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T3 versus T4 for antidepressant augmentation in mood disorders?

arctica

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 15, 2009
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My shrink added 25 mcg of T3 (Cytomel) to my regimen a couple months ago. While my TSH was within the normal range, there is some research supporting T3 augmentation in depressed euthyroid individuals. When lab results came back with increased TSH values, he sent me to an endocrinologist for a second opinion. The endocrinologist was surprised that a doctor had put me on T3, and explained that most doctors use T4 now as it's safer(?), and some of the T4 is converted into T3 in your body, anyway. So, he had me discontinue the T3 and replace it with 100 mcg of T4.

Besides the black box warning (which warns not to use T3 for weight loss, basically), the side effect profile seems pretty standard.

There are conflicting views in the literature on whether it helps mood disorders at all, but there are definitely doctors (and patients) who strongly prefer T3 for use in mood disorders. Is there any rational basis for this view? Does the emperor have any clothes?
 
Given how seriously fucked up you can get from playing with thyroid horomones, I would be seriously considering getting a new shrink if he puts you on synthetic T3/T4 when your TSH/T3/T4 levels are normal...

There is research supporting such a wide variety of stuff for depression therapy, it's probably safest to try the physiologically safer options like diet, excercise, herbal supplementation, etc. and only then investigate exotic treatments like this.
 
So far, all indications point to the hoofbeats being zebras, as this is for recurrent, severe, treatment-resistant depression. I've pretty much played out the PDR at this point, and the augmentation cocktails currently in vogue. I seem destined for electroconvulsive therapy, and appear to be a reasonable candidate for the procedure, but I want to exhaust some other options first, like MAOIs, L-methylfolate, transcranial magnetic stimulation, and ketamine. I hadn't heard about Cytomel being used for depression until my current shrink suggested it.

Mostly, I was wondering if there was any plausible reason that T3 might be more effective than T4 for depression. I figured that you guys would know more about it than an endocrinologist giving psychiatric advice.
 
I've heard of both. I've also heard of a case where T3 supplementation triggered a panic attack, but I think the dosage was too high and that person was prone to panic. T3 is much more active than T4 -- and as I understand it, T4 is active only insofar as it is converted to T3 in your body (a reaction that depends in part on selenium). There is also evidence that T4 might convert to T3 fine in your body but poorly in your brain (see below). In my opinion, the psychiatrist's plan of T3 augmentation makes more sense given the evidence on the matter, though it brings a larger risk of hyperthyroidism -- and I totally understand why the endocrinologist suggested T4 instead, but I think it is largely an artifact of the way hypothyroidism is treated. 25 mcg of T3 is I think a bit high of a dose to start, I'd feel more comfortable with a starting dose of like 5 mcg and slowly go up as seems necessary.

What sort of depression symptoms are most prominent for you? Are your symptoms more like low energy, hypersomnia, low motivation, etc., or more anxious, insomnia, especially bad in the morning? And is your mood fairly reactive to good/bad events or is it pretty much just a solid depressed mood regardless of what happens?

Also, was your TSH high before the T3 was added or after? And when you say 'high,' do you mean higher than 4.0 mIU/L?

The most recent solid review article I could find was Rosenthal, L. J., Goldner, W. S., & O’Reardon, J. P. (2011). T3 Augmentation in Major Depressive Disorder: Safety Considerations. American Journal of Psychiatry, 168(10), 1035–1040. doi:10.1176/appi.ajp.2011.10030402 It speaks to both the mechanisms and compares T3 to T4. Here are some relevant parts:

Mechanism discussion:

T3 acts in the cell nucleus, stimulating gene expression and energy metabolism in cells in every organ and potentially enhancing neurogenesis in the CNS (2). T3, both alone and in combination with fluoxetine, modulates gene transcription, with changes in mRNA coding for the 5-HT1A and 5-HT1B receptors (3). In the CNS, T4 conversion to T3 occurs intracellularly, which may be why T3 administration seems to have particular benefit in the treatment of affective disorders (4). The enzymes responsible for the conversion of T4 to T3 are also different in the CNS, perhaps explaining individual responses to T3 supplementation and the variability of symptoms in subclinical hypothyroidism. Cooper-Kazaz et al. (5) have demonstrated that genetic polymorphisms in the type 1 deiodinase (DIO1) gene, which assists in the conversion of T4 to T3, might help determine which patients will respond to T3 augmentation.

It is also possible that T3 acts directly as a neurotransmitter or that it directly influences neurotransmission through monoamines (3). Actions at noradrenergic, serotonergic, and beta-adrenergic neurons have all been demonstrated, largely through studies of hypo- and hyperthyroid states. Rodent studies have demonstrated serotonergic effects of T3 and T4, supporting the idea that serotonergic transmission is enhanced by normal thyroid functioning, potentially through desensitization of the 5-HT1A autoreceptor (6). T3 was initially thought to be active solely within the noradrenergic projection pathway, and it may serve as a co-transmitter with norepinephrine in the limbic system, but it has also been demonstrated in high concentrations in the serotonergic raphe nuclei and their projections (7).

I think it is fascinating that the conversion of T4-->T3 works differently in the CNS than everywhere else in the body... This suggests that the reason why T3 supplementation works in people with normal thyroid levels is that perhaps they have low T3 in the CNS but normal T3 elsewhere. If this is the case, T3 but not T4 supplementation would help.


Adjunctive w/ TCA:

The majority of the evidence base for use of T3 is for its coadministration with tricyclics. Two meta-analyses of T3 coadministration with tricyclics have been published, one reviewing acceleration trials (9) and the other augmentation trials (10). Acceleration is defined as the use of T3 at commencement of antidepressant treatment to enhance and hasten response. Augmentation is the administration of T3 in patients who are unresponsive or partially responsive to an adequate course of antidepressant treatment initiated previously.
Acceleration of antidepressant response with T3.

A meta-analysis by Altshuler et al. (9) of six double-blind, placebo-controlled studies (125 patients total) of T3 acceleration of tricyclics was positive. By definition, these were short-term studies of 2 to 3 weeks, and none discussed the option of continuing T3 once antidepressant response was achieved. In addition, many were conducted before the advent of more sensitive assays of thyroid functioning in the late 1980s. Three of these acceleration studies (11–13) obtained initial lab values of protein-bound iodine and looked at ankle jerk reflexes and serum T4 binding, but none performed follow-up testing. No differences in baseline thyroid tests were found between patients who responded to T3 and those who did not, but some authors speculated that there may have been subtle thyroid dysfunction in the responders that was undetectable by the assays. In addition, a significant gender effect was observed, with women responding more robustly than men. While women generally have been found to have higher rates of both comorbid depressive syndromes and thyroid disease, a consistent association has not been replicated.

Augmentation of antidepressant response with T3.

Aronson et al. (10) conducted a positive meta-analysis of T3 augmentation of tricyclics, finding eight controlled clinical studies with 292 patients. The studies were up to 12 weeks long, and several performed baseline and follow-up modern thyroid assays (4, 14–16). One positive study in 1977 conducted initial thyroid screening and additionally tested the CSF monoamine metabolites 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid and homovanillic acid, hypothesizing that the mechanism of treatment with T3 was an increase of available monoamines (17). However, the study found no differences in CSF monoamine metabolites between the placebo and active T3 groups or between responders and nonresponders to T3.

Thase et al. (14) found no association between results of thyroid function tests or TRH stimulation testing at baseline and outcome in a subset of patients treated with T3. Joffe and Singer (4) evaluated T3 versus T4 in a randomized trial and found significant changes after 3 weeks in T3, T4, free T4, TSH, and T3 resin uptake in both groups, but these changes were not positive predictors of response; the main finding was that T3 was more effective than T4 as an augmenter. A 2-week augmentation study of lithium and T3 (15) found in 1993 that the two were equally effective and outperformed placebo, with baseline TSH documented as being within normal range.



Adjunctive with SSRIs:

T3 in Conjunction With SSRIs

Recently a number of studies have examined the augmentation of selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) with thyroid hormone, but the data are more limited than with tricyclics. A review by Cooper-Kazaz and Lerer (18) found that not enough data were available yet for a meta-analysis but that a positive trend was revealed when the available double- and single-blind studies were analyzed. Papakostas et al. (19) reported a negative meta-analysis using strict inclusion criteria and finding only three adequate double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled studies. The Sequenced Treatment Alternatives to Relieve Depression (STAR*D) study (20) evaluated SSRI augmentation using either lithium or T3 and found no statistical difference in efficacy between the treatments, but T3 had superior tolerability and adherence. All of these studies were short term, with the longest (STAR*D) lasting 12 weeks.

Two studies of T3 in combination with SSRIs included baseline and follow-up thyroid testing. In the first, Cooper-Kazaz et al. (21) compared sertraline (50–100 mg) combined with either T3 (25–35 μg) or placebo in an 8-week study and found that the sertraline-T3 combination produced superior response and remission rates. After 8 weeks of T3 supplementation, the mean TSH level fell significantly from 1.70 μIU/ml at baseline to 0.28 μIU/ml in responders, whereas nonresponders had mean pre- and posttreatment levels of 1.88 μIU/ml and 0.76 μIU/ml, respectively; responsiveness to treatment was significantly correlated (p=0.01) with the change in TSH level, suggesting that the therapeutic benefit could have been due to changes in the thyroid axis in this population. In a post hoc analysis, baseline T3 levels in patients who responded to T3 augmentation were significantly lower than in those who did not respond (107.60 ng/dl compared with 137.4 ng/dl, p=0.002). There was also a small but significant decline in TSH levels in the placebo group.

A combination study by Appelhof et al. (22) in which 124 patients were randomly assigned to receive paroxetine combined with 25 μg of T3, 50 μg of T3, or placebo showed a statistically significant dose-dependent increase of T3 levels along with lowered T4 (the final T4 levels after 8 weeks of treatment were 0.9 pmol/liter in the placebo group, 0.6 pmol/liter in the 25-μg T3 group, and 0.4 pmol/liter in the 50-μg T3 group). Significant changes in thyroid function on testing were associated with significant side effects in nine of 28 patients in the 50-μg group, including sweating, tremor, nervousness, and palpitations, but there were no significant differences between the 25-μg T3 and placebo groups. It is possible that noradrenergic effects of paroxetine due to norepinephrine transporter blockade exacerbated somatic symptoms that were consistent with a hyperthyroid state. Efficacy outcome was negative, with no differences between placebo and the two T3 groups.

While T3 compared well with lithium in STAR*D (20), and results with T3 as an augmentation or combination strategy are encouraging, more controlled trials are needed to fully determine the efficacy of T3 in combination with SSRIs.



Long-term Safety + reason the endocrinologist didn't like the idea:

There is good evidence to suggest that T3 administration is helpful in the treatment of depressive states, but only limited data are available on long-term safety. Few of the randomized controlled studies of T3 included both initial and follow-up thyroid function testing; those that did such testing showed expected changes in the thyroid axis and were largely reassuring on the issue of significant side effects. Many psychiatrists are nevertheless uncomfortable prescribing thyroid hormones to essentially euthyroid patients, and some of our colleagues in endocrinology may also find this practice controversial.

and

There is no consensus in endocrinology on use of thyroid hormone for the treatment of depression in euthyroid patients. When treating patients with hypothyroidism, endocrinology guidelines generally recommend using T4 monotherapy (25). Multiple studies, including a meta-analysis, have evaluated the difference between T4 monotherapy and T3/T4 combination therapy for the treatment of hypothyroidism. Overall no meaningful statistical differences have been found between the two regimens (26–31). Nevertheless, some studies have reported patient preference for combination therapy that was not explained by symptom outcomes, neurocognitive changes, or quality-of-life assessments (27). In one study (28), 44% of the patients reporting a preference for combination therapy had a suppressed TSH level, suggesting overreplacement of thyroid hormone. A study from Denmark (32) evaluated T4 monotherapy compared with combination T3/T4 therapy while maintaining equivalent TSH values. Quality-of-life scores and depression and anxiety rating scores were significantly better in seven of 11 categories with combined therapy compared with monotherapy, and 49% of patients preferred combination T4/T3 therapy, compared with 15% who preferred T4 monotherapy.

In euthyroid patients, high T3 dosages carry a higher risk of induction of hyperthyroidism. In this respect, preexisting hypertension, tachycardia, and hyperglycemia could all potentially be worsened by hyperthyroidism (33). Subclinical hyperthyroidism has also been associated with long-term side effects, including reduced bone mineral density and an increased risk of osteoporosis, especially in postmenopausal women (34, 35), and an increased risk of atrial arrhythmias (36). Thus, when thyroid hormones are used in treating depression, clinicians should closely monitor patients for biochemical or clinical evidence of hyperthyroidism.


There is also evidence that in patients being treated for hypothyroidism with T4 monotherapy, when they were switched to T4/T3 combined therapy they noticed that their mood was brightened, which I think is further evidence in support of T3 > T4.


From a different article -- Cooper-Kazaz, R., & Lerer, B. (2008). Efficacy and safety of triiodothyronine supplementation in patients with major depressive disorder treated with specific serotonin reuptake inhibitors. The International Journal of Neuropsychopharmacology, 11(5), 685.

Evidence in favor of T4 supplementation, particularly in bipolar disorder (though also concluding that T3 may be better):

T4 has been studied less extensively than T3 in the treatment of affective disorders. This may be due to the fact that T4 is converted to the more potent T3, which is the active hormone. Nevertheless, there is evidence for efficacy of T4, particularly in patients with bipolar disorder. The addition of supraphysiological doses of T4 to antidepressant-resistant unipolar and bipolar depression, improved the outcome in two open clinical studies (Bauer et al., 1998; Pfeiffer et al., 2004). Supraphysiological doses of T4 also improved bipolar disorder prophylaxis in a prospective open study (Bauer et al., 2002b). In a recent open study, moderate doses of T4 successfully augmented serotonergic antidepressants in female patients with refractory unipolar or bipolar depression (Lojko and Rybakowski, 2007). Several studies support specific
efficacy of T4 in the treatment of rapid-cycling bipolar disorder, reducing both amplitude and frequency of manic and depressive phases (Afflelou et al., 1997; Bauer and Whybrow, 1990; Whybrow, 1994). Finally, in one study comparing T4 and T3 potentiation of tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs), significantly more *patients responded to T3 compared to T4 (Joffe and Singer, 1990). In one study supraphysiological doses of T4 were associated with serious adverse effects (Pfeiffer et al., 2004).


Another study on this question -- Hage, M. P., & Azar, S. T. (2012). The Link between Thyroid Function and Depression. Journal of Thyroid Research, 2012, 1–8. doi:10.1155/2012/590648

Relevant quote:

Fewer studies assessed the efficacy of T4 in the treatment of affective disorders. Joffe and Singer found a significantly higher response to tricyclic antidepressants with T3 (53%) compared to T4 (19%) [71]. However, use of T4 in supraphysiological doses to treatment-resistant unipolar and bipolar depression was effective in approximately 50% of patients as reported by Baumgartner in a review of eight open clinical trials (N=78) [72]. Surprisingly, T4 in high doses was well tolerated even in patients treated for up to 51 months. However, in healthy subjects, supraphysiological T4 doses were less well tolerated due to higher increments in thyroid hormones after supplementation [73]. A possible explanation would be a greater inactivation of T4 to rT3 in depressed patients compared to healthy subjects [74].


Hope that helps! I assume from your post that you've tried lithium and lamotrigine? You should definitely try the MAO-Is before any of that more extreme stuff you mentioned, they can work wonders when nothing else works...
 
Holy crap! I knew I could count on you guys! <3 Now I'm going to go back through it all carefully...
 
I've heard of both. I've also heard of a case where T3 supplementation triggered a panic attack, but I think the dosage was too high and that person was prone to panic. T3 is much more active than T4 -- and as I understand it, T4 is active only insofar as it is converted to T3 in your body (a reaction that depends in part on selenium). There is also evidence that T4 might convert to T3 fine in your body but poorly in your brain (see below). In my opinion, the psychiatrist's plan of T3 augmentation makes more sense given the evidence on the matter, though it brings a larger risk of hyperthyroidism -- and I totally understand why the endocrinologist suggested T4 instead, but I think it is largely an artifact of the way hypothyroidism is treated. 25 mcg of T3 is I think a bit high of a dose to start, I'd feel more comfortable with a starting dose of like 5 mcg and slowly go up as seems necessary.

I actually started on 5 mcg as you suggest, and then was increased to 10 and now 25 mcg. My last medication overhaul was in January, so this is in addition to 300 mg of Wellbutrin XL, 15 mg Deplin, and 600 mg of lithium carbonate. I've been on the lithium since January as a shot in the dark, since I had never tried lithium before (I did try Lamictal with no improvement). At first I thought there was a small but noticeable improvement with this new combo, but now I'm not so sure it's working. From what I understand, people who respond to lithium tend to have rather dramatic improvements. Genetic testing results suggested that Deplin might help (and just to be geeky) :

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What sort of depression symptoms are most prominent for you? Are your symptoms more like low energy, hypersomnia, low motivation, etc., or more anxious, insomnia, especially bad in the morning? And is your mood fairly reactive to good/bad events or is it pretty much just a solid depressed mood regardless of what happens?

Also, was your TSH high before the T3 was added or after? And when you say 'high,' do you mean higher than 4.0 mIU/L?

Hope that helps! I assume from your post that you've tried lithium and lamotrigine? You should definitely try the MAO-Is before any of that more extreme stuff you mentioned, they can work wonders when nothing else works...

It's a combination of low energy, low motivation, anxiety, insomnia, things I used to enjoy now just make me sad, but mostly just extreme sadness where I cry every day for hours. My anxiety is worse in the early morning, and often accompanied by nausea/vomiting. My mood is consistently down, but I also have an almost traumatic reaction to everything. Ordinary things which I would have shrugged off a few years ago destroy my day, or week. Things seem miswired. I'll look at a beautiful whatever, and it will still evoke an emotional reaction, but now it's negative instead of positive.

From 1/22:
Test Reference Range Units
TSH 3.270 0.450-4.500 uIU/mL

Then, my shrink added 5 mcg Cytomel. Then on he goes back to check the levels on 3/20:

Test Reference Range Units
TSH 6.64 0.450-4.500 uIU/mL

This didn't make sense, so he sent me to the endocrinologist, who re-ran the tests to confirm, but can't find anything particularly wrong with me.

ETA:

For various reasons, ECT is currently my personal therapy of last resort. My last psychiatrist was unwilling to put me on an MAO-Is unless I was willing to do a round of ECT first, as he didn't want to risk taking me off all medication for the required dry-out period. My current psychiatrist has agreed to never force me to do ECT (like the last guy was effectively doing), but also doesn't relish the idea of taking me off my meds unless we're out of options.
 
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I have no thyroid whatsoever and am required to take thyroid replacement hormones daily.

T3 is the active form in your body. T4 is essentially a pro-drug. Some people don't convert t4 as readily as others, and at least one study on mice found that t4 alone didn't provide all parts of the body with enough t3.

T4 alone didn't work for me, so now I am on a t3/t4 combo.

As Pizzy notes, there is support for the use of T3 in depression, but it is not considered a mainstream use of the product.

Many endocrinologists and GP's find t3 difficult to use because it has a relatively short half life, particularly compared to t4, which has a half life of a few weeks. My endocrinologist commented that she thought the general preference for T4 was simply because it is easier for the practitioner.

Your TSH result on 3/20 suggest you are hypothyroid. Even the 1/22 result could produce mild hypothyroid symptoms in some people. The "normal" range is currently being reevaluated, with some suggesting anything over 3 could be sub-clinical hypothyroidism.

The symptoms you describe are certainty consistent with low thyroid. The 25mcg dose did seem high though - I take 10mcg daily. Many like to take half of the t3 in the morning and half in the afternoon. It's slightly stimulating, I avoid it at night. Your thyroid naturally produces both t3 and t4, with the vast majority being t4. As your body is very efficient, it doesn't make sense that t3 is unnecessary when thyroid replacement is warranted to me at least.
 
Many endocrinologists and GP's find t3 difficult to use because it has a relatively short half life, particularly compared to t4, which has a half life of a few weeks. My endocrinologist commented that she thought the general preference for T4 was simply because it is easier for the practitioner.

Difficult to use, because the dosing is tricky because the half life is short and therapeutic window is small, resulting in more side effects?

Your TSH result on 3/20 suggest you are hypothyroid. Even the 1/22 result could produce mild hypothyroid symptoms in some people. The "normal" range is currently being reevaluated, with some suggesting anything over 3 could be sub-clinical hypothyroidism.

The symptoms you describe are certainty consistent with low thyroid. The 25mcg dose did seem high though - I take 10mcg daily. Many like to take half of the t3 in the morning and half in the afternoon. It's slightly stimulating, I avoid it at night. Your thyroid naturally produces both t3 and t4, with the vast majority being t4. As your body is very efficient, it doesn't make sense that t3 is unnecessary when thyroid replacement is warranted to me at least.

I think the 25 mcg dosage is a result of the "more is more" philosophy of dosage titration in treatment-resistant individuals. In a very reputable hospital in Belmont, Massachusetts I was actually diagnosed with serotonin syndrome while dosed on 200 mg Zoloft (usual ~ 50 mg) plus 450 mg Wellbutrin XL (usual ~ 300 mg) plus 200 mg Seroquel plus 50 mg Imitrex (as needed for the migraines caused by the Zoloft), plus something like 10 other medications.

I think what alarmed my shrink was that my TSH values were increasing, despite the fact that I was now taking supplemental T3. (I think I was on 10 mcg when the 2nd test was done.) The endocrinologist thinks the lithium might be causing what looks like a decrease in thyroid function. Is that possible?
 
Anything is possible. You're going to find a lot of contention, disagreement, and seemingly new research in this area among "professionals". "Messing" with thyroid supplements is not so dangerous in the short term, but you have to be careful. Personally I think it's obvious when too much is too much, but perhaps not so for some people. There are a number of theorized thyroid deficiencies for things ranging from celiac disease causing auto-immune damage to your thyroid, and other potential wheat protein-based auto-immune disorders, to other diet-based ones. And of course the old school guys think it's all bullshit. I personally like small amounts of thyroid supplementation from time to time. I prefer the natural, multi-hormone ones to the synthetic T3 only or T4 only. Naturals also give you reverse T3 and reverse T4 and a number of others.
 
If there is some indication that you are not euthyroid, esp. if you have some blood TSH/T3 tests to back you up, and are not just pursuing T3 supplementation as a possible depression cure on its own (as say a SSRI replacement, for an otherwise healthy depressed individual), I would say you would be just fine giving it a try.

The issue is, you can screw things up in the other direction pretty seriously if you put your thyroid into overdrive. Just be careful.
 
The no MAO-Is before ECT first thing is a little outrageous, I think -- though ECT is actually really effective and probably the best option in severe cases provided that you can deal with the memory issues. But it sounds to me like you have the sort of symptoms that respond best to an MAO-I like tranylcypromine. And they wouldn't have to take you off everything, only the bupropion right? 6.64 TSH suggests hypothyroidism, and I have heard of lithium sometimes causing that. I assume you've had your lithium levels measured to verify that the dose is high enough, right? Lithium sometimes produces a dramatic response, but not always. That genetic test is kind of cool, I knew that sort of thing was possible but I've never heard of anyone getting one. Anyway, hang in there! The drug that ultimately worked best for me when I was super depressed was seroquel -- 3 days of it and it was like waking up after being half-dead for a couple years. I'm not saying that that's for you, but rather just that you should have faith that you'll get better once they happen upon the right treatment. I know its frustrating and miserable but it will get better.
 
Fascinating stuff. I hadn't heard about this. On the one hand, I can't see why it wouldn't work. On the other hand, being hyperthyroid carries a lot of long term health risks. This really skims the border between therapy and enhancement. And I think it could definitely be argued that T3 +/- T4 is a mind-altering drug. If we have a forum here for steroids and consider them mind-altering drugs, then I don't see why any other hormone or functionally-binding hormone analog that produces any cascade that alters the way we're likely to think and behave shouldn't be considered a drug too.

Funny, hyperthyroid patients often seek treatment at the behest of other people, who can't stand them or think something is wrong or different about them. Not nearly all, but a significant minority, don't want to be rid of their disease. The only other condition I've seen that for is Bipolar I (only hypomania alternating with flattened mood, not much depression).
 
Fascinating stuff. I hadn't heard about this. On the one hand, I can't see why it wouldn't work. On the other hand, being hyperthyroid carries a lot of long term health risks. This really skims the border between therapy and enhancement. And I think it could definitely be argued that T3 +/- T4 is a mind-altering drug. If we have a forum here for steroids and consider them mind-altering drugs, then I don't see why any other hormone or functionally-binding hormone analog that produces any cascade that alters the way we're likely to think and behave shouldn't be considered a drug too.

Funny, hyperthyroid patients often seek treatment at the behest of other people, who can't stand them or think something is wrong or different about them. Not nearly all, but a significant minority, don't want to be rid of their disease. The only other condition I've seen that for is Bipolar I (only hypomania alternating with flattened mood, not much depression).

I'm resurrecting this old thread, found it on a search - cause that last paragraph - is pure gold.

Very relatable to me.

I started T4 a week ago after discontinuing Atomoxetine/Mianserin (to mirtazapine) combo - and I have been getting in verbal spats with chicks, ever since.
At the bank, at the grocery store, at the food court - making them crazy.
I was having spats with them on Atomoxetin/Miaserin also - but now it's just off the charts.

In any case - 200 mcg/day T4 is making an impact, but it sounds like T3 could do it better.
 
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