Desperate Sick of anti psychotics

[greenlight204]

I’m not sure about my life currently. I am finally out of an abusive relationship, but something that’s bothering me is that I still am prescribed anti psychotics.
I’ve been told many things by many doctors like bipolar, one said schizoaffective (I don’t hallucinate or have delusions thank the lord) but the only thing that is for certain is I’ve done damage to my brain using drugs in the past. Sure we all have, but I’m not sure Fucking up my brain with AP’s is what I need now. I do feel good on Zyprexa, it helps with anxiety, but sometimes I just feel like these all fuck me up severely. People will think I’m high sometimes.

I went without medicine for a while, there definitely were some problems, but I’m not sure about the healing power of my brain or anything anymore as it’s been several years I’ve been dealing with this unhappiness and unfair part of my life. I definitely can’t do some normal things like others can do and it really sets me off. I’ve tried the whole healthy thing and what it seems I need now is a miracle of some sorts. Too many negatives and consequences of taking anti psychotics and I’m ready for something new.

 

[deficiT]

I've been there. Ultimately you have to weigh the pro's and cons of being on the meds.

For me, I simply get too neurotic and manic when I'm off meds, and I'm that much more likely to start using again. So I found kind of a perfect dose of APs that don't really impair me, but still give me the benefit that they're supposed to.

It's difficult to say. I've gone back and forth a LOT. But for me rn, I just need some stability so I'm gonna stay on the meds for awhile. The key to staying on the meds is to find the lowest effective dose and the most well tolerated medicine.

 

[arrall]

Be careful, as I have met people who suffer from permanent memory impairment months after quitting antipsychotics. I'm not sure what your primary issues are, but MDMA therapy (ideally through a MAPS study but you can do this at home with a close friend, preferably one with some therapist qualifications) can create incredible results in treating certain mental disorders such as PTSD/CPTSD. If you're looking for a "miracle of some sorts", psychedelics and/or MDMA are your best bet. Antipsychotics are at best a band-aid solution that covers up underlying issues. If you do decide to go with the psychedelics, remember that they only enhance the therapy. You still have to put in the work and it will likely be very difficult. Psychedelics allow massive progress to be made very quickly but the compound will not do the work for you.

 

[greenlight204]

Be careful, as I have met people who suffer from permanent memory impairment months after quitting antipsychotics. I'm not sure what your primary issues are, but MDMA therapy (ideally through a MAPS study but you can do this at home with a close friend, preferably one with some therapist qualifications) can create incredible results in treating certain mental disorders such as PTSD/CPTSD. If you're looking for a "miracle of some sorts", psychedelics and/or MDMA are your best bet. Antipsychotics are at best a band-aid solution that covers up underlying issues. If you do decide to go with the psychedelics, remember that they only enhance the therapy. You still have to put in the work and it will likely be very difficult. Psychedelics allow massive progress to be made very quickly but the compound will not do the work for you.

So how do people ever get off of them then? Psychedelics are what got me in this mess, not sure I want to revisit that..

 

[greenlight204]

I just know there has to be a better way than popping medication to cover up the issues. I’m ready to solve them.

 

[arrall]

So how do people ever get off of them then? Psychedelics are what got me in this mess, not sure I want to revisit that..

While I don't have personal experience with antipsychotics, I believe that getting off of them involves tapering like most drug dependencies. While a lot of bipolar people I know react well to psychedelics, some have very bad reactions and psychedelics can trigger severe mania in some cases.

Which psychedelics caused issues for you? If it was the 'classical psychedelics' like psilocybin, LSD, etc then I'd suggest staying clear of everything but low - moderate doses of reagent/lab tested MDMA.

Also, are you currently seeing a therapist?

 

[plumbus-nine]

How can you be sure that you caused yourself drain bamage and not just experience stuff which is explainable by receptor dysregulation, epigenetic factors which take ages to reverse, or just said abusive relationship? Depression itself is neurotoxic for example. But in any of these conditions, imho antipsychotics can and really do harm because they mess with the brain's ability to heal itself (5ht2a blockade) and other potentially toxic stuff - don't get me wrong, sometimes I too was myself convinced to having irreversibly fried my brain but it always turned out to be probably wrong. I don't know about the reality but people tell you're frying thousands of neurons or connections with every booze binge but it takes decades for the damage to become evident. Your brain is plastic as fuck.

If you don't suffer from neither delusions nor paranoia, I'd advise against antipsychotics. Unfortunately it's reckless to give any medication suggestions over the net, and unless very experienced you shouldn't do this alone by yourself but reality is one is alone, docs will always rather be safe than sorry and continue on da antipsychotic. Specially when they're of this kind who believes modern age dopamine antagonists would have no severe adverse effects.

Granted, if psychedelics got you into a mess, then caution is warranted but it's more about set & setting than the psychedelic which decides about the outcome. Sometimes the same thing which one thinks to have brought into a mess can clean it up again.

 

[arrall]

How can you be sure that you caused yourself drain bamage and not just experience stuff which is explainable by receptor dysregulation, epigenetic factors which take ages to reverse, or just said abusive relationship? Depression itself is neurotoxic for example. But in any of these conditions, imho antipsychotics can and really do harm because they mess with the brain's ability to heal itself (5ht2a blockade) and other potentially toxic stuff - don't get me wrong, sometimes I too was myself convinced to having irreversibly fried my brain but it always turned out to be probably wrong. I don't know about the reality but people tell you're frying thousands of neurons or connections with every booze binge but it takes decades for the damage to become evident. Your brain is plastic as fuck.

If you don't suffer from neither delusions nor paranoia, I'd advise against antipsychotics. Unfortunately it's reckless to give any medication suggestions over the net, and unless very experienced you shouldn't do this alone by yourself but reality is one is alone, docs will always rather be safe than sorry and continue on da antipsychotic. Specially when they're of this kind who believes modern age dopamine antagonists would have no severe adverse effects.

Granted, if psychedelics got you into a mess, then caution is warranted but it's more about set & setting than the psychedelic which decides about the outcome. Sometimes the same thing which one thinks to have brought into a mess can clean it up again.

I somewhat agree with this advice. My initial experiences with psychedelics were terrifying and highly unpleasant due to dosage, setting, age, and the state of my mental health at the time. I returned to psychedelics (starting at much lower dosages) when I was older and have had numerous life-changing, positive experiences. Not a single experience that I have had has been particularly negative or regretful.

If you do choose to try them again, proceed with extreme caution. Again, MDMA will be safer and I would suggest trying 100mg of tested MDMA (I recommend using the supplements listed on Rollsafe to prevent neurotoxicity, the dreaded comedown, and negative physical side effects) before venturing back into full psychedelics (If you decide to do so.) If that experience is positive, spend a minimum of a few weeks integrating it and then try 1g of psilocybin, 50ug of LSD/1P-LSD, or another 100-120mg MDMA experience (Wait at least a month between trips short-term, generally best practice is 2-3 months between each MDMA ingestion as long-term monthly usage will be mildly neurotoxic)

 

[greenlight204]

Almost the end of 2021 and Im still in this mess
looking, seeking for a way off the drugs lol

 

[ions]

Once you're on APs, psychiatrists don't like to have you stop. A) They see you as a customer B) They profit off these meds. I know they could care less about me, when I say, don't you want to know my history, how I got here. They say no, I don't need to. Then something along the lines of, you're on Invega injections once a month, how is that going for you?

With every breath I have in me, every ounce of fight, I will continue to battle these crooks to get psychiatry on the grips of marijuana and psychedelics. Marijuana helps me tremendously with thinking. Invega blocks that. So it's one, I want to stop also. And the psychiatrist is clinging to life hellbent on perpetuating her idea that those who use psychedelics are fucked up in the head.

Feel free to let it out. I try to listen to those in any situation in their lives when they speak up. And I also may not have anything to say right away, but I'll usually come back to it. Godspeed. Keep up the fight.

 

[n3ophy7e]

Almost the end of 2021 and Im still in this mess
looking, seeking for a way off the drugs lol

Hi greenlight and welcome to Bluelight So sorry to hear you're still struggling with antipsychotics. Which meds are you on, exactly? (if you don't mind me asking)

 

[greenlight204]

Hi greenlight and welcome to Bluelight So sorry to hear you're still struggling with antipsychotics. Which meds are you on, exactly? (if you don't mind me asking)

Hi, yes it is very unfortunate. I am prescribed zyprexa and seroquel, I take the zyprexa more, it calms my body down whereas seroquel gives me a strange head high almost like adderal. does that mean I need the pills? lol really the only thing these pills do for me is shorten time, slow it down, and allow me to focus a bit more like ADHD weird

 

[n3ophy7e]

Hi, yes it is very unfortunate. I am prescribed zyprexa and seroquel, I take the zyprexa more, it calms my body down whereas seroquel gives me a strange head high almost like adderal. does that mean I need the pills? lol really the only thing these pills do for me is shorten time, slow it down, and allow me to focus a bit more like ADHD weird

Sorry if I'm wrong but it sounds like they're kinda doing opposite things? When was the last time you spoke to your psychiatrist about tying to get off your meds?

 

[greenlight204]

Sorry if I'm wrong but it sounds like they're kinda doing opposite things? When was the last time you spoke to your psychiatrist about tying to get off your meds?

I haven't seen my psychiatrist in 6 months

 

[Jabberwocky]

I haven't seen my psychiatrist in 6 months

Hey. I’m really sorry to hear this is still an ongoing issue for you. I have been prescribed different anti-psychotics a few times and eventually weaned myself off them. I strongly suggest you work with your psychiatrist to get off them in a planful way. Also, ask him or her straight out if he believes in Antipsychotic Discontinuation Syndrome and if they say no, get a new psychiatrist who does.

A few things to think about:

1. To be on APs you need to be totally clear about what behaviours/thoughts justify you taking them. That is, what symptoms you are treating. Some things can be treated with other forms of therapy and some cannot. Depression or ruminating thoughts can often be treated with behavioural therapy for example but severe psychosis cannot.

2. Long term use of AP’s result in neuroplastic changes in your brain. For some APs and some conditions it has been suggested that a few years on the drug permanently heals the brain through creating new structures in different parts of the brain meaning that the AP has a lasting positive effect even after you stop taking it. The most promising research in this area relates to Abilify and I am not sure about Zyprexa or Seroquel.

3, All APs have side effects and it is common practice to cycle a person through a number of them until the optimum one is found. That is the right balance of improving symptoms and minimising side effects. You need to be clear what side effects make you want to stop Zyprexa and Seroquel. If i recall correctly I was first given Zyprexa when acutely ill, then shifted to Seroquel for several months (but ceased because of weight gain and nocturnal enurisis) and eventually ended up on Abilify that I took for 5 years. I thought I hated all APs until I found Abilify which ultimately helped me a lot. But it also had side effects and I did not want to be on it forever.

4. The psychological suffering you go through quitting APs can be very real. People say that ones like Abilify with very long half-lives do not result in withdrawal but there is quite a bit of research demonstrating that half-life and plasma levels are not the determinants of withdrawal symptoms. You will need to taper but might also need some other drugs temporarily to get you through. The tapering can take several months and it is not simply a linear reduction in dosage (i.e not just reducing by half every few weeks).This is why you need a psych who believes in AP Withdrawal Syndrome.

5. Don’t make the mistake of trying to self-medicate as you quit.

 

[greenlight204]

Wow, thanks for all the responses - Im just looking through them now and will address some points

Its now end of January, and I weaned myself off my AP's after leaving my PDoc's office voicemails as I'm out of refills on both my Z and S. I started to (at least feel) like I was doing better at my job, but I lost a lot of the control AP's either made me feel or created. A lot of my friends Ive had for the past few years, the interactions just changed, and it's because I've mostly known them as I've been on APs.

I feel great and much better but a lot of the time I feel like I'm going crazy and I think I'm still probably withdrawing from 3+ years of AP's. As I write this message I am high off an edible and very cohesive - I used to feel uncomfortable getting high while taking those meds but for some reason now I have peace.

I did lose my job though. But it's because I slacked off two Quarters last year (while on APs) and as new year review came that wasn't enough to keep my role. Off the AP's I feel like I was starting to reach my full potential at work however I did notice some drawbacks as I was talking to people less.

I dont really know where I'm going right now - I'm obtaining a new position and I'm not really doing a whole lot each day besides working out, but I strangely feel on the right path. I kicked ass for a few years before any type of diagnosis, but today actually I stumbled upon some text threads from that time and it does now seem like I lost my marbles.

I still don't know if Im crazy, of course I don't think I am to a certain extent at least not medically, but what I can say is I find a lot of things that people typically don't think twice about pretty difficult. I'm hoping this goes away with time as I've heavily abused drugs through my teens into adulthood.

I saw a neurologist last year and addressed most of my concerns and she believes all these symptoms I'm experiencing directly stem from my heavy drug abuse - we didn't schedule another appointment

Life's weird and my priorities as well as attention span, focus, drive, goals, ambitions, dreams, and daily life is soo radically different from what it used to be. But I still have a strange lingering sense of hope things will somehow, magically, someway improve. Peace

 

[greenlight204]

Hey. I’m really sorry to hear this is still an ongoing issue for you. I have been prescribed different anti-psychotics a few times and eventually weaned myself off them. I strongly suggest you work with your psychiatrist to get off them in a planful way. Also, ask him or her straight out if he believes in Antipsychotic Discontinuation Syndrome and if they say no, get a new psychiatrist who does.

A few things to think about:

1. To be on APs you need to be totally clear about what behaviours/thoughts justify you taking them. That is, what symptoms you are treating. Some things can be treated with other forms of therapy and some cannot. Depression or ruminating thoughts can often be treated with behavioural therapy for example but severe psychosis cannot.

2. Long term use of AP’s result in neuroplastic changes in your brain. For some APs and some conditions it has been suggested that a few years on the drug permanently heals the brain through creating new structures in different parts of the brain meaning that the AP has a lasting positive effect even after you stop taking it. The most promising research in this area relates to Abilify and I am not sure about Zyprexa or Seroquel.

3, All APs have side effects and it is common practice to cycle a person through a number of them until the optimum one is found. That is the right balance of improving symptoms and minimising side effects. You need to be clear what side effects make you want to stop Zyprexa and Seroquel. If i recall correctly I was first given Zyprexa when acutely ill, then shifted to Seroquel for several months (but ceased because of weight gain and nocturnal enurisis) and eventually ended up on Abilify that I took for 5 years. I thought I hated all APs until I found Abilify which ultimately helped me a lot. But it also had side effects and I did not want to be on it forever.

4. The psychological suffering you go through quitting APs can be very real. People say that ones like Abilify with very long half-lives do not result in withdrawal but there is quite a bit of research demonstrating that half-life and plasma levels are not the determinants of withdrawal symptoms. You will need to taper but might also need some other drugs temporarily to get you through. The tapering can take several months and it is not simply a linear reduction in dosage (i.e not just reducing by half every few weeks).This is why you need a psych who believes in AP Withdrawal Syndrome.

5. Don’t make the mistake of trying to self-medicate as you quit.

I'll absolutely ask this next time, if at all I meet him. Withdrawal's a bitch. Fuck drugs - I'm getting back to that mindset where I just believe in purity. The suffering is real.

How do people who take APs their whole life do it? I dont understand why and how these powerful things have the most insane side effect profiles

 

[Jerry Atrick]

I'll absolutely ask this next time, if at all I meet him. Withdrawal's a bitch. Fuck drugs - I'm getting back to that mindset where I just believe in purity. The suffering is real.

How do people who take APs their whole life do it? I dont understand why and how these powerful things have the most insane side effect profiles

I've been taking Abilify for nearly 14 years and it has helped me immensely with very minimal side effects.

Seroquel gave me extreme fatigue so I took it for less than a week. A couple years and much psychosis later, I took Risperdal intermittenly then received Risperidone injections in a state hospital. The Risperdal/Risperidone gave me severe anhedonia. Abilify seems to be the right medication that works for me and I don't regret staying on it. I have toyed with the idea of trying to taper off but I ask myself, why stop something that works? The only real side effect for me is that I have some emotional numbing. But I would not say it is enough to call it anhedonia.

When you ask how people take APs their whole life, you must remember that everyone is different and each person's brain reacts differently to these medications as well as whatever symptoms warrant taking the medications in the first place. Just because you haven't yet found the right one for you does not mean they are useless for everyone, or even you.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

When you ask how people take APs their whole life, you must remember that everyone is different and each person's brain reacts differently to these medications as well as whatever symptoms warrant taking the medications in the first place. Just because you haven't yet found the right one for you does not mean they are useless for everyone, or even you.

So very true.

I tried seroquel and zyprexa and hated them both, then I switched to risperidone and it was almost side effect free, which at first surprised me since it is significantly more potent AP than the others.

The more experiences I obtain with drugs, medications and the variables of other's experiences the more I realize just how true that statement is. Everyone has incredibly unique body/brain chemistry. It's not just some "be safe" warning they give out, it's damn true.