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SSRI'S that don't block Opiods? (and question about metabolism)

C

ColoradoBoy90

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 12, 2015
Messages
219
**PLEASE MOVE TO OTHER DRUGS, it's about opiates/opiods but it won't let me post in there again no prefix option**

Okay, so I know SSRI antideperrsnrsantidepressants many people claim that it makes opiods less effective. Some claim it's due to CYPD26 others claim it's because it numbs your emotions. I believe the FIRST is correct about enzymes. Why?
Because if I take 1 Prozac at bed sand wake up and try to take Vicodin I can't keep the Vicodin and even feel minor W/D. So it's definitely blocking some enzyme, as the SSRI numbing effect doesn't happen over night. I have tested this like 50 times and that's why I can't take Prozac. Problem?

I NEED AN SSRI. I'm almost positive I'm low on Sertonin as when I first took Prozac before I was on Vicodin/Opana/Oxy I used my mood booster BIG TIME on Prozac. I also took 5Htp one time and was feeling great. Again confirming I'm low on serotonin. But anyways I wanted to know: which SSRI has the LEAST (or none if possible) blocking effect on opiods? I heard Zoloft doesn't inhibit CYPD26 at all so then if i take Zoloft it shouldn't interact with Vicodin/Opana or Oxy, right??

I also read this on blue light:

"Some drugs also interfere with cyp2d6. Prime among these are the SSRIs, with the exception of Zoloft (if I remember correctly). The most potent inhibitor is paroxetine (paxil), followed by fluoxetine (prozac). If you are taking an SSRI, you will probably experience a markedly decreased euphoria when using codeine"

Is this TRUE? I don't trust Wikipedia so I wanna ask here. Also If NO SSRI'S don't interfere with opiates how about taking older antidepressants like tricyclic antidepressants MAOIs?? But k believe TCA hit all 3. Not sure if MAOI just work on Sertonin only or not. I dobit they are really even an option though.

I BADLY want an SSRI I can take with opiates. I also WANT TO BE EMOTIONALL NUMB instead of depressed (or worse....). I don't think my marriage will last more than 3 more months and once it does I need antidepressants to help me through I don't care if I don't feel anything that will be good because I know she won't care one bit.

I was thinking of trying Effexor but that increases norepinephrine, so wouldn't it have less of an emotional numbness effect? Does Effexor Effexor CYPD26??

PLEASE do not tell me numbing my emotions are a bad idea until you are in my shoes. I was the most happy in my life when I was on Prozac because I didn't care. But now I can't do that because I'm stuck on opiates...
 
Moved to OD. Sorry I can't offer any advice but my experience with opiates is very limited
 
I've taken ssri's for the past 15 years since I was 15. I used to be able to get high on opiates all the time before I got on subs. I mostly have been on Zoloft, but have been put on a few others. I found that I need to take them forever because I get brain zaps and myclonic jerks and twitchyness if I ever try to get off them. So I don't really understand your problem.
 
I've never heard of SSRIs blocking the effects of opioids. I think if you take a therapeutic dose of a SSRI, they won't block your CYPs too much.
And even if they did, Oxycodone is active on its own and it's one active metabolite isn't produced in a noteworthy amount. So inhibiting your CYPs would make you high longer.
But as I said, I don't think that a therapeutic dose of a SSRI won't do much with your opioid metabolism.
 
kleinerkiffer said:
I've never heard of SSRIs blocking the effects of opioids. I think if you take a therapeutic dose of a SSRI, they won't block your CYPs too much.
And even if they did, Oxycodone is active on its own and it's one active metabolite isn't produced in a noteworthy amount. So inhibiting your CYPs would make you high longer.
But as I said, I don't think that a therapeutic dose of a SSRI won't do much with your opioid metabolism.
Click to expand...

this
 
So question is: is Hydrmorphone a prodrug? Google doesn't seem to know. And is Opana/oxymorphone a prodrug?

Also I read spent hours reading online (a lot of blue light) and 80% agreed it was due to CYPD26 blockage, NOT due to the "numbing effect of Prozac":

I can personally attest to this. If I take Prozac at night it heavily blocks Vicodin and even oxy. Since Prozac doesn't numb in one day, it's clearly metabolism issues..

So my main questions:

#1: Are Hydrmorphone and oxymorphone pro drugs?? Do either of them use CYPD26 which Prozac heavily blocks??

#2: I read that Prozac and Lexapro are the biggest CYPD26 blockages of all, and Zoloft is the least. Any truth to this?

#3: Also how about Effexor ER, does that block CYPD26? I know REMERON does not . I take it daily for months now at bed and has zero effects on opiods, in fact it seeks to increase dopamine make them better. So how about Effexor ER, or any there any other "mainly Sertonin boosting drugs" that isn't CYPD26 blocking?
 
Hydromorphone and Oxymorphone are both active on their own, so no need to worry.

As I said before, if Prozac would block CYP2D6 significantly you would be high for longer when taking oxycodone, because you would stop metabolism to some degree.
 
I've done some research and have seen no science-based evidence that there's a blocking effect.
 
It says even on Wikipedia that Prozac can mess with oxycodone/Vicodin etc since Prozac is heady on the CYPD26, preventing hydro from turning into Hydrmorphone
Also hundred of threads on here saying due to CYPD26 It does effect them.

But I don't know if Hydrmorphone or oxymorphone even use CYPD26 -- if they don't then probleme solved! Thought I would rather take Vicodin showing day then the sedating HydroMORPHONE
 
I do not think you understand the process of drug metabolism at all or you would have had your questions answered already. Antidepressants have minimal effects on CYP450 enzymes (at least most of them). Often drugs that inhibit 2d6 can increase length of activity. This all depends on whether it's a prodrug or boy (codeine, hydrocodone are the most common prodrugs). This problem seems to be in your head, thousands of not millions of people worldwide take antidepressants (probably mostly SSRIs) with opioids, so you should be just fine.
 
Quote mad scientist

"Yes Prozac inhibits CYP2D6, and so can be expected to reduce the effectiveness of drugs that are bioactivated by CYP2D6, such as oxycodone."

Quote BL member:
"Inhibiting only CYP3A4 does not prevent conversion of morphine to codeine (N-demethylation), it's CYP2D6 that's responsible for the O-demethylation. If CYP2D6 is being inhibited that is will damper that effects of all opiates/opiods especially Morhine and codine"

Quote BL member
"SSRIs do attenuate opiates due to the reasons explored above, the best thing to do is to evaluate which will be more beneficial in the long run and stick with that. Both SSRIs and opiates are addictive, its a question of personal biology

And the list goes on and on. So it's not in my head...

So how about Effexor ER? I can't fine if it effects CYPD26 or not/ I will try Prozac avian and see how it goes, if opiods are weaken the same day that's proof for myself that it does. If kr doesn't! Then I may stick on it.
 
Alright, I'll try to explain it one last time.
If your Prozac inhibits CYP2D6 you should feel the oxycodone longer.
Oxycodone is metabolized by CYP2D6 to a few metabolites, but oxycodone itself is predominantly responsible for the effects.
So by inhibiting the metabolism of oxycodone it's floating around in your body longer, so you should feel it longer
 
Zoloft or Sertraline. Try that one, I took oxycodone for 18months 6 months into that I started sertraline and I noticed no difference in oxycodones effectiveness for pain or for a high.
 
I believe you and I know you know what you are talking about. But the problem is taking Tagamet makes oxycodone weaker for me and some people. I think I'm one of the people who absorbs a higher amount of oxymorphone which tagament blocks it converting into. I also have taken low dosage of oxymorphone (about 20% weaker Bioequivalence wise) and felt the oxymorphone almost entirely remove all my back pain, which a stronger dose of Percs did not.

That's why some say tagament is a terrible idea because sure you get more oxycodone but you don't get the stronger oxymorphone that it would normally convert too...

Now each person is different so some maybe only convert 1% over to oxymorphone -- so small it for them oxymorphone is basically useless -- so for those people then yes boosting the oxycodone itself via tagament would work better. While others might absorb say for example 15% Into oxymorphone, and for people like that inhibiting CYPD26 would actually make it weaker for them as they are missing all the much stronger oxymorphone due to CYPD26 inhibitors. Maybe I'm just one of those people?

Not sure find out soon enough. Thanks for all the good replies BL is always the best!
 
ColoradoBoy90 said:
I believe you and I know you know what you are talking about. But the problem is taking Tagamet makes oxycodone weaker for me and some people. I think I'm one of the people who absorbs a higher amount of oxymorphone which tagament blocks it converting into. I also have taken low dosage of oxymorphone (about 20% weaker Bioequivalence wise) and felt the oxymorphone almost entirely remove all my back pain, which a stronger dose of Percs did not.

That's why some say tagament is a terrible idea because sure you get more oxycodone but you don't get the stronger oxymorphone that it would normally convert too...

Now each person is different so some maybe only convert 1% over to oxymorphone -- so small it for them oxymorphone is basically useless -- so for those people then yes boosting the oxycodone itself via tagament would work better. While others might absorb say for example 15% Into oxymorphone, and for people like that inhibiting CYPD26 would actually make it weaker for them as they are missing all the much stronger oxymorphone due to CYPD26 inhibitors. Maybe I'm just one of those people?

Not sure find out soon enough. Thanks for all the good replies BL is always the best!
Click to expand...

That could be it.
Have you ever tried codeine, tramadol or DXM?
 
I never had any issues with SSRIs blocking opiate uptake. Although I'm not on SSRIs anymore, I've tried just about them all whilst consuming opiates in some form or another. Longest duration of intake were Zoloft and Lexapro. Never had diminishing effects as direct result of the SSRIs ... just tolerance.
 
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