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Pain Management in Australia

SKR

Bluelighter
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Jan 6, 2013
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First of all - Hello Bluelight! This may in fact be my first post, I'm not entirely sure as I've lurked on this site for over a decade and only recently registered.
I have some questions and hope to gather some information to help my situation.

Does anyone here have experience with pain management clinics here in Australia? Either public or private.
What sought of conditions are in the contracts or agreements between clinic and patient?

I look forward to any responses I may get, thank you Bluelight!
 
We've all lurked at some point. I have a little experience with a public one in the past, but your OP isn't much of an OP and all i can tell you is there's usually a (months) waiting list! No, I', sure there will be people here who will be able to help you, just maybe add some details.
 
I'm booked in for my first session at a pain clinic in early April. I haven't previously been to one, but I can certainly let you know how that visit goes.

The waiting list for the first session was about a month, and my follow up session is booked in for about a month after that.
 
Isn't much of an OP (Original Post?)? I'm probably better off UTSE on the net to see if clinics put up the sort of information I'm looking for I suppose.

So Sublimit, if you have had some experience you can probably tell me if you were required to submit blood and urine samples as part of your agreement?
What was the experience with the clinic like generally? Did you find a resolution to whatever issue you presented with?

I can't really add anymore detail as such as I am simply asking whether anyone here has or is going through the Pain management system.
 
Hi SixBuckets, Thanks for the reply - I appreciate it if you can keep me posted on your experience thank you very much.
 
^Good question. I'd presumed they would do urine tests before prescribing, but that's based on what US posters on this forum have said. I'm not actually sure if that's the norm for Australian pain management clinics.
 
I could add something here since I've gone through PM but I don't really think it's right for people to try and game the system, which I guess you are if you're worried about if they check your blood for illicits and asking here.
If you actually have an ongoing issue that is causing you pain talk to your GP and they will refer you to a clinic, make sure you have all relevant documentation like scans and radiographers reports etc.
People actually in need will most likely get medicines to help treat the pain, usually all non narcotic options will be tried first and opiates really are the last alternative. If you're bullshitting you will get ibuprofen and told to fuck off.
It's very rigorously monitored and you cannot get scripts on repeat, you have to follow up with your GP monthly and have reviews with specialists.

Again, if you're legit just go to your GP, bluelight isn't for how to source drugs, pharmaceutical or otherwise.
 
I could add something here since I've gone through PM but I don't really think it's right for people to try and game the system, which I guess you are if you're worried about if they check your blood for illicits and asking here.

What makes you think that? I mean, self-medication is a thing (and several people have already mentioned long wait times for pain management). Also a standard urinalysis will cover a lot more than recreational opiates.

I don't see the link between "will I need to avoid recreational use of illicit substance before going into pain management" and "is obviously a fakey fake faker".
If you actually have an ongoing issue that is causing you pain talk to your GP and they will refer you to a clinic, make sure you have all relevant documentation like scans and radiographers reports etc.
People actually in need will most likely get medicines to help treat the pain, usually all non narcotic options will be tried first and opiates really are the last alternative. If you're bullshitting you will get ibuprofen and told to fuck off.
It's very rigorously monitored and you cannot get scripts on repeat, you have to follow up with your GP monthly and have reviews with specialists.

Again, if you're legit just go to your GP, bluelight isn't for how to source drugs, pharmaceutical or otherwise.

I didn't read this as a sourcing thread at all. I interpreted the OP as wanting to know what to expect from PM and whether they would need to take precautions around (not necessarily related) recreational drug use.
 
Yes tests will cover more than just drugs in a persons system, however the issue is with a forum like BL outlining the systems pain management clinic use.

Plenty of recreational opiate users would ( and do) jump through the hoops to get oxy if they knew how to do it successfully, I just don't think it's in BL's interest to be part of that.

Opiate therapy until recently has been a last line treatment for pain, it's not to be taken lightly, potentially life-long dependence on opiates isn't a casual deal. For one thing opiates are contraindicated for patients with a history of or current users of recreational drugs. It can be assumed the OP by asking about contracts etc and whether he will be tested whilst on PM, means they intend on concealing their taking other drugs while on PM, which is against the prescribing guidelines.

Are you naive? there is an absolute link between someone being a drug user and faking or exaggerating a condition to get meds. I'm not saying that this is 100% the case here but to me if you are in pain serious enough to warrant opiate therapy you wouldn't be asking these types of questions.

Most opiate overdoses occur due to poly drug use and for that reason alone you shouldn't be taking or consider taking other drugs when on opiate pain management.
 
Plenty of recreational opiate users would ( and do) jump through the hoops to get oxy if they knew how to do it successfully, I just don't think it's in BL's interest to be part of that.

I don't, either. I'm just less certain than you are that that is what this thread is about. Perhaps the OP can clarify?

For one thing opiates are contraindicated for patients with a history of or current users of recreational drugs.

Which is a really good reason for recreational drug users who also have serious pain conditions to know if they're going to be drug tested, isn't it? We all know that the medical system (many branches of which fail to distinguish between "recreational drug use" and "addiction") is not necessarily a friend to drug users.

It can be assumed the OP by asking about contracts etc and whether he will be tested whilst on PM, means they intend on concealing their taking other drugs while on PM, which is against the prescribing guidelines.

I think there's room for a discussion about that that doesn't presume the OP does not need pain medication, or is exploiting the pain management system. I think there are very sensible reasons to conceal your recreational drug use while being treated for pain conditions (or many other things!).

Are you naive? there is an absolute link between someone being a drug user and faking or exaggerating a condition to get meds. I'm not saying that this is 100% the case here but to me if you are in pain serious enough to warrant opiate therapy you wouldn't be asking these types of questions.

That's funny, because here I am!

I've been managing my chronic pain condition for a year and a half and have recently sat out the waiting list for pain management. Chronic disabling pain has made me quit a lot of my hobbies, but surprisingly not the ones that make me feel better.

I don't disagree that some drug users fake conditions/severity of conditions to get medication, but I would say it's a pretty small Venn overlap. There are masses of drug users who have never even tried prescription opiates - including drug users whose DOC isn't in the opiate family - and that's not even mentioning the people whose induction into drug use starts with prescription opiates. Stating that anyone who uses or has used any recreational drug is likely to be faking their pain condition is not just anti-user prejudice, it's the kind of thing that leads medical staff to refuse medical treatment to declared drug users. And that has actually killed people.

Most opiate overdoses occur due to poly drug use and for that reason alone you shouldn't be taking or consider taking other drugs when on opiate pain management.

No, you shouldn't be taking or consider taking other CNS depressant drugs while on opiate pain management. The OP hasn't disclosed what substances they're worried will come up in their urinalysis. If they are prescribed opiates, they should certainly avoid other opiates/benzos/alcohol, but there's no reason to avoid, say, marijuana.
 
People actually in need will most likely get medicines to help treat the pain, usually all non narcotic options will be tried first and opiates really are the last alternative.

That doesn't match my experience at all. My experience was a lot of GP's telling me to take panadol and 'you're young, it'll go away, you'll be fine.'(I am, but it didn't and I wasn't). I also wasted a lot of money seeing a physiotherapist for a year, which did jack shit. When I finally managed to get a referral to a pain management specialist with a 3 month wait list (despite the fact that he managed to fit me in weekly after I'd first seen him) and an absurd fee (by which point I had started self medicating, first with OTC codeine pills, then CWE's, and over the course of two years stepped up to IV oxycodone/morphine obtained through drug contacts), I went in completely honest about my drug use, past and present, and saying that I didn't expect him to prescribe opiates given the situation (any dose he would have been willing to prescribe would have been useless with my tolerance anyway).

Despite that his first recourse was to put me on opioid maintenance, saying that suboxone would manage my pain and addiction (at that point I was a frequent user, but not a daily one for a financial reasons - roughly 2 days out of 3). I refused, as turning up to a pharmacy daily was an impossibility with my recently obtained job, but asked if he had any other suggestions. He told me to come back in a week, at which point he hooked me up to some machine which was wired to my back and supposed to interact with nerves to decrease pain somehow, with no results. When I went back to tell him the machine hadn't worked, I asked if he'd be willing to try pregabalin (which he had to look up). He wrote me a script, then, after asking me to pull my sleeves up so he could see my track marks (when I'd just told him how much I'd been injecting recently), tried to push me onto suboxone again.

I told him again that I wasn't willing to give up being gainfully employed for the first time in a year, but suggested that a decent compromise would be the buprenorphine patches, as they would both prevent the use of other opiates, reduce the pain (he was very confident in the analgesic potential of bupe - overconfident, as it turned out) and allow me to turn up to work. He turned me down by saying the dose would be too low, which seemed reasonable, but then launched into a lecture about how he couldn't treat me unless I "submitted to the suboxone management," (how, I don't know, since he didn't seem to have any idea of how to treat pain other than prescribe opioids), closing with a reminder to make sure I paid my fee on the way out.

He then went and wrote a letter to my referring doctor saying that I had "attempted to bargain for drugs" and "exhibited drug seeking behavior" (by asking for a lower dose of the exact medication he wanted to give me!) and again that the only way he could treat me further was if I would "submit" to the suboxone program. At no point in this process did he actually show any interest or offer any insight regarding the cause of the pain.

So in short I waited 2 years and saw at least 4 different GP's to get a referral, waited 3 months, spent over a thousand dollars on someone who obviously had no idea how to treat pain other than with opioids, treated me like scum because in 2 years of severe pain I'd turned to self medication to allow me to work and sleep (which yes, eventually did turn into a psychological addiction to the euphoric effects as well - opiates feel awesome - but even when I had no opiates I trashed my stomach lining with paracetemol and ibuprofen, not to mention the other assorted "treatments" I tried, and I would never have touched codeine, let alone harder opiates, in the first place if I hadn't started buying them for my back), accused me of drug seeking when I asked for a slightly different formulation of the same drug he first suggested so I could retain my job.

The sick irony of it all is if it had been a woman in her 40's in the exact same situation, she would have been diagnosed with fibromyalgia or somesuch on the first GP appointment, given a script for endone and a referral to pain management and ended up being prescribed increasingly high doses of strong opiates by the PM doctor until her opioid habit exceeded the one I obtained self medicating. I've seen it happen. But if you're young and male, 99% of doctors won't give you more than a box or two of panadeine forte for anything less than a bone poking out of your skin or a vertebra crushed to powder.

In the end I lost the job anyway because of the situation (fair enough, I was either high, sick or in pain - not a good worker), tried suboxone as a last resort (my saint of a shrink went through the qualification process herself when I couldn't find anyone willing to prescribe it), and with a copious intake of paracetemol and ibuprofen I managed to keep the pain in control enough to function, but it wasn't until I gave up on the medical establishment entirely and took up meditation, followed by chi kung and then tai chi (with acupuncture treatments from my tai chi teacher) that the pain actually reduced significantly (some days it's not there at all, for the first time in half a decade, other days I need to pop a few panadol or nurofen, but compared to where I was back in 2010/2011 it's night and day).

I have no idea why the "alternative" treatments (although they actually have some strong scientific backing, which I only found out when I was able to overcome my inherent skepticism) I took up in desperation when all the mainstream options had failed me actually managed to help more than all the doctors and pills and physiotherapy and nerve stimulation combined, but it did.

Anyway, I know that's just one person's experience, maybe I just happened across the half dozen shittiest doctors (and single best psychiatrist) in the city by some really fucked up turn of chance. I don't know, but I think it's unlikely, especially from what I've heard from other people.
 
The sick irony of it all is if it had been a woman in her 40's in the exact same situation, she would have been diagnosed with fibromyalgia or somesuch on the first GP appointment, given a script for endone and a referral to pain management and ended up being prescribed increasingly high doses of strong opiates by the PM doctor until her opioid habit exceeded the one I obtained self medicating. I've seen it happen. But if you're young and male, 99% of doctors won't give you more than a box or two of panadeine forte for anything less than a bone poking out of your skin or a vertebra crushed to powder.

I'm not disagreeing with your general narrative of how bullshit the system is (and your story aligns with that of a few people I know who have disclosed self-medication while seeking treatment for chronic pain) but this bit doesn't match up with my experience. It took me 1.5 years to get a fibromyalgia diagnosis, following testing for a textbook-filling range of other conditions and finally a referral to a rheumatologist. I haven't been prescribed anything for the pain so far (opiate or otherwise) and, as mentioned above, I've sat out a waiting list for pain management that's taken over a month (with zero pharmacological pain relief).

I'm younger than the usual age window that people develop fibro in, but not by a shocking amount.
 
Hey thanks for the benefit of the doubt Six Buckets I appreciate it mate. No I'm not trying to scam for drugs even though I'm sure plenty try. I am already prescribed Oxycodone MR and Endone IR for breakthrough. I am prescribed Lyrica (Pregabalin) also.

Frankly I fucking hate my life right now. I was completely sober for 9 years from all drugs and alcohol and was really damn proud of that fact. I put up with this nerve issue which appears to originate from my thoracic spine for 18months before I finally sought treatment from my GP. After being hospitalised with idiopathic Pancreatitis which resulted in the loss of my gall bladder and then being diagnosed with Monoclonal Gammopathy of unknown significance (MGUS) I just couldn't take this back/rib pain anymore. It was affecting me psychologically - For the first time in my life I was suffering anxiety and considering suicide. I fucking folded man - without the meds I now get I was going to give up. If it wasn't for my beautiful wife and child I would have jumped for sure. I have a great life but the pain was/is killing me.

I've just shelled out another $700 ($200 out of pocket) for another nerve block injection which I am hopeful and doubtful will help. After the result of this round of injections I am going to be referred into Pain Management. I am simply curious as to what to expect. I may already be on the meds they will try on me. I get the impression that my GP would rather not be the one to keep prescribing me these drugs which are cheaper than the GP visit. Thanks for any information you guys share here, I appreciate it.
 
Hey thanks for the benefit of the doubt Six Buckets I appreciate it mate. No I'm not trying to scam for drugs even though I'm sure plenty try. I am already prescribed Oxycodone MR and Endone IR for breakthrough. I am prescribed Lyrica (Pregabalin) also.

Frankly I fucking hate my life right now. I was completely sober for 9 years from all drugs and alcohol and was really damn proud of that fact. I put up with this nerve issue which appears to originate from my thoracic spine for 18months before I finally sought treatment from my GP. After being hospitalised with idiopathic Pancreatitis which resulted in the loss of my gall bladder and then being diagnosed with Monoclonal Gammopathy of unknown significance (MGUS) I just couldn't take this back/rib pain anymore. It was affecting me psychologically - For the first time in my life I was suffering anxiety and considering suicide. I fucking folded man - without the meds I now get I was going to give up. If it wasn't for my beautiful wife and child I would have jumped for sure. I have a great life but the pain was/is killing me.

I've just shelled out another $700 ($200 out of pocket) for another nerve block injection which I am hopeful and doubtful will help. After the result of this round of injections I am going to be referred into Pain Management. I am simply curious as to what to expect. I may already be on the meds they will try on me. I get the impression that my GP would rather not be the one to keep prescribing me these drugs which are cheaper than the GP visit. Thanks for any information you guys share here, I appreciate it.

No worries.

As I said before, I haven't had my appointment/s yet, but I've been told the intake includes an appointment with a psychologist. I only have my own theories as to what that will entail, though.
 
I think there's room for a discussion about that that doesn't presume the OP does not need pain medication, or is exploiting the pain management system. I think there are very sensible reasons to conceal your recreational drug use while being treated for pain conditions (or many other things!).

Stating that anyone who uses or has used any recreational drug is likely to be faking their pain condition is not just anti-user prejudice, it's the kind of thing that leads medical staff to refuse medical treatment to declared drug users. And that has actually killed people.

You are coming from the angle of not being on opiates twice daily for years and I am, which is a very different reality. A person who wouldn't simply forgo illicit drug use leading up to their appointment or during their treatment should think very carefully before they begin opiate pain management. Dependence is no joke and I can honestly say although I'm in less pain my life in general is worse and many other long-term users of pain meds could back up my statement.

I didn't say for certain that OP is faking or abusing the system and I def didn't say anyone who uses drugs is likely faking , I did say someone who uses drugs is more likely than a non user to fake a condition to get them which is obvious.

I'm not anti-user , I'm 100% behind legalisation, injecting rooms and opiate maintenance. In fact I would be happy for addicts to receive heroin especially if it meant as a pain patient I didn't have to get the third degree constantly due to the number of people misusing and fraudulently obtaining prescription opiates.
 
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thanks for sharing crankinit, nice to read your journey with pain and its solution, i'm looking to study tai chi or chi kung, but i have doubts it is taught in SA other than by teachers who do it as a physical exercise for relaxation rather than the deeper energetic level that i'm interested in.
 
You are coming from the angle of not being on opiates twice daily for years and I am, which is a very different reality.

That's true, I'm not, but with all due respect to that experience, you have no idea what angle or reality I am coming from, because I haven't told you. I'm not a recreational or dependent opiate user, but there's a whole world of experiences outside of that that would give a relevant perspective.

A person who wouldn't simply forgo illicit drug use leading up to their appointment or during their treatment should think very carefully before they begin opiate pain management.

I think that's kind of what the OP was asking, though? As in, "is (forgoing illicit drug use leading up to my appointment) something I need to do because of drug testing?"

Dependence is no joke and I can honestly say although I'm in less pain my life in general is worse and many other long-term users of pain meds could back up my statement.

I don't think dependence is a joke, either, and it's definitely worth warning people about. The experience of people already in the system is really valuable to newbies (which I think may have been part of the reason the OP started this thread).

I didn't say for certain that OP is faking or abusing the system and I def didn't say anyone who uses drugs is likely faking , I did say someone who uses drugs is more likely than a non user to fake a condition to get them which is obvious.

Idk... you've been registered on this forum for longer than I have, so surely you've seen all the posts by once-opiate naive people on Other Drugs, Mental Health and The Dark Side talking about how a short-term prescription for opiates started them on their drug use career.

I feel like "person who uses drugs" is such a wide and diverse category that you can make any kind of vague statement (like "is more likely to try and get drugs for recreational purposes") and have it be technically true, but not actually tell you anything about the people you're talking about. Sure, "people who use drugs" might be more likely to try and get pain relief they don't need, but who does that mean? Pot smokers who've never tried opiates? People who take amphetamines on the weekend? Or are you throwing all people who use drugs out in the "dependent opiate user" bathwater?

I'm not anti-user , I'm 100% behind legalisation, injecting rooms and opiate maintenance. In fact I would be happy for addicts to receive heroin especially if it meant as a pain patient I didn't have to get the third degree constantly due to the number of people misusing and fraudulently obtaining prescription opiates.

I know what you mean. It's unfortunate that people exploiting the system make it harder for those of us who use it legitimately to get treatment.
 
I could add something here since I've gone through PM

Hi ODB, So are you prepared to add your experience with the PM system here? I'm not sure if the system varies from state to state but if it does it may not vary by much. As my original post states I would like to know more and I am sure others would also. Seems to be info on the US system but very little with regards to Australia.

Like I have said, I am already prescribed strong medication for my pain - they are likely to be the medications a PM doctor may explore but this also may not be the case. I can only assume, as I am ignorant of the PM system, that a range of services will be made available to me such as Physiotherapy, sports massage, acupuncture, epidurals the list goes on.

And for Harm reduction I'll add this - I was ever so thankful to have been offered prescriptions for the medications I am taking for my pain simply because I was finding life unbearable due to the pain. But I have fucked myself up with these bloody drugs too - I now have an opiate addiction which I have never before experienced and regret. Perhaps I could have stuck it out a little longer before I found an alternative (Which I'm yet to find). Addiction to drugs is no joke - been there before (Was a major dealer and Junkie through the late 90's - '05 but never opiates) I know the score, and I knew it to be doubly bad to actually physically need the drugs (Opiates). I overcame my warp speed, high risk lifestyle only to get addicted to pills some 10 years later - FUCK!

Oh and It looks like my thread precipitated some debate - on that I'll say this.....There are none more judgemental about other users than users themselves. You have to have a sense of humour about such things.
 
In most pain cases for long term opiates to be RXd you have to see a PM first, since you're already on opiates for pain I don't know what else a PM can do for you besides recommend some Physio, hydrotherapy etc. maybe surgical intervention or spinal injections and adjuvant medications. Some people get taken off meds, others get dosage reviews. Mine had never even heard of DHC so you probably will already know more about what works for your pain than they will.

They will likely put together a medication plan to follow which will be sent to your doc and then you'll get a permit for your scheduled meds if you don't already have one. At this point you will follow up with your GP and then have to visit every month to follow up on your conidition and to receive your meds.

I wasn't put through too many hoops in this particular case since I had already been through PM clinics in the past and trialled all the non narcotics and other BS therapies over the years before I decided to go on regular medication. I had a pretty bad injury with scans to back up the validity of my condition. so no psychologists or drug tests in my case although if you have a history of drug use or a vague condition like fibromyalgia this might be a condition.

It's a catch 22 but I can honestly say it's better to have the pain than be chained to opiates indefinitely.
 
I wasn't put through too many hoops in this particular case since I had already been through PM clinics in the past and trialled all the non narcotics and other BS therapies over the years before I decided to go on regular medication. I had a pretty bad injury with scans to back up the validity of my condition. so no psychologists or drug tests in my case although if you have a history of drug use or a vague condition like fibromyalgia this might be a condition.

The appointment with the psychologist is a requirement for everyone who goes through the pain management clinic I've been referred to. I'll post after the appointment and let you all know why it was included.
 
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