Nicomorphinist
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2019
- Messages
- 1,401
Hydromorphone (Dilaudid, Hydal &c) comes in amber ampoules of aqueous solution and the occasional dry ampoule in some markets which are covered with opaque paper and phials with dark brown glass, and the package inserts, patents, entries in reference books and the like say things along the line of "Solution may discolour slightly on exposure to light but this does not affect its potency" and the like, and this is also pointed out for oxymorphone, metopon, injectable oxycodone, articles about hydrocodone, as well as close relatives like hydromorphinol, oxymorphol, dihydromorphine, and the like.
I sometimes see this about esters as well like diacetyldihydromorphine, diamorphine, nicomorphine, acetylmorphone, dibenzoylmorphine, and acetylpropionylmorphine and their codeine and dihydrocodeine analogues if they have them. Presumably, morphine, dihydrocodeine, and codeine bear this caveat as well. Dilaudid compounding powders also have the warning about protecting from light.
The Dilaudid discolouration in question is from a clear solution that looks "wetter than water" and like a cylinder of quartz in a syringe to a degree (index of refraction) which is related to the concentration to this gorgeous amber colour, ranging from nearly invisible to the liquid looking like apple juice. I have observed this with oxymorphone and hydromorphinol as well. Once in a blue moon sediment will form and settle to the bottom which means the solution should be discarded according to the instructions.
Other listed ingredients include sodium hydroxide, hydrochloric acid and/or citric acid and sodium citrate to acheive a pH of 4.5 to 6.5 and Dilaudid HP is the most concentrated solution available as a proprietary drug at 10 mg/ml and others are 4 mg, 2 mg, and 1 mg per ml. I have not seen ones made isotonic with the 9 per mille sodium chloride at the factory but perhaps that is what the other ingredients do, and they do recommend diluting with saline if needed.
In my own experience with compounding powder I have been able to acheive concentrations of upwards of 36 mg/ml for SC medication purposes in particular and 250 mg/ml to prove I could do it and briefly conjured a supersaturated solution, so even the 10 mg/ml solution, which one can practically smell going in, is nowhere close to precipitating hydromophone crystals.
I know that the carbon-nitrogen skeleton has some flexibility to it and my preliminary theory is that the attached moeties at positions 3, 6, 8, or 14 are being knocked off by photons somewhere in the optical window and I am curious if hard ultraviolet, x-rays, gamma rays, or microwaves and far infrared do the same thing. Polarimeters and Fourier Transform Infrared absorption and transmission spectroscopy apparatus work on the principle that molecules can affect light, and the opposite is of course true, like silver salts used in photography.
What would be the mechanism of this discolouration, is it related to or not related to the photosensitivity, and what are the current views on exactly what wavelength of light decomposes these molecules?
I sometimes see this about esters as well like diacetyldihydromorphine, diamorphine, nicomorphine, acetylmorphone, dibenzoylmorphine, and acetylpropionylmorphine and their codeine and dihydrocodeine analogues if they have them. Presumably, morphine, dihydrocodeine, and codeine bear this caveat as well. Dilaudid compounding powders also have the warning about protecting from light.
The Dilaudid discolouration in question is from a clear solution that looks "wetter than water" and like a cylinder of quartz in a syringe to a degree (index of refraction) which is related to the concentration to this gorgeous amber colour, ranging from nearly invisible to the liquid looking like apple juice. I have observed this with oxymorphone and hydromorphinol as well. Once in a blue moon sediment will form and settle to the bottom which means the solution should be discarded according to the instructions.
Other listed ingredients include sodium hydroxide, hydrochloric acid and/or citric acid and sodium citrate to acheive a pH of 4.5 to 6.5 and Dilaudid HP is the most concentrated solution available as a proprietary drug at 10 mg/ml and others are 4 mg, 2 mg, and 1 mg per ml. I have not seen ones made isotonic with the 9 per mille sodium chloride at the factory but perhaps that is what the other ingredients do, and they do recommend diluting with saline if needed.
In my own experience with compounding powder I have been able to acheive concentrations of upwards of 36 mg/ml for SC medication purposes in particular and 250 mg/ml to prove I could do it and briefly conjured a supersaturated solution, so even the 10 mg/ml solution, which one can practically smell going in, is nowhere close to precipitating hydromophone crystals.
I know that the carbon-nitrogen skeleton has some flexibility to it and my preliminary theory is that the attached moeties at positions 3, 6, 8, or 14 are being knocked off by photons somewhere in the optical window and I am curious if hard ultraviolet, x-rays, gamma rays, or microwaves and far infrared do the same thing. Polarimeters and Fourier Transform Infrared absorption and transmission spectroscopy apparatus work on the principle that molecules can affect light, and the opposite is of course true, like silver salts used in photography.
What would be the mechanism of this discolouration, is it related to or not related to the photosensitivity, and what are the current views on exactly what wavelength of light decomposes these molecules?
