Questions regarding first time with ecstacy

[Harry Haller]

Dear members,

I’m obviously interesting in trying ecstasy but I’m quite nervous and thought it might be a good idea to check with people who’ve actually done this before.

I’m 40 years old and after a few rather negative experiences occuring simultaneously (loss of my job due to bullying by a colleague, my 17 year old cat dying and losing a friendship that was very young but was very dear to me) and while I have been able to stave off depression with daily meditation and exercise I’m losing hope I’ll ever find work in my sector again after the upteenth rejection letter.

In short I’m considering suicide (I have no interest in taking on a crappy job just to survive) but given how that might affect some close to me (including my nephews who are very young, we’re quite close) I’d rather try other things first.

A former friend of mine was quite into drugs (I’ve tried some in my youth but not in the last 1,5 decade) and he told me once that if I was ever suicidal I really ought to try MDMA. Meditation has been great in that it protected me against the horrible pain that is depression (I have had significant experience with that and it nearly killed me) but now I feel numb and unable to motivate myself to do anything really.

I want to feel alive again and find some meaning in this life that might give me the momentum and drive to go on. Does anyone have experiences with MDMA/ecstacy in this regard they want to share?

My brother procured some pills for us (good quality) and suggested we do it this Wednesday at his place. I’m not sure whether that’s a good idea given that he lives in an appartement so there can be no loud music (I used to love classic late 90's to 2010 trance) and I’m somewhat worried about becoming too emotional and oversharing (he’s my youngest brother, he has bipolar disorder and we’re very different people although we do care about each-other). Also about crashing the day after but then again something needs to be done as I can’t keep living like this. I’ve tried anti-depressants and therapy in the past and they have been detrimental to me. I would be willing to give psychotherapy with MDMA a try but that is not legal in my country.

Unfortunately I have no other people in my life I can do this with (my friends don't take drugs) so it’s either with my brother or alone. For safety reasons I’d think company is probably a good idea, no?

Any feedback would be appreciated. I hope this wasn’t too long winded. I will look around the forum for safety tips of course.

 

[someguyontheinternet]

Rolling with your brother will likely be a very profound experience and I think your relationship would improve after the experience as well. I don't see much of an issue with music as I'm guessing that you guys can have stuff on that isn't too loud. No reason to blast it IMO. I hope you have a wonderful, positive experience that helps you get through some of your trauma. You seem to be preparing and researching adequately so I'm personally not worried

 

[Harry Haller]

Thanks man. I appreciate the kind response.

Have a nice day/evening/night: whatever is applicable to you.

 

[cosmosmariner]

I’m sorry you’re considering suicide. While I think that MDMA might help, it’s not a substitute for therapy, and there is quite a bit of evidence showing that MDMA combined with therapy afterwards can have profound effects.

 

[cosmosmariner]

And one other thought, use the rollsafe.org guidelines for dosing: 1 mg per kg of body weight plus 50. You should have an amazing experience with few undesirable side effects at that dose.

 

[Harry Haller]

I’m sorry you’re considering suicide. While I think that MDMA might help, it’s not a substitute for therapy, and there is quite a bit of evidence showing that MDMA combined with therapy afterwards can have profound effects.

Thanks for the kind reply. In truth I don't think the problem is my state of mind per se: it's more the impossible job situation which makes life seem rather worthless. That being said it's a good experiment isn't it? If I try MDMA (I read somewhere that MDMA is powder while it's called ecstacy when it's in pill form, is this correct?) and it does change my outlook then clearly it was a mental issue. If not my perspective on this is rational.

I do agree it's good to talk about this but given that 'mental health professionals' carry the legal obligation of preventing suicide and can be held liable if they fail it's a fairly dangerous proposition to talk about this too openly which is why I've been avoiding this avenue. I did talk regularly with a volunteer at a local humanistic organization and that helped so I might do that again. She's not a professional so perhaps that would make it safer for both her and me.

Of course should the suicidal thoughts go away after this perhaps therapy could be useful. We'll see.

Have a nice day.

 

[Harry Haller]

And one other thought, use the rollsafe.org guidelines for dosing: 1 mg per kg of body weight plus 50. You should have an amazing experience with few undesirable side effects at that dose.

Thanks for the tip. I'm researching how to do this as safely as possible (including hydration but I guess that's lesss of an issue when you're not dancing at a party) and dosage is of course of vital importance.

I must say I'm quite excited thinking about this and planning for it: perhaps that in itself will do wonders for my mood/outlook. We'll see.

The funny thing is that I had multiple opportunities to do this when I was younger: chances are my life would be much better now if I actually had taken the plunge but better late than never.

 

[someguyontheinternet]

Most issues like this are truly a matter of perspective. Our perspective is shaped by our brains, modifying the signaling pathways with the use of drugs is an excellent way to rapidly change perspectives. MDMA is definitely a good choice and perhaps you may benefit from psychedelics as well once you get through the roughest part. Definitely make sure you have someone you can trust to talk to while going through these experiences, MDMA really helps to open me up and I've overcome a lot of trauma through talking with people while on MDMA

 

[Harry Haller]

Most issues like this are truly a matter of perspective. Our perspective is shaped by our brains, modifying the signaling pathways with the use of drugs is an excellent way to rapidly change perspectives. MDMA is definitely a good choice and perhaps you may benefit from psychedelics as well once you get through the roughest part. Definitely make sure you have someone you can trust to talk to while going through these experiences, MDMA really helps to open me up and I've overcome a lot of trauma through talking with people while on MDMA

I agree: which is why I've taken up meditation (when monks meditate under a scanner the pleasure/happiness center in their brains lights up like a Christmas tree) and am exploring Buddhism as well as psychedelics (of which MDMA is a subclass if I'm not mistaken). It's like the Buddha said: every person must strive for their own liberation. I must make this change, no-one can do it for me. That includes having the courage to acquire new experiences and trying new things. Which doesn't come naturally to me as I'm fairly introverted but I need to do this. The alternative is death and while I personally don't think consciousness survives physical death and I have no children of my own I can't bear thinking about breaking my godson's heart. That little guy is precious to me. They all are.

I'm sorry to hear you also had some negative experiences but I'm glad you found a good, succesful way of dealing with them. That gives me hope: it really does.

I've read that MDMA and other psychedelics are hot topics in the treatment of all sorts of mental health problems so of course I'm drawn to it. I'm refraining from alcohol as it's a downer and it interferes with meditation: this isn't the time to muddle my thoughts and perhaps do something stupid as a consequence of it. I want to grow from this: this isn't about having fun and hedonism.

I'm sure my brother is trustworthy. I do find myself longing for close friends to share such experiences with (I've lost some that were very dear to my heart including the love of my life) but alas I have none at the moment. Which is part of the problem but I'm hoping to sort that out.

Take care man.

 

[foodcrisis]

Most issues like this are truly a matter of perspective. Our perspective is shaped by our brains, modifying the signaling pathways with the use of drugs is an excellent way to rapidly change perspectives. MDMA is definitely a good choice and perhaps you may benefit from psychedelics as well once you get through the roughest part. Definitely make sure you have someone you can trust to talk to while going through these experiences, MDMA really helps to open me up and I've overcome a lot of trauma through talking with people while on MDMA

yeah. i was totally thinking about recommending a low dose of mushrooms to this poster if they really like the effects of mdma. i feel like if a person really likes mdma it might be a better idea to get into shrooms at low doses. i felt like they were pretty similar body highs when only using like a gram to a half 1/8th of shrooms and shrooms has the possibility to get a little bit of visuals at those doses too... i find low doses of shrooms to be good for meditation with closed eye visuals if you're into that type of thing... i'm going to guess dosing frequently on low doses of shrooms is better for the brain than taking mdma often. i get a huge tolerance to mdma and mda really fast too. that's the thing that sucks about it imo. sometimes people can get life changing experiences from just dosing once though, so good luck.

 

[crazyhairman]

I probably would advise against you using MDMA honestly. Try just some therapy first. Maybe a low low dose of THC edibles.

MDMA is a slippery slope of you are considered suicide. You will have an amazing 5 hours but after that is anyone's guess. It sounds like your mind is made up so you're going to do whatever you feel is best.

Hope you're brother knows about test kits because "good quality" these days is a shot in the dark.

Idk I'm split on this one really. What if you only feel alive on MDMA then what? You need to get to the root of why you feel like you do.

Just start slow

 

[G_Chem]

I personally think MDMA can be an amazing catalyst in times of strife. I honestly didn’t have a shred of love for myself until my first roll, in that moment I knew I was worthy of love and it stuck with me.

You just need to be aware this is no magic fix. You will come down and reality does come back. You need to find ways to integrate those realizations into every day life. Remind yourself why you stick it out, the love for your godson, your family like your brother, these people care about you. You may not see it now but hopefully you’ll see it when the MDMA hits.

I highly recommend researching how to prevent any neurotoxicity that may occur. Essentially eat an antioxidant rich diet the week leading up to and the week after your experience. And take antioxidant rich supplements immediately after you’ve fully comedown. I usually go for Airborne chewables, keeps it easy. Exercise as much as you can in the days after.

I also suggest researching more into psychedelics if this MDMA experience delivers. Wish you the best and know we are always here to talk.

-GC

 

[Harry Haller]

Update: my brother let me know there will be a bicycle race on Wednesday near him so I won't be able to travel there given that I'm reliant on public transportation and there won't be any buses that day..

I don't know how to feel about this: on the one hand I'm dissapointed, on the other there wasn't much time to prepare and I was a bit apprehensive about that.

I guess we'll have to reschedule. He suggested a weekend but since he has his two children during the weekends I'm not sure when that will be.

Thanks you all for your replies: much appreciated but I'll adress them later. I'm tired so I think I'll go for a walk, meditate and turn in early.

 

[Harry Haller]

I probably would advise against you using MDMA honestly. Try just some therapy first. Maybe a low low dose of THC edibles.

MDMA is a slippery slope of you are considered suicide. You will have an amazing 5 hours but after that is anyone's guess. It sounds like your mind is made up so you're going to do whatever you feel is best.

Hope you're brother knows about test kits because "good quality" these days is a shot in the dark.

Idk I'm split on this one really. What if you only feel alive on MDMA then what? You need to get to the root of why you feel like you do.

Just start slow

Thanks for your input. Of course I don't know what to expect but I do think it's something worth exploring.

Like I stated previously therapy is not an option for me as I won't risk losing my freedom. In this supposedly free society you're not at liberty to check out: which tells me freedom is an illusion. I know the law in my country: 'involuntary commitment' is basically newspeak for incarceration for the thought crime of wanting to end your life. Which makes the 'your' pretty suspect, no?

Plus I know the root of my problem: the fact that my career is ruined and I do not belong or want to belong to a society where justice and freedom are mere buzzwords that don't really mean anything. I've dealt with my emotional issues (loss of what I thought was an amazing friend/soul mate and others in the past): through the practice of meditation I've realized the Buddha spoke the truth and ego is the source of misery and pain, at least mentally. When attachment ceases suffering ceases also: this is what is called 'Nirvana' or 'Nibbana'.

I actually feel quite good in the sense that I'm not suffering although I realize this situation is pretty much hopeless: the amazing byproduct of realizing the ego is essentially an illusion and thoughts and emotions are like clouds in the sky.

This is probably not something to discuss here but I wonder what remains to be done on this earth. When one loses one's attachments there is nothing left to keep the wheel of desire and suffering going. I don't know whether reincarnation is real but I've read in the buddhist sutra's there are a few examples of monks voluntarily leaving this life to which the Buddha proclaims they are blameless since before their death they left all desire behind and thus acted without emotion. This is probably something I need to discuss with an authority in Buddhism.

As to quality: good remark but given that he got the stuff through his best friend who although he's young works in high level finance: these people don't mess around with street dealers so I'm confident it's quality.

 

[Harry Haller]

I personally think MDMA can be an amazing catalyst in times of strife. I honestly didn’t have a shred of love for myself until my first roll, in that moment I knew I was worthy of love and it stuck with me.

You just need to be aware this is no magic fix. You will come down and reality does come back. You need to find ways to integrate those realizations into every day life. Remind yourself why you stick it out, the love for your godson, your family like your brother, these people care about you. You may not see it now but hopefully you’ll see it when the MDMA hits.

I highly recommend researching how to prevent any neurotoxicity that may occur. Essentially eat an antioxidant rich diet the week leading up to and the week after your experience. And take antioxidant rich supplements immediately after you’ve fully comedown. I usually go for Airborne chewables, keeps it easy. Exercise as much as you can in the days after.

I also suggest researching more into psychedelics if this MDMA experience delivers. Wish you the best and know we are always here to talk.

-GC

Thank you for sharing your experience and the kind words. I'm not sure love is what I'm after: in my experience it's a major source of attachment and thus of suffering. At least in connection to others.

I do not hate myself nor do I consider myself terribly important or wonderful: the best I can explain it is that through meditation my ego has greatly lessened. The only downside seems to be a lack of ambition but then again I feel I'm seeing through all the illusions most people have about life and death: life is just a dopamine chasing game, people think reaching goals matters one bit (they just fall away to be replaced by new ones: ad nauseam untill one either concludes it's a fruitless chase or untill death comes) and that their life matters somehow while it's simply doesn't in this boundless and randon universe. Either death is an illusion too or the final end: i'm fine with either. I just don't see the point of playing this stupid game over and over now that I've realized just how stupid it really is. I think most people only realize this when they're actually dying and even then they'll find ways to deceive themselves and make a big fuss about how meaningful their life was... I've watched my cat die and she went very peacefully without resisting it: she clearly had no ego and that is why she's in my heart. Such a lovely creature...

I believe Nietzsche was right when he concluded Socrates considered life a disease and death the cure to said disease. Buddha said it too albeit indirectly as the First Noble Truth; life is dukkha: suffering, unease, imperfection, friction.... whatever you want to call it. Of course he didn't outright say death is the cure (neither did Socrates: he did order one of his students to make an offering to the Greek god of medicine) but since the goal of Buddhism is to never be reborn again and reincarnation seems highly suspect (even in buddhist terms: when we have no ego what exactly reincarnates and why should it matter to anyone?) in essence the goal is death.

I know the effects of any drug are only temporary (luckily: imagine being drunk, stoned or high all the time) but maybe it can give me a new perspective on this. That's all I'm looking for: this isn't about escapism but about exploring the possibility that maybe there is a way to make this feel worthwhile again. If not at least I tried.

I'm probably not making much sense, am I?

Thanks for the tip regarding anti-oxidants. Where do you get yours? I suppose any drug store or pharmacy should have such supplements.

 

[someguyontheinternet]

Yea can get good supplements as you said from any pharmacy/drug store but also amazon. I usually try to look for more reputable brands that are more likely to actually contain what they say they contain when shopping in the web. Some suppliers also offer certificates of analysis for their various batches

 

[Opi_Kid_Rock]

I once had tunnel vision before I pursued a career change. I worked in one sector for so many years and did my first college degree in it and so I thought “this is all I know.” Wrong!
After trying over seven different jobs and school subjects, I found something else that fits my personality and strengths. Believe me, there have been times I thought I would never find something that would ever feel right. Don’t give up.
I have a lot of experience rolling on MDMA. Great opportunities for bonding with those you trust like your brother and an opportunity to philosophize about life and the many facets of it.
The attachment to not wanting to exist is one of the cravings described in Buddhism recall. The middle way means in some ways to not go too extreme in any direction as how could it be a healthy outlook? I’m just trying to figure things out while I just happen to inhabit this big rock we’re on too. So don’t believe anything blindly but explore on your own bro.

Peace

 

[robbli777]

Be wary of the come down, you may feel even worse a few days after and crave the experience again, which can lead onto an addiction plus exacerbate your suicide ideation. I don't think it's a good idea in all honesty for you to go ahead at present, please be careful, especially taking it recreationally. Consider seeking emotional, spiritual and psychological support. It is not a quick fix for all problems. I understand where you are coming from because I've had a couple of suicide attempts in my past.

I used to do mollie with friends camping out in nature, now I've been doing solo therapy sessions with mollie once every few months, with the intention of healing past wounds, exploring my past traumas and pain as a child and teenager, writing in a journal, meditating in nature which has helped me a lot to go deep and understand what has been blocking me and is at the core of my pain. I recommend doing more research and reading books like "Trust Surrender Receive: How MDMA Can Release Us From Trauma and PTSD" and when you feel more ready and gained some previous experience, read "MDMA Solo". Cultivating discipline (i.e. not abusing it) and respect for the substance is essential.

Good luck on your healing journey.

 

[Harry Haller]

I once had tunnel vision before I pursued a career change. I worked in one sector for so many years and did my first college degree in it and so I thought “this is all I know.” Wrong!
After trying over seven different jobs and school subjects, I found something else that fits my personality and strengths. Believe me, there have been times I thought I would never find something that would ever feel right. Don’t give up.
I have a lot of experience rolling on MDMA. Great opportunities for bonding with those you trust like your brother and an opportunity to philosophize about life and the many facets of it.
The attachment to not wanting to exist is one of the cravings described in Buddhism recall. The middle way means in some ways to not go too extreme in any direction as how could it be a healthy outlook? I’m just trying to figure things out while I just happen to inhabit this big rock we’re on too. So don’t believe anything blindly but explore on your own bro.

Peace

That is true yet there are these stories of monks offing themselves. From what I've read one's state of mind is crucial which is why I'm working on that. Either way I'll find clarity with regard to my future or my mind will be properly prepared for an event that will happen anyway, sooner or later. Personally I don't get all the fuss that is made about this in society and especially religion: what does the life and death of one measily human on planet earth mean in the grand scheme of things? Yet we absolute must do X or avoid Y...

I'm not a buddhist, least of all formally, but I do find the teachings quite profound although I have my doubts. Especially with regard to reincarnation.

The 5th precept prohibits taking mind-altering drugs so the fact that we're having this discussion on Buddhism on this forum is fairly ironic, isn't it? I'm not sure what to make of that either: clearly getting wasted for its own sake is bad as is getting addicted but if these substances are taken for constructive purposes I don't really see the problem.

I've always been rather critical and inquisitive, perhaps too much for my own good. People who do not question everything seem to have a much better time than me. On the whole at least.

Thanks for your thoughts. Peace to you as well.

 

[Harry Haller]

Be wary of the come down, you may feel even worse a few days after and crave the experience again, which can lead onto an addiction plus exacerbate your suicide ideation. I don't think it's a good idea in all honesty for you to go ahead at present, please be careful, especially taking it recreationally. Consider seeking emotional, spiritual and psychological support. It is not a quick fix for all problems. I understand where you are coming from because I've had a couple of suicide attempts in my past.

I used to do mollie with friends camping out in nature, now I've been doing solo therapy sessions with mollie once every few months, with the intention of healing past wounds, exploring my past traumas and pain as a child and teenager, writing in a journal, meditating in nature which has helped me a lot to go deep and understand what has been blocking me and is at the core of my pain. I recommend doing more research and reading books like "Trust Surrender Receive: How MDMA Can Release Us From Trauma and PTSD" and when you feel more ready and gained some previous experience, read "MDMA Solo". Cultivating discipline (i.e. not abusing it) and respect for the substance is essential.

Good luck on your healing journey.

That is indeed a cause for concern. My main concern however is that I don't really have a good companion to share this with: my brother's a good guy but he's got his own problems (he has bipolar disorder and just a few days ago sent me texts about wanting to end it all, which he has tried last year) and I don't now if I'm comfortable with sharing these highly personal issues with him nor that it wouldn't be harmful to him so I'm thinking it might be better to postpone it or try it by myself.

Thanks for the suggestions: I'll be sure to check them out.

I've tried coke, mushrooms once and used to drink frequently but I've never gotten in trouble. I doubt I have an addictive personality (if I had I'd probably ended up a drunk like my mother) but you never know.