Research chems/Supps to suppress stim/tren anxiety

[Ethan-ate]

Excluding opiates, benzos guys......which I am on (rehab opiate suboxone) and a benzo taper which I dont stick to I am afraid.

However I don't obviously intend to be using these forever.

I am now once again able to use ECA ,Clen, I also use (prefer) ritalin and I can even use yohimbe albeit at a low dose because my opiate,benzo and partially my anti-d mirtazapine but is there way to less the anxiety caused by stims.

Would old school anti hestamine/anti anxiety drugs like Promothazine, hydroxyline help

 

[Genetic Freak]

Excluding opiates, benzos guys......which I am on (rehab opiate suboxone) and a benzo taper which I dont stick to I am afraid.

However I don't obviously intend to be using these forever.

I am now once again able to use ECA ,Clen, I also use (prefer) ritalin and I can even use yohimbe albeit at a low dose because my opiate,benzo and partially my anti-d mirtazapine but is there way to less the anxiety caused by stims.

Would old school anti hestamine/anti anxiety drugs like Promothazine, hydroxyline help

Yes, Don't take them...!!!

 

[CFC]

Yeah I agree with GF really. I don't mean to sound negative but given the cocktail of drugs you're already taking why on earth would you want to start adding stims to the mix? Can you not exercise without them?

 

[Ethan-ate]

Honestly guys I am dissapointes to get such cookie cutter noob type answers more suitednto BBin.com.

I am not a noob, I've competed twice, trained with the Thai national team and worked with middle east pro's and been trained by a former Mr Asia who learnt his stuff from Dennis James and no I am not seeking points, just sayimg I am not a newb askimg how many unmarked DNP caps he should swallow.

Honestly compared to what I've seen at UK and Thai national level I am very consertative in any of my drug use and always have been.

I am in rehab yes that,not proud of it but proud I am getting out of it but a big part of my fight out is BBin. Its more or less saved me.

I don't honestly dont mean to sound rude and CFC you don't zound negative but just because someone may use yohimbe for morning CV for example in no way implies he cant/wont exercise without it, its a bit judgemental son't you think.....I assume none of us use exogenous testosterone and we are all natural.

Sorry guy used to a UK forum where we share info as is the case on other parts of BL I have posted in and never felt judged.

A steroid sub forum in BL would seem the last place on earth I'd expect these kindmof responses, really guys c'mon are we not all more experienced than this?

For examplemI don't like tren but I love its effects so I only use it low in 6 week andro phases.

At the min I can use stims so I thought this would be the place to ask.

Sorry,long reply but if I was a neebie I would of been made to feel a idiot and not come back.

I just prefer constructive answers and yes they can be negative.

Not a rant btw, just the wrong forum.

You guys are entitled to your responses, I am just used to a more helpful community and thats no slander on you both.

Peace.

 

[Ethan-ate]

Apoligies for spelling etc but late night tablet typing and big clumsy thumbs.

 

[NeighborMike]

Honestly guys I am dissapointes to get such cookie cutter noob type answers more suitednto BBin.com.

I am not a noob, I've competed twice, trained with the Thai national team and worked with middle east pro's and been trained by a former Mr Asia who learnt his stuff from Dennis James and no I am not seeking points, just sayimg I am not a newb askimg how many unmarked DNP caps he should swallow.

Honestly compared to what I've seen at UK and Thai national level I am very consertative in any of my drug use and always have been.

I am in rehab yes that,not proud of it but proud I am getting out of it but a big part of my fight out is BBin. Its more or less saved me.

I don't honestly dont mean to sound rude and CFC you don't zound negative but just because someone may use yohimbe for morning CV for example in no way implies he cant/wont exercise without it, its a bit judgemental son't you think.....I assume none of us use exogenous testosterone and we are all natural.

Sorry guy used to a UK forum where we share info as is the case on other parts of BL I have posted in and never felt judged.

A steroid sub forum in BL would seem the last place on earth I'd expect these kindmof responses, really guys c'mon are we not all more experienced than this?

For examplemI don't like tren but I love its effects so I only use it low in 6 week andro phases.

At the min I can use stims so I thought this would be the place to ask.

Sorry,long reply but if I was a neebie I would of been made to feel a idiot and not come back.

I just prefer constructive answers and yes they can be negative.

Not a rant btw, just the wrong forum.

You guys are entitled to your responses, I am just used to a more helpful community and thats no slander on you both.

Peace.

There not noob answers at all. Despite this being a BBing/steroid board on BL you need to remember that BL first is a harm reduction board.
Youre on stimulants already, along with a gang of other shit, and u want to take even more stuff to stop the anxiety from adding something else on top of all the stuff you already are on?

No one here is going to advocate you adding things when you are already on a bunch of stuff and have admitted to a drug problem. It sounds to me like youre becoming on BBing reliant on BBing compounds to replace your old drug habit.

The point of BBing as a habit is look better, feel better, get healthy, develop a good positive hobby and to kill time. No where in there is a need to use a gang of supplements to do that, you certainly shouldnt add a supplement that could make an already existing problem worse.

And if you insist on using tren but are concerned with the sides dont use it. Ive been using tren for 10 years, i dont think ive ever had a cycle with it - its the perfect steroid to me for any weight loss or weight gain. With that said all of my friends constantly ask me what im on cause they want to look like me, i get them on tren. Some of them can handle it some of them cant, if you cant handle the sides its not for you because there is nothing you can do to calm that anxiety other then taking some kind of benzo and thats obviously not an option for someone with a drug problem.

You can go around other boards and get all type of ridiculous answers because most boards do not care about harm reduction they take questions at face value and answer them, but not here

 

[Ethan-ate]

Its a good answer and I appreciate the tone and reasoning, my "usual" board is also concerned with harm reduction however we do appreciate some guys will run a compound they do not need to run at that time in there BBin life or simply have no clue what they are talking about so agreed when we get anew guy who posts a shit diet but wants to blast DNP we steer him away,some of us bluntly, others not so.....however as you and I know the individual will probably do it anyhow, same with regard to slin.....as those compounds are the least forgiving to say the least but harm reduction usually end in telling someone,look shouldn't do this but.....if you are (will anyway) heres how to do it safe.....if we slam someone or come across as judgemental they will go elsewhere so with regard to harm reduction I agree.

With regars to tren, I used to suffer heavily when I was pig headed many years back but after being givne advice to 1/ use less, 2/use ace and 3 lower my test now I am ok but before that I still got a string of "other" forum replies saying "simple,don't usd it" .......like I hadn't thought of that option?Luckily someone helped......thats not harm reduction its just not being helpful.

I have never wrote I am on a "load of shit" already.

I am on shorting test prop at 150mg and 25mcg T3 per week as I dislike long test esters and know my priority right now is complete my rehab but also know I need to keep a solid focus on a goal....thats just me,I have to work toward something.

Any use of stims would be so small as I don't believe it needs to be high anyhow if your diet and cardio are inplace and they are.

However personally I find and have seen great results from very little when you are already in shape.

If some guy might of answered "not to sound patronising but take care using stims in rehab but 25mg hydoxyline or a amino /supp would lessen side,take care" .....I would of understood his concern, appreciated it and took his advice on board.

I just find the answers I was given patronising and a bit cookie cutter although they I'd hope they were not meant that way.

If i was a recovering meth addict then yes I would understand any stimulant/addiction concerns.

Using a little yohimbe fasted doing my cv is hardly using BBin as a new addiction, to be fair.....I take BBin much to seriously too use it as "new addiction excuse".

Lastly your comment about using BBin to look good,get healthy, feel better is a noble sentiment and no I am not patronising.

However after working in the circles I have with guys pushing for pro cards.....I am afraid health is way down the list.....this is unfortunate and I spent alot of time with the former Mr Asia/Mr Thailand (10years ago champ albeit) trying to keep the young hungry guys in check telling them about BP med, getting bloods done, addressing HDL.....

Some of the middle eastern arab guys were pushed to unreal limits by their coach who despite being a bit of a ass I learnt so much from.

The amount of clen some of his guys were on they admitted made them feel like nervous wrecks with BP thru the roof unanle to take beta blockers as it would negate the clen so I suggested rampiril a ace inhibitor.

Taking one drug to help cancel the side of another....is it ideal........fuck no but it is harm reduction.

They accepted their God awful clen anxiety the same way they accepted 2 CV sessions a day on sub 100g carb, eating another dry chicken breast, it was their life.....as it was mine although more on the coaching side of things but being 40 anow and having the experience of being a addict in the midst of all this gave me the perspective to help my guys -TBAA Thai team not fuck themselves up.....too much and that there is life after BBin but of course with these young men in their early 20s with great genetics you can only lead a horse to water.

A lot of stuff I have seen take place just to win a trophy is.......shocking but thats thenugly truth of BBin at these levels and it is filtering down the ranks,honestly now I am back in the UK after 5 years the accessability of any PEDs to the average gym rate and the total lack of respect for the compounds and knowledge is God awful, guys asking about tren, dnp after training 6months who wouldn't know what a bent over row is...,

I am sure you know and understand also.

Anyhow with respect to all the above posters as fellow BBers I hope you realise I really do appreciate your sentiments.

Its morning cardio time for me so time to go, sorry it seems long winded like I have taken offence, quite the opposite is true....I just wanted you guys to know we are on the same side.

Thank you

 

[CFC]

Suggesting you avoid using stimulants is hardly judgmental mate. You probably don't need them but especially when you're already suffering side-effects from being overstimulated by tren. It would be utterly reckless of me to suggest otherwise.

Honestly I don't care if you're a complete noob or have been doing this for 30 years, you are not going to find me advocating the use of stimulants with strong AAS due to the cardiovascular risks. It has nothing to do with worrying about addiction. It's your health that worries me.

But then you're also adding a whole load of other prescribed meds and ancillaries on top to try and offset each particular additional side-effect they bring up. Eventually it gets to be like a dog chasing it's own tail in circles with side-effects. Surely you can see why it would just be simpler and healthier to not add stimulants to your mix?

Which is why I asked why you needed to add a stimulant? I'm sorry if you felt that was provocative but it was a genuine question and your reaction seems excessive...

 

[Genetic Freak]

Honestly guys I am disappointed to get such cookie cutter noob type answers more suited to BBing.com.

Peace.

I might have thought recklessly recommending more drugs could have been more suited to BBing.com, not here..!!

We promote minimal polypharmacy for maximal therapeutic effect for anyone, whether they be beginner or advanced level.. It's called being responsible..

I am on (rehab opiate suboxone) and a benzo taper which I don't stick to I am afraid.

How would you have us interpret your first post.? You have a taper off plan you don't stick to.. (it suggests to us you are kinda irresponsible... I'm sorry but that's how I see it)...

Why are you prescribed benzos, is it part of a medically supervised withdrawal from suboxone..Or do you have an opiate and benzo addiction..?

You don't tell us anything about your experience with hormones, training, competition experience, dose, ester, injection frequency, what you have tried to alleviate your condition in the past, did it work, if it did why is it not working now..!!
Why do you feel you need the stimulants, is it because you lack motivation to train, or are you in the last few weeks pre-comp..?

For us to be able to assist you, you have to give us something to work with also..


As previously stated by CFC, there is the potential for huge negative effects to cardiovascular health from the use of AAS, which is neglected far too often when planning long cycles with multiple compounds, to advocate the use of stimulants would be totally reckless of us both, given what we understand about the cardiovascular system's degenerative changes from long term AAS use..

 

[Ethan-ate]

Guys these answers are much more what I expected.

Cfc, appreciate your conccern, apologies if I seemed over excessive in response,no offence was meant to anyone as I believe no offence was meant to me.

GF I am down to 12mg diazapam prescribed on my rehab taper for a previous addiction.

My opiate issue was tramadoland codeine and I was placed on subox, I have regular urine tests but I am seeing it through, I broke/relapsed on my benzo taper last week due to personal issue but got out of it after e days and I am back on course.

I am very commited to getting clean but am I scared aswell, yes certainly.

Suboxone with its long HL allows me to use stims simply as ....well lets face it, its a opiate, even at a dose it would offset any sides.

I have always known, been aware of enough guys constantly running benzos because they were pumping into much tren or test in general or over cooking the clen and eph plus using the eph recreationally.

I can assure you thats not my background, I never started on my first addiction tramadol 5yrs ago looking for abuzz....alll those day were long behind me in my youth lkng before my BBin lifersaver adventure began and I have always been responsible IMO with amounts used.

So I know I don't need stims because I dont like them and so only used pharma T3 with regard to thermogenic support however when I did used to use rhem I got very good results in small numbers as my diet is on point and I don't cheat etc thus in the next few months after my benzo taper is done (I will still be on suboxone) I feel I will be ready mentally to get off low level HRT/TRT cruising and start off with a anabo,ic phasemof about 8 weeks as I was taught before hitting the harder andros for 6 weeks.....in this period I will use insulin,I am very experienced with fast acting but I will not use generic GH and right now I simply cannot justify pharma GH to run with the slin.

I know the poor mans slin/dnp protocol is doing the round its seems and although a experienced DNP user in the past I would not touch it now as being around the physiques and knowledge I have aqquired being present at the 2012 and 2013 Mr Thailand and the new ASEAN bangkok classic where I met some pro's and very very! Chaty middle eastern coach he gave some slin protocols and peptide info to my "then" Boss of the Thai team using a double split 2 x ED training plan, fasted CV, low fat, high carbs and reasonably high stims.

Personally reset for me I would currently need a 3rd of the slin/carb intake which is also good as suboxone or not I don't want to run stim high or even moderate at doses or length of time, we are talking 6 weeks after all and only in my andro phase.

My only worry be odema and BP adding tren,clen etc plus the sudden water weight gain however I am presribed as said rampiril for high BP and would use 2 halves of dyazide fri night and sat morning if I get sock line odema howevef with my diet as clean as it is it should be a mininum.

None of of this is set in stone yet, I have all the compounds needed but I feel that clearing my benzo taper and 1st becoming accustumed to the 2 x each day train (although not every day) and the exact meal timing around two session and gauging any crossover slin points as I am uses to humalog in Thailand and have regular right now so I am researching.

I've done this sucessfully before on myself 5yrs ago and have used the procedure in thenmlast 18months on two individual kne of who could not afford GH ,one who ran chinese (bunk IMO) GH.

However I am in "rehab" which right now i feel is going sucessfully not only with the opiate therapy but the group meeting etc however I imagine I will be on suboxone some time so I am taking advantage of it by being able to use stims anspd thus follow the protocol I was taught as close as possible albeit ina more consersative fashion.

Let me stress again I usually run no stims at all and long anabolic test.p ,deca,EQ ,winnie etc for most of the time at moderate doses only hitting the andro for 6 to 8 week blocks again at moderate doses and only use pharma product whenever possible which in Thailand it was.

I have to have a goal guys, I won't be competiting.....I do not PT anyone here in the UK, I came home from my "previous life" in Bangkok because of a close family illness/death, after this since I was here and could use the UK free health service I knew it was time to clean up.

Honestly guys without bodybuilding through many dark phases of my life.....my mothers passing, break-ups,loss of a close child ( I was also a kindergarten teacher -lol) in Thailand.....,there is not many BBin KG teachers.

......and now this phase, addiction, a trap I watched sprung around me and I did not act until I had lost everything I had worked so hard for.

My tendency for dependency is offending me guys, I am no 90s throwback BBer looking to score bain and hit the clubs at wkend after a bicep sess.......even in Bangkok I did not succumb to arty life' as I loved my jobs as KG teacher and a 'sub' coach ,TP for the TBAA guys......I even got in ok shape myself.

About 195Ib at 8% dry at a shortass 5.5....

Addiction took most of that too guys and a lot of my pride.

I got back in the gym here in the Uk in April at a 11.12 stone.....yes I feel fine to admit I fucked up on painkillers and benzos after a "trigger" .

....but I am fighting my way back but knew to get my diet in check, training before raising anything off a HRT level.

Again I do appreciate the level of concern shown here and it does show that I were a noob you seem a helpful bunch so I hope we did not get off on the wrong foot.

I won't to/take anything until I am 100% ready, being 40 now I take my health seriously.

I get my bloods done every 6 months and y last check 1 month ago was fine except for my HDL as I was presribed statins in Bangkok but here I am still waiting.

Liver values,Urea function,TSH (when I was off T3) were fine.

However as we know with addictions as with some of the stim concerns the mental issues are more the potential worry.

Lastly sorry I type too much......I guess there are easier ways to introduce your life story!

I hope that clears anything up, again sorry if anyone thinks I disrespected there opinions,I certainly do not in this game.