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Phenibut withdrawal/taper w fasoracetam

I have not done a taper before this one but my understanding is that when you get to lower doses you are more likely to experience symptoms. Also, if you keep your drops in a consistent increment you're dropping by a larger percentage each time. For example if you drop 300 mg from 2400 to 2100 you're dropping your dose 12.5%, but if you drop 300 mg from 600 to 300 you're dropping your dose by 50%. My understanding is that the 50% drop could be more difficult. Not sure about residual side effects. Klonopin should still work as it works on GABAa, as far as I understand.
 
Although it technically works on GABA-a, a benzodiazapine such as Klonopin will most often work quite well for phenibut (GABA-b) withdrawal. In my case, using Ativan, my withdrawals were completely eliminated. However this was after two weeks of enduring an intense withdrawal upon abrupt discontinuation. In other words, I healed somewhat via cold turkey, and then introduced a benzo when I could no longer withstand the insomnia. The next morning after a single lorazepam dose, all of my symptoms were gone and did not return.

In addition I have found, having gone through multiple phenibut withdrawals, that once the acute withdrawal symptoms clear, they do not re-emerge, unlike benzo w/d, which can disappear and reappear and is much more prolonged in general.

The PAWS is quite bad with phenibut on the other hand.
 
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Interesting. Thanks for chiming in guys. I can't touch the benzos ever again, but I'm glad you found some relief. It's been 3 weeks since I've touched Kratom and 4 1/2 weeks since I stupidly took a handful of Klonopin. My Phenibut dose is at 2400 mg. I'll drop to 2100 tomorrow. I feel pretty good. Not just "not crappy", but actually pretty good. I'm not 100% though. Sleep has been fairly plentiful for the last week, though I still wake up several times a night and I still have some light night sweats. The mornings are still a little rough but it's more than manageable. A protein shake, a cup of sleepy time tea, a fairly vigorous 2+ milke walk and a shower usually kills the majority of the morning discomfort very well. I'm able to run my business throughout the day and I go to the gym every late afternoon. As I said before, 30 minutes of vigorous cardio makes me feel great. It seems that recovery from all this horrible shit sped up very substantially once I started doing the cardio everyday. I'm still quite leary about the rest of this Phenibut taper, as I know I haven't really gotten to the tough part in lower doses yet, but I'm optimistic. I'm really hoping that with plenty of excersize, a healthy diet with very little sugar, continued use of the agmatine and other supllements, etc. that I'll get through it fairly painlessly. Others have reported a fairly easy withdrawal with this kind of taper. I'm sure there will be some insomnia and some anxiety, but hopefully it won't be too bad. And I have the fasoracetam on hand for when I make the final jump.

Also, I don't remember exactly where I read it, but I've recently read some information about fish oil that suggests it is extremely helpful in helping the brain heal. Apparently it helps with the maleability of the brain. I'll definitely continue to use it.
 
Dropped to 2100 mg Phenibut yesterday. All is well. No symptoms at all. I'll report back after my next drop in 2 days.
 
Dropped to 1800 mg Phenibut yesterday. Feel just fine today. Sleep was plentiful last night, though I had some intense dreams and I think I woke up a handful of times. Feel rested though. The dreams and waking up are not that out of the ordinary for me. Next drop is in 2 days. Will continue to update progress.

Also, a thought on this taper plan vs others I've read about. I'm taking my dose in 2 divided doses a day; one in the morning and one in the evening. I've read of others suggesting to take just 1 dose a day. I'm no pharmacologist but I think spreading it out over 2 doses would work better, considering the half life of Phenibut is only about 5 hours. Some believe the effects last longer than that, which seems to be true, but many doing a taper taking only 1 dose a day report interdose withdrawal symptoms by the time they take thier daily dose. If you were to spread it out you should experience less interdose withdrawals. You would maintain a more constant level of Phenibut in your body. After 24 hours a little less than 5 half life's have passed which is enough to bring your levels very low. 2 doses a day would keep a more constant level and give your body a cleaner transition to lower doses. Also, a 300 mg decrease once every 3-4 days would give your body more time to adjust to the decreased amount before another decrease in dose. If you do 100 every day it might not give your body enough time to adjust to the decrease before you drop again. I've been dropping 300 mg every 3-4 days in 2 divided doses a day and it seems to be working very well for me so far. But, if a different taper plan is working for you then by all means do what you've gotta do. Like I said, I'm not a Dr. Thanks to everyone who has chimed in on this thread so far. I really appreciate all your thoughts and experiences. I will continue to report my progress here in the hopes that it will maybe help someone else who is going through Phenibut dependency/withdrawals/taper. I welcome more thoughts, positive experiences, questions, or concerns. Much love to all who are struggling with substance use.
 
If you don't mind my asking, how much Kratom were you taking daily?
 
Between 15 and 30 grams. First withdrawal was after a 12 day go. Felt crappy for a day and a half. Halfway through the 2nd day it just broke and I felt a lot better within a couple hours. Cardio was extremely helpful. 2nd withdrawal was similar. I now think I was experiencing mostly benzo withdrawals this last time. First 5 days was brutal, the following 9 days were slightly better. As soon as I started taking 2 grams of agmatine a day and getting 30 minutes of vigorous cardio I made extremely fast progress. Within 2 days I felt exponentialy better. After 5 days I felt almost 100%. Not sure if it was agmatine, excersize, or just time that did the trick, but I've been through many withdrawals many times and the speed of recovery was much faster than other times I experienced benzo withdrawals from short term use. They usually drag on for a month or 6 weeks, and the progress is very slow. I probably had 2 or 3 days of Kratom withdrawals during the same time I was in the early stages of benzo withdrawal. I find Kratom withdrawal to cause me a lot of depression. Benzo withdrawal is less depression. For me it's more head fog and severe appetite problems. Can hardly eat any solid food.
 
getting your body used to two doses of something is harder, conceptually. you have to manage two doses, you have to deal with sleep or getting up without once you are used to a two dose regime. I strongly recommend with any chronic drug administration, if you can get away w/one dose daily, do it - and stick to it. when you eventually want to taper and quit it is much less of a hassle. plus, phenibut lasts for goddamn ever. I routinely wake up after taking a gram and feel it WELL into the next day.
 
Interesting viewpoint. @cdin Just curious is that your view, or do you have information to support your theory? Thanks for your input.
 
this is from a long time of using/being addicted to many substances. Any time I have tried to quit a multi-dose a day habit it has been exponentially rougher. I think a large part if it is your mind being primed by ritual etc. Kratom or opiates once a day, so much easier than 2 or more. phenibut, alcohol, cigarettes. you just get more time without a buildup of the substance in your system/a bit of time to regain homeostasis before fucking it up again. I only have 15 years of on and off again addiction to confirm this, and I strongly recommend not giving it a shot to test it out ;)
 
I'm glad you've found a method that works for you. I've n the 2 dose a day method for several weeks. Seems to be working quite well so far. I still think that keeping more of a consistent level of a substance in the body with gradual decreases would be much less difficult for the body. Phenibut may "work" for longer than the half life of 5 hours suggests, but it doesn't change the fact that after 24 hours and almost 5 full half life's have passed the levels in the body would be very low and could be part of the explanation of why people who only dose once a day during a taper get interdose withdrawals by the time they take their daily dose. So far I haven't had that problem. Think about when a person on a short acting benzo like Xanax is beginning their taper and Drs first switch them to a benzo with a longer half life such as Klonopin or Valium. Same general idea. If you were to taper off Xanax you'd have to dose multiple times a day due to the very short half life. To have the levels of a drug bouncing up and down all day long has got to be much more difficult for the body to deal with and much harder for it to heal properly. I've been through the ringer with a lot substances too, for many years. This taper is by far the easiest time I've ever had coming off a drug. I think it's all about making sure you take exactly the amount the taper requires and taking it on a regular schedule. Never take more. Thank you for your feedback. It is much appreciated. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?
 
how much phenibut are you down to?
and assuming your tapper continues as well as it has been, I would recommend posting your taper method and schedule.

There are plenty of people out there who are trying to do exactly what you are doing, maybe you could help others by letting them know what is working for you?
 
Absolutely! I've been updating this thread as I go in the hopes that someone will get a little help from my experience. I've posted my schedule and all related information, but perhaps I should provide a quick summary.

I started taking a couple grams of Phenibut a day in early December. My dose kept increasing and within a week or 10 days I was taking between 4 and 6 grams of Phenibut a day. There was a couple days when I took close to 10 grams, but that only happened twice. About 5 weeks after my first dose I decided I wanted to get off the stuff before things progressed any longer. At this time I was going through what I now believe to be both Kratom withdrawals and mild Benzo withdrawals. I felt like death for a good 12 days. I was terrified of the phenibut withdrawals at the time and I couldn't imagine trying to taper while I was feeling so terrible from the Kratom and Benzo withdrawals. So I stabilized at about 4 grams of Phenibut a day until I started feeling better. Once I started feeling better I dropped to 3 grams a day. I had some serious insomnia for about 3 days, but that couldave been from other things too. I stayed at 3 grams for 4 or 5 days. By this time the other withdrawals had improved drastically. I began doing 30 minutes of very vigorous cardio every day and taking 1 gram of agmatine before each dose of Phenibut. This whole time I've been taking my Phenibut divided into 2 doses a day. One early in the morning and the second around 6:00 PM. Once I started the cardio and agmatine I went from feeling shitty to feeling almost 100% within a mater of days. At that time I began decreasing my daily Phenibut dose by 300 mg every 3 days. When I decrease I drop my morning dose by 300 mg and then in the next drop I decrease my evening dose by 300 mg. I alternate like that so that my evening dose is never less than my morning dose. I do that to try to keep my levels a little higher at night. I figure it might help with sleep. I've been dropping my dose like that for a few weeks now and today is my first day at 1500 mg. Since I started the 300 mg drops I have had zero withdrawal symptoms. I have the fasoracetam on hand and will take that after I jump if I get withdrawal symptoms. That's pretty much it. I'll continue to keep this thread updated as the taper progresses. Thanks to all who have posted feedback and questions. I should also add that I've been taking 4000 mg of fish oil a day and 1600 mg of magnesium glycinate (the mag glycinate is less likely to cause diarrhea than some other types of magnesium). I also have a prescription for 250 mg of hydroxyzine a day and I take 10 mg of Lexapro. Lexapro has changed my life. I used to struggle with crippling anxiety. Now I have very little anxiety.
 
o yeah, i should have been more clear : if you ALREADY have a habit set at dosing twice a day, keep it there, it will be more stable. just don't add another. If you are getting by fine on once daily dosing, adding another is where I find things get hairy. my .02 never go to more than once daily dosing w/anything if you can avoid it.
 
As I stated in my last post, went down to 1500 mg 2 days ago. Slept like a baby last night. No symptoms so far. Next drop, to 1200 mg, Is tomorrow. I'll update the day after.
 
if i were you i would certainly score 10 - 20 gabapentin just to ease the first few days off. perhaps lyrica.
 
@cdin I've considered that but it's not very easy to access without a prescription. I'll just have to use the fasoracetam.
 
Dropped to 1200 mg yesterday. No symotoms. Slept very well last night. Next drop is in 2 days to 900 mg.
 
Dropped to 900 mg yesterday. Feel fine. No symptoms. Next drop is in 2 days to 600 mg. Will report back the day after.
 
Dropped to 600 mg Phenibut yesterday. Feel great today. I've got 2 more drops in this taper. I go down to 300 mg in 2 days. Stay at that dose for 3 days, then I jump! I'm very grateful it has gone so well thus far. I'm a bit leery of the final jump. I'd be surprised if I don't get some withdrawal symptoms there, but judging by how virtually painless this taper has been I'm hoping they are minimal. I hope others can find this thread helpful. I'll keep updating until I'm a few days off, at least.
 
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