Possibility of addiction to a placebo effect

[Streetcow]

I was contemplating drug addiction earlier when a thought popped into my head

is it possible to become addicted to a placebo effect??? (physically or mentally)

i mean iv heard amazing stores of placebo is this physically possible though to become addicted to plecebo

I was just wondering this anyway

-streetcow

 

[SKL]

Yes to probably.

An interesting related anecdote: apparently, many methadone patients can be tapered to no methadone without their knowledge, but still taking identical appearing/tasting liquid solution every day, and be OK, but go into withdrawal if they miss a dose, or, more interestingly (and cruelly), if they are told suddenly that they are not, in fact, taking methadone.

 

[aced126]

Yes to probably.

An interesting related anecdote: apparently, many methadone patients can be tapered to no methadone without their knowledge, but still taking identical appearing/tasting liquid solution every day, and be OK, but go into withdrawal if they miss a dose, or, more interestingly (and cruelly), if they are told suddenly that they are not, in fact, taking methadone.

I find this hard to believe, especially considering that withdrawal is a physical phenomenon.

 

[SKL]

Now you'll have to make me find the source (trust me, there is one, but it's far too long past my bedtime), but it's no less believable, really, than the well-documented fact that addicts are more likely to overdose in unfamiliar settings on i dentical doses, or the statistics regarding the surprisingly small number of soldiers who regularly used heroin in Vietnam who returned to civilian life as addicts.

 

[bingey]

I think skll is right a more common phenomenon with IV opiate use is that exactly the same dose constitutes an overdose when administered in a different setting

The endorphin system is very powerful and can apparently be conditioned.

 

[Streetcow]

My thoughts on it would be would mental addiction be a high possiblilty???

in terms of physical I'm open to source links being shown I just thought this would be an interesting idea to share but if there's actual proof then I'm now very interested

-Streetcow

 

[Solipsis]

Isn't something like a needle or snorting fetish a little bit like a placebo addiction? I've felt the feeling with IMing K where I almost would've IMed saline if I wouldn't have rationally resisted it.

Pretty empty 'gesture' yet you can get conditioned to want it, clearly.

SKL said tapering methadone - it would have been hard to believe if it was cold turkey, but with tapering I guess you can physically keep up not having to withdraw psychologically. A significant part is psychological, demonstrated also by strong setting-based tolerance: people ODing if they are not taking their DOC the regular way in the regular place.

 

[SKL]

The methadone study/anecdote I cited was indeed about blind tapering, not going cold turkey.

 

[Cotcha Yankinov]

I find this hard to believe, especially considering that withdrawal is a physical phenomenon.

I think when you look at medications that can help with opiate withdrawal symptoms (Clonidine) it makes sense that stress can really set things off and reduction of stress makes things better - however I think what we might need to pre-suppose here is that the addicts had already gone through the majority of detox and were really on the tail end of their dependency.. I agree in that I don't think this sort of placebo effect would help much with full blown heroin addiction.

And I think that anything that produces a desired feeling can probably be withdrawn from if the "dose" of the desired feeling is high enough for the brain to compensate to the point where you notice a difference when you're not doing the thing that produces the desired feeling. So if some psychological thing is providing a lot of stress relief, and your brain compensates for that stress relief by turning up it's sensitivity to stress, the. you might get some rebound stress when that psychological thing stops occurring.

Hope this wasn't too messy lol

 

[Nagelfar]

Now you'll have to make me find the source (trust me, there is one, but it's far too long past my bedtime), but it's no less believable, really, than the well-documented fact that addicts are more likely to overdose in unfamiliar settings on i dentical doses, or the statistics regarding the surprisingly small number of soldiers who regularly used heroin in Vietnam who returned to civilian life as addicts.

These mechanisms I never thought related to placebo, so much as incentive salience as a real cognitive affliction of potentiation. Vasovagal reaction from phobia of having hypodermics used resulting in death is a closer peculiar form of placebo-malady IMHO for instance.