50 post bs is ridiculous.

I think you just need to calm down about it. Your last 3 posts only counted as one post. You know what is going to happen if you don't post in the next 5-10 minutes??? The world ending. If you have a pressing concern ask about it in the drug basic forum. If you want to blow through 32 posts as fast as you can then go to the lounge and do it.

I'm not Schizophrenic. The mental illness does not run in my family, or our heritage.
I didn't mean 'you' I meant, you know, people. You know? I just talk that way and it doesn't come out right when I type it. Sorry.
 
I will definitely read more into it. Please by all means tell me more. I'm really trying to begin a blog about my route I'm taking with opiate addiction and would like to start a thread. But do to the "50" post rule I can't just yet
You can make threads in the new member forum you can also make blogs on like actual blog websites that would probably be more fun for blogging.
 
Last edited:
And we here frown on such compulsive double posting. Welcome to BL though Drew187!

You can make threads in the new member forum you can also make blogs on like actual blog websites that would probably be more fun for blogging.

Personally I've known a few schizophrenic folks (even dated one) who didn't really enjoy cannabis all that much but also didn't have issues with it. Most of the folks I've encountered who have had such problems with drugs tend to have them related to stims and conditions like amphetamine psychosis. Not saying weed couldn't bring it out. I also have known one girl for whom it did, although her liberal ingestion of magic brownies probably didn't help.

I wonder if, when it comes to schizophrenia, for the people who experience it something like amphetamine psychosis is more of an issue than cannabis... Not like it really matters honestly.

There's not a simply answer.
 
And we here frown on such compulsive double posting. Welcome to BL though Drew187!



Personally I've known a few schizophrenic folks (even dated one) who didn't really enjoy cannabis all that much but also didn't have issues with it. Most of the folks I've encountered who have had such problems with drugs tend to have them related to stims and conditions like amphetamine psychosis. Not saying weed couldn't bring it out. I also have known one girl for whom it did, although her liberal ingestion of magic brownies probably didn't help.

I wonder if, when it comes to schizophrenia, for the people who experience it something like amphetamine psychosis is more of an issue than cannabis... Not like it really matters honestly.

There's not a simply answer.
I have an anecdotal sort of thing to input here. My Criminology teacher said that 90% of people who came to the hospital suffering psychosis had only pot in their drug test sometimes alcohol. Like the people who had to be held for monitoring just because they are so crazy. 90% (think of the 10% who were amphetamine psychosis or hopped on other crazy drugs). This was not an anti-pot teacher she had worked mostly with criminals and people addicted to harder stuff and often voiced her dislike of the prison population and sentences for "just weed". This might not be a proper post but if you believed my teacher it would make you think.
 
Naw, I don't honestly give them that much credit. I'd have to know them a lot better.

As a teacher and professor, I met a lot of fucking stupid teachers and professors...

I assume you mean that she voiced her dislike for the fact there is so much racial and socioeconomic disparity, mandatory minimums, extraordinarily harsh sentences relative to nearly every other western country and the general state of mass incarceration? When you say, she "voiced her dislike of the prison population and sentences for "just weed." I'm easily confused you see.
 
Naw, I don't honestly give them that much credit. I'd have to know them a lot better.

As a teacher and professor, I met a lot of fucking stupid teachers and professors...

I assume you mean that she voiced her dislike for the fact there is so much racial and socioeconomic disparity, mandatory minimums, extraordinarily harsh sentences relative to nearly every other western country and the general state of mass incarceration? When you say, she "voiced her dislike of the prison population and sentences for "just weed." I'm easily confused you see.

She included marijuanna offences in her dislike of prison terms and population. She generally doesn't approve of the way prisons are managed in my country. She said she once asked a prison guard "Do you ever ask that inmate how his day was or why he's upset?" and the answer was no because that's not my job (but it is in their job description to treat inmates as humans or something like that I can find the source if you want). There's also a huge bullshit campaign by our prime minister about being tough on crime leading the voting population (older folks) to believe that more needs to be done and he's the guy to do it. When crime is so fucking low we don't need one more cop or prison in the whole damn country. Sorry I am mildly passionate about the subject ramble ramble did I clarify your confusion?
 
Yeah crime was at its lowest rate in 40 years when the c-10 omnibus crime bill was passed to replace it. They had some disgusting lie for each of the legislation categories to dupe the public into thinking it would help them. Some corrections bastard was like "there won't be more people in jail, the people in jail will just be in there longer."
 
Top