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Speculation or insight on novel amphetamine substitutions?

(zonk) said:
What about cyclopentadiene instead of benzene
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Cyclopentadiene unfortunately isn't aromatic, though, which may prevent it from being an effective bioisostere for benzene, though.

...then again, neither is the cyclohexane ring in propylhexedrine, and it still acts as a monoamine releasing agent, while the aromatic thiophene analogue of methamphetamine (methiopropamine) seems to function as a reuptake inhibitor rather than a releasing agent.
 
And wouldn't the cyclopentadiene analog be unstable? surely it would just dimerize to form the corresponding dicyclopentadiene in a short time?

And in any case wouldn't it be the cyclohexadiene homolog that one would want to evaluate, not the five membered ring?

Although I suppose the dimerization would be reversible, but it would still mean one would have to thermally crack it and distill it under vacuum before use.

What about the various cyclohexene analogs?
 
I'm on LCs wavelength there BUT when there is an alkyl-chain, things get a little better, they are offered by custom synthesis places but the route to such an amphetamine bioisostere wouldn't be worth it, I wouldn't have thought.

OK - I'm just going to slice through the entire EU BMK/Formamide route to amphetamine.

1)1-fluoro-3-phenylpropan-2-one isn't controlled (and is a LOT cheaper than any ring-substituted option which is why the o & m-F analogues haven't replaced BMK). Compounds with that terminal -F WORK. We tried the mephedrone, amphetamine & methamphetamines with this mod and the only issue is that solubility went down so you have to make the phosphate or it's painful to snort.
2)Ammonium formate produces higher yields than formamide (I'm just reading the EMCDDA report here) & ammonium acetate is a reasonable alternative as well.
3)Formetorex can be produced and isn't controlled so instead of BMK labs, The Chinese will supply the formetorex analogue with that terminal -F. It's a solid

It isn't like you have to go via 1,2 or 3. It's just that 1,2 & 3 aren't listed by the EMCDDA as being watched. The idea came too late to be gone into legally but we did consider it... not that it's clever, when you think about it. Of course, I haven't found in in any papers. If you want anything with a pantyl moiety (like a legal MDPV analogue)? Well a benzene will act as a bioisostere to an n-propyl in this case. See 'pyrophenidone' which was chosen because it was better than the MD version. Much smoother. Like coke in fact. I know, I know, I've mentioned this in many PMs but as of 00:35 I just decided that it's better out than in.

PS the one thing I can say about the whole lot of them - the phosphates are always soluble ENOUGH. The sulfate of pyrophenidone was more soluble but the phosphate was fine and a much simpler workup.
 
They are not covered by the MoDA but if you read the EMCDDA stuff, it's certainly considered to be suspicious with, as usual, electroplating being the usual fake. It's a REAL bore having to deal with reps and so on. I would also be interested to see what you think of all of the large labs using stainless steel with beer kegs as reaction vessels. I'm betting 1 guy is setting them up all over the place and has been for a long time.

I should add that although I've not tried anything but the p-Me ring-substitution of the alphafluoromethyl PEAs, I would be surprised if the MDA/MDMA analogues didn't work (the methyl formamides are just as legal). I mean, I don't think I need to point out how to remove the unwanted -COH/COCH3. I guess the 2-carbon amides are also legal but I suspect the bulkier -CH2F might lower affinity... but if that's your bag, I guess it's worth looking. It isn't rocket science. It isn't like it's a secret - it's the elephant in the room. RCs provided people a safe way to buy stuff and that has disappeared under the PSA... now the formamides fall outside the act.

BTW the law is vague because 2,2,2-trichloroethanol is a solvent & is clearly still on sale. I've actually ordered stuff (butorphanol) that really was for use as a precursor and not for use as a drug and the Home Office confirmed that I didn't need a medicines licence! Things not on MoDA but on MA clearly do not fall under PSA...
 
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By ' watched' I meant 'not banned, not psychoactive either, but the bastards in govt. are keeping an eye on people buying XYZ because everyone knows, even the dumb cunts in govt. KNOW that people are using XYZ to make various psychotropics', such as say, red phosphorus (obviously one cannot get high on phosphorus, but even those stupid enough to infest the corridors of power know full damn well that RP can be used to reduce pseudo); after all, I have plenty of uses for red and white phosphorus that don't have a damn thing to DO with making ANYTHING psychoactive in any way, but still, it'll attract unwanted attention if I don't get mine through suppliers who don't send it via discreet channels, and given the minimum order for me is 1kg, thats the sort of amount that would draw attention that I really don't want, even if I'm NOT cooking meth.

And I'm in need of about 5l of formamide, not for making amphetamines, nothing to do with the Leukart, but if not obtained very discreetly, through suppliers who won't label it for customs as 'arts and crafts supplies' or 'painting materials' etc. then obviously if actually labeled as 'formamide' the first thing people are going to assume, is 'this bugger is running a large scale leukart', despite the fact that not a single drop is actually intended for that purpose.

Also, how is it you actually dare contact the authorities about your projects? Even when buying chloral hydrate for making Melzer's reagent for use in ID-ing specimens when out on my mushroom foraging trips, I wouldn't DARE do that, because I'd probably get my door kicked in at 6am.
 
Would n-trifluoromethylamine be a viable substitute for methylamine for producing close analogs of meth and k?
 
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