Question about "Your first cycle"

[polaroid]

Why is it necessary to use Tamoxifen for four weeks as PCT if I already eat 0.25 - 0.5 mg Anastrozol eod? Would Clomid alone not be enough for PCT?

 

[Genetic Freak]

Why is it necessary to use Tamoxifen for four weeks as PCT if I already eat 0.25 - 0.5 mg Anastrozol eod? Would Clomid alone not be enough for PCT?

Clomid therapy is the primary treatment for secondary hypogonadism..
As you approach the start of PCT, as your exogenous testosterone dissipates you introduce an Aromatase Inhibitor. You do this to reduce the amount of estrogen conversion that takes place.

Your exogenous testosterone will drop to nothing and you will not be producing testosterone as you start PCT. So you want to make sure that you have reduced estrogen as well.

This is just going into PCT. You want to create a situation where both estrogen and testosterone will rise together. So the AI of your choice should be used in the last 2 weeks of the cycle and immediately discontinued at the start of PCT.

The choice of SERM and duration may vary but PCT should always start with Clomid. You do not need a huge dose in the first few days.

Here is what I do:
I start with Clomid for three weeks and reduce the dosage and overlap it with Nolva in week four, dose Nolva for 3 weeks thereafter.

After 7 weeks in the last day of Nolva introduce an AI and run that by itself for three or four days.

Then, stay off and learn to be natural again for another 6 months or more.

 

[Mrchowdhury]

Hi
I was hoping someone can evaluate my proposed cycle?


Test Prop and Dbol
• Week 1-8 Test 200mg/3xw
• Week 1-4 Dbol 50mg/d
Anti Estrogen
• Week 1-8 Aromasin 12.5mg/day
PCT
• Week 9-12 Novadex 20mg/day
• Week 9-12 Clomid 100/100/50/50
And
• Hcg 250iu/3xw Weeks 1-8
Is it alright or should I tweak it a bit? I cant do the cycle since I need the cycle as well as pct to finish in 12 weeks. Maybe 13 max.

 

[polaroid]

Clomid therapy is the primary treatment for secondary hypogonadism..
As you approach the start of PCT, as your exogenous testosterone dissipates you introduce an Aromatase Inhibitor. You do this to reduce the amount of estrogen conversion that takes place.

Your exogenous testosterone will drop to nothing and you will not be producing testosterone as you start PCT. So you want to make sure that you have reduced estrogen as well.

This is just going into PCT. You want to create a situation where both estrogen and testosterone will rise together. So the AI of your choice should be used in the last 2 weeks of the cycle and immediately discontinued at the start of PCT.

The choice of SERM and duration may vary but PCT should always start with Clomid. You do not need a huge dose in the first few days.

Here is what I do:
I start with Clomid for three weeks and reduce the dosage and overlap it with Nolva in week four, dose Nolva for 3 weeks thereafter.

After 7 weeks in the last day of Nolva introduce an AI and run that by itself for three or four days.

Then, stay off and learn to be natural again for another 6 months or more.

Thank you very much for your very informative post!

What kind of AI is the best in your opinion? Price doesn't matter, I just want the best.

Or should I just end the PCT with Anastrozol/Arimidex although I take it already eod in small dosage?

Also, do you use HCG? If so, when exactly? And for how long? I could google, but you're a mod here for a reason I guess, so I rather trust on your opinion.

 

[Genetic Freak]

Thank you very much for your very informative post!

What kind of AI is the best in your opinion? Price doesn't matter, I just want the best.

Or should I just end the PCT with Anastrozol/Arimidex although I take it already eod in small dosage?

Also, do you use HCG? If so, when exactly? And for how long? I could google, but you're a mod here for a reason I guess, so I rather trust on your opinion.

Aromasin is probably better than Adex, but I wouldn't worry about it..

I have strong opinions on hCG's suppressive/downregulatory effects on GnRH. its best off used in a long cycle if that is your thing.. For PCT: No..!!

 

[showerny]

Clomid therapy is the primary treatment for secondary hypogonadism..
As you approach the start of PCT, as your exogenous testosterone dissipates you introduce an Aromatase Inhibitor. You do this to reduce the amount of estrogen conversion that takes place.

Your exogenous testosterone will drop to nothing and you will not be producing testosterone as you start PCT. So you want to make sure that you have reduced estrogen as well.

This is just going into PCT. You want to create a situation where both estrogen and testosterone will rise together. So the AI of your choice should be used in the last 2 weeks of the cycle and immediately discontinued at the start of PCT.

The choice of SERM and duration may vary but PCT should always start with Clomid. You do not need a huge dose in the first few days.

Here is what I do:
I start with Clomid for three weeks and reduce the dosage and overlap it with Nolva in week four, dose Nolva for 3 weeks thereafter.

After 7 weeks in the last day of Nolva introduce an AI and run that by itself for three or four days.

Then, stay off and learn to be natural again for another 6 months or more.

hi bro, wanted to clarify some doubts with you. For clomid and nolva that you said you would run, the dosages you would keep it constant at 50mg for clomid and 20 mg for nolva...?? Or would you change up the dosages as the weeks changed...??

and for the introduction of AI, would it be better to introduce it as opposed to just end off with Nolva..?? And what AI would you recommend in your opinion...??

Thanks for the guideline...

 

[Genetic Freak]

hi bro, wanted to clarify some doubts with you. For clomid and nolva that you said you would run, the dosages you would keep it constant at 50mg for clomid and 20 mg for nolva...?? Or would you change up the dosages as the weeks changed...??

and for the introduction of AI, would it be better to introduce it as opposed to just end off with Nolva..?? And what AI would you recommend in your opinion...??

Thanks for the guideline...

You could lower the clomid to 25mg and the nolvadex to 10mg in the last week or so...

The reason an AI is introduced towards the end of the nolvadex, is: natural testosterone should be starting to increase, as this happens E2 will increase also via aromatization, you introduce an AI for a short while just to reduce the E2 (not knock out completely)... You need E2..!!
Nolvadex blocks the estrogen in your body binding the estrogen receptor, once the nolvadex is removed there will be significant estrogen wanting to bind receptor which could trigger a harsh estrogenic response, an AI will keep this in check by lowering estrogen levels..... (but I stress, lower, don't use an AI excessively, you need some estrogen for healthy bodily function)..

AI = arimidex 0.5mg EOD, or aromasin 12.5mg twice a week (with a fat source), either/or..... don't go mad with the AI....

 

[showerny]

You could lower the clomid to 25mg and the nolvadex to 10mg in the last week or so...

The reason an AI is introduced towards the end of the nolvadex, is: natural testosterone should be starting to increase, as this happens E2 will increase also via aromatization, you introduce an AI for a short while just to reduce the E2 (not knock out completely)... You need E2..!!
Nolvadex blocks the estrogen in your body binding the estrogen receptor, once the nolvadex is removed there will be significant estrogen wanting to bind receptor which could trigger a harsh estrogenic response, an AI will keep this in check by lowering estrogen levels..... (but I stress, lower, don't use an AI excessively, you need some estrogen for healthy bodily function)..

AI = arimidex 0.5mg EOD, or aromasin 12.5mg twice a week (with a fat source), either/or..... don't go mad with the AI....

Thanks for the reply. Really learned a lot from you...

so just a summary of the PCT program would be

week 1-3 : Week 1 clomid 50mg per day - Clomid 25mg per day
week 4 : clomid 25mg + nolva 20mg per day
week 5-7 : nolva 10 mg per day
follow by using an AI for EOD for last 3-4 days of nolva...??

is that what you meant...?? Do correct me if I'm wrong as I'm still learning... Thats about right now..!!