The Big & Dandy Dangerous Combinations Thread

twentysix · Oct 13, 2012

Great Idea.

Sweetshare · Oct 13, 2012

Survived Abortion said:
Did you have any negative effects at all, or was it just a normal empathogen + dissociative combo?

Probably the second. The main danger is dehydration, and as a fact - it is difficult to control the behavior.

johannes kreisler · Oct 14, 2012

"Speed"+K

yesterday I was on some strong speed (took it ....ehrm... 3 times and every time thougth: this is weird, euphoria is low if u take low doses, then if you take more there is some euphoria and clarity and a lot of stimulation - that doesn't subside for ages (well into the next day). i guess its an amphe/meth/caffeine cut...). then i wanted to just take a little line more (was just laying around on the table, not prepared by myself), maybe somewhere between 30-50mg...
I immediately knew from the taste that it was this other white powder my buddies were snorting form time to time. don't get my wrong. I like ketamine. but it just feels obvious for me that you shouldn't mix speed and K. intuition kinda thing...
10min later I was floored, breathing heavily, mentally fuckin high in a good way. physically it felt like meltdown is imminent (feelings of fainting; slight deja vu feeling of this n2o-cracking-noise-in-your-ears (some will know, I'm sure

) was there too, now that I think of it). VERY high temperature and heart rate and bloodpressure. having laid down a friend took care of me, gave me some water, sprinkled me with some water, light massage. with the k-peak subsiding it slowly got better and turned out to be quite a nice experience (even took 2 small(!) bumbs later

)...
but anyway: this combo did definitely feel dangerous. I would not do it again and I would not advise anyone else to do it. (both doses were relatively high though)

I hereby claim to have enough experience under my belt to differentiate between a panic attac, idiosyncratic reaction or primary drug effect.

I'm 99% sure it was the last one here. would be very interested in other reports though!

Crashing · Oct 15, 2012

Mixing opioids with acid is perfectly fine, mixing any stimulant (including coffee) or opiate with any NMDA antagonist such as PCP, DXM, or K is extremely dangerous so you should make a couple changes.

bloodshed344 · Oct 15, 2012

In response to some earlier posts about mixing 2c's (specifically 2c-t-2) with MAOI's:

I took 15 mg 2c-t-2 with a small dose of syrian rue and no bad side effects and a subjectively different, stronger, and more visual trip than I would have otherwise with the same dose. No increase in side effects yet there would have been if I had taken enough 2c-t-2 (by itself) for that amount of effects.

I believe this is a potentially very dangerous combo in overdose but I think also that it may (keyword) be completely safe if you know the right dose for yourself.

I only tried it after reading the positive erowid report on the experience.

Survived Abortion · Oct 15, 2012

johannes kreisler said:
I like ketamine. but it just feels obvious for me that you shouldn't mix speed and K. intuition kinda thing...
10min later I was floored, breathing heavily, mentally fuckin high in a good way. physically it felt like meltdown is imminent (feelings of fainting; slight deja vu feeling of this n2o-cracking-noise-in-your-ears (some will know, I'm sure ) was there too, now that I think of it). VERY high temperature and heart rate and bloodpressure. having laid down a friend took care of me, gave me some water, sprinkled me with some water, light massage. with the k-peak subsiding it slowly got better and turned out to be quite a nice experience (even took 2 small(!) bumbs later )...
but anyway: this combo did definitely feel dangerous. I would not do it again and I would not advise anyone else to do it. (both doses were relatively high though)

This actually sounds like a typical ketamine high. I've known some people to try ketamine for the first time and almost freak out (in a tranquillized kinda way) because it's just too overwhelming. Stimulants (such as cocaine) definitely have a synergistic effect with ketamine, intensifying certain aspects of the high, and lucidifying other aspects. Considering the dopaminergic action of the arylcyclohexylamine dissociatives, it is not surprising that you may have felt a little overstimulated.

Crashing said:
Mixing opioids with acid is perfectly fine, mixing any stimulant (including coffee) or opiate with any NMDA antagonist such as PCP, DXM, or K is extremely dangerous so you should make a couple changes.

I'm not sure this applies to ketamine. Cocaine + ketamine is a very well-known combo which appears to be relatively safe (given that few if any have reported negative symptoms with it). MDMA + Ketamine is another well-known and well-trodden combo which appears to be relatively safe. I am talking both from extensive personal experience, and from reading experiences by many others who have taken these combos.

How this applies to methoxetamine and PCP - and of course DXM - is another matter, and there have been many reports of negative interactions between empathogens such as MDMA and MXE. It's still a relatively new compound, so we are still learning about all it's quirks.

Survived Abortion · Oct 15, 2012

Crashing · Oct 15, 2012

Yeah, you are probably right about the Ketamine being safer than DXM. I have combined K with DXM, LSD, and Mushrooms and with opiates *but* i had a very high opiate tolerance. I was assuming the NMDA ant. properties were responsible for it's likelyhood of causing undesirable interactions. I know for a fact with DXM that opiates can stop your breathing at a very small dose, but again it's very dose/tolerance dependent. Someone tripping on DXM for their first time and taking a 5mg vicoden orally for their first time could end up dead, while another person could inject 30mgs+ of oxy and be fine. It's just too big of a gamble, i've witnessed both sides of the coin. DXM is best taken alone.

jazir5 · Oct 25, 2012

Can someone please make an antipsychotics section? I feel like that is a very important class of drugs and this post should be updated accordingly. I'm schizophrenic and I'm on olanzapine

Te0X2t · Oct 25, 2012

Wow that sucks that Mdma and Mxe will never mix =_(

And I love having a six pack with K why is this that detrimental?

shishigami · Oct 25, 2012

Te0X2t said:
Wow that sucks that Mdma and Mxe will never mix =_(

And I love having a six pack with K why is this that detrimental?

Welllllll CNS depressants + CNS depressants are always unwise to mix.

Also, as a note I safely mixed 500 mcg 25C-nBOMe and 175 mg 4-FA with no adverse effects.

kingme · Oct 27, 2012

would it be possible to add a list for each type of substance, that is more specific than the examples given in the ()? such as a long list of serotonin releasers, one for maois etc? or is this too risky as it oversimplyfies things?

Survived Abortion · Oct 28, 2012

jazir5 said:
Can someone please make an antipsychotics section? I feel like that is a very important class of drugs and this post should be updated accordingly. I'm schizophrenic and I'm on olanzapine

Perhaps, but the way I see it there is only one way in which antipsychotics interact with psychedelics and empathogens, and that is that they simply prevent them from working. I don't believe any of the compounds we are discussing here are acutely dangerous with antipsychotics, just that there is little point using any of them if you are on an antipsychotic.

You may get something out of dissociatives, but the experience will still be slightly altered because of their effects on dopamine.

kingme said:
would it be possible to add a list for each type of substance, that is more specific than the examples given in the ()? such as a long list of serotonin releasers, one for maois etc? or is this too risky as it oversimplyfies things?

The sticky list which the mods drew up is more comprehensive in this regard than the one at the start of this thread. Perhaps it could be done even more comprehensively, but it would need to be listed in a way which looks readable. Much better would be some kind of interactive thing whereby you plug in the name of the compound you are asking about and it pops up telling you a list of interactions. But I don't know how one would go about executing such a thing on a vbulletin forum.

Jesusgreen · Oct 29, 2012

Anyone able to link any studies about how potent aMT is as an MAOI? We all know that it is one, but I've seen a constant back and forth between people arguing that it's only as strong an MAOI as something like amphetamine, and others saying it's as strong as harmine etc.

I would imagine the first piece of evidence for it being weak would be the fact that it too releases serotonin and doesn't seem to exhibit PMA/PMMA type effects. That said though, that's not a definitive answer.

Maybe someone could shed some light, because I seem to remember someone explaining in detail why aMT was only a weak MAOI inhibitor and its MAOI action was negligible at best - but I've lately been going ahead and repeating that without even remembering the reasoning for it, and I don't wish to continue doing that!

kace · Oct 29, 2012

I wish I had read this thread before mixing tramadol with MDMA on Saturday. I'm such a moron for not doing my research first.

cryptix420 · Oct 29, 2012

idiocy and 25c-NBOMe are quite the deadly combo.

Jesusgreen said:
Anyone able to link any studies about how potent aMT is as an MAOI? We all know that it is one, but I've seen a constant back and forth between people arguing that it's only as strong an MAOI as something like amphetamine, and others saying it's as strong as harmine etc.

I would imagine the first piece of evidence for it being weak would be the fact that it too releases serotonin and doesn't seem to exhibit PMA/PMMA type effects. That said though, that's not a definitive answer.

Maybe someone could shed some light, because I seem to remember someone explaining in detail why aMT was only a weak MAOI inhibitor and its MAOI action was negligible at best - but I've lately been going ahead and repeating that without even remembering the reasoning for it, and I don't wish to continue doing that!

I don't know any real pharmacological details, but I have taken MDMA and aMT together and had a great time, didn't suffer any awful side effects, and it quite made me enjoy writing even more so than I already do. Taken by itself, aMT is a powerful mood lifter, which would make me think the MAOI activity is somewhat strong. It can put a smile on my face for upwards of 10 hours. Really, the smiling side effect is quite weird, but awesome.

Survived Abortion · Oct 29, 2012

Care to share what happened kace?

Jesusgreen said:
Anyone able to link any studies about how potent aMT is as an MAOI? We all know that it is one, but I've seen a constant back and forth between people arguing that it's only as strong an MAOI as something like amphetamine, and others saying it's as strong as harmine etc.

Did you check out this abstract taken from some of the Russian experiments with aMT on serotonin http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/13898151

Although it doesn't give any figures, it states that aMT inhibited the increase in 5-HT due to iproniazid administration (an MAOI "antidepressant" drug) to a similar degree as harmaline, and moreso than dexamphetamine (presumably due to the competitive action of MAOIs and the ability of reversible MAOIs to interrupt and prevent irreversible MAOIs from binding covalently).

The increase after iproniazid was antagonized to the same extent by all the tryptamine derivatives and by harmaline, whereas dexamphetamine showed less effect.

It also states that:

In the other experiments with brain, the tryptamine derivatives were less potent than harmaline, but somewhat more active than dexamphetamine.

So I would assume by this that aMT is more potent an MAOI than dexamphetamine, and perhaps equally as effective as harmaline. It is also a short term MAOI:

In rats, three alpha-alkylated tryptamine derivatives (alpha-methyl, alpha-ethyl, and alphaalpha-dimethyltryptamine) caused alterations of 5-hydroxytryptamine metabolism typical of monoamine-oxidase inhibitors with short duration of action, viz., an increase of endogenous 5-hydroxytryptamine in brain, enhancement of the increase of 5-hydroxytryptamine in brain and heart after 5-hydroxytryptophan administration

kace · Oct 29, 2012

Nothing horrendously bad, I just didn't realise combining the two significantly increases the chance of serotonin syndrome. Maybe this explains some of my symptoms (extremely dodgy stomach, nausea, depression, confusion, eyesight problems, insomnia, etc) but they may also be explained by me running out of etizolam.

Jesusgreen · Oct 30, 2012

Interesting. I certainly shouldn't go assuming that it's so safe then. Makes me rethink the idea of consuming 6-APB + aMT in the future, even though I had no problems last time. I think pushing the dose a little too far would lead to problems.

Dr. Rabid · Oct 31, 2012

Is LSD contraindicated with Clonidine? I was prescribed the stuff for insomnia for some reason and never really took it, but I'm thinking if i want to sleep after my upcoming trip I might take some.

The Big & Dandy Dangerous Combinations Thread

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