Opioids Opioid Withdrawal - supplements for symptoms

[svacheme3]

I know loperamide induced cardiotoxicity is the hot topic now, but an actual examination of the literature suggests this is a consequence of extreme dosing. Like 400mg a day for weeks. Its not a concern for the 100mg or less a day for only a few days that completely blocks withdrawal for most levels of addiction.

 

[tacodude]

Just because it doesn't cause lethal heart problems immediately except in the case of someone with underlying heart issues balready. Also a horrid idea for someone on methadone as it already prolongs qt interval itself. There are just tons of better options. Just use lope to stop the runs at recommended doses.... Seriously imagine if it ends up behind the counter. Having to go through a background check essentially while half shitting your pants all because the gener population is developing heart problems and they decide to blame the lope, lock it up, save the children, and g-d save the Queen

 

[svacheme3]

That's no excuse for propagating misleading information. There's simply no evidence to suggest there's any danger more significant than other opiates at anything short of long-term abuse at several hundred mg/day or short term at 800+mg. It would really suck if it got moved to behind the counter but that's going to happen FASTER if you get people thinking far lower doses are also cardiotoxic. Nobody is going to move towards more restrictions because "well, yeah, if you swallow 200-400 at once it hurts your heart". 20-40 being cardiotoxic? Goodbye to the only OTC drug that actually stops almost all w/d. So think twice if spreading that lie is the hill to die on.
And there really aren't better options that aren't just other opiates too.

 

[tacodude]

No one ever said low dose is cardiotoxic, but obviously it has effect on the heart. It's always beg accepted long term high doses have led to heart problems at doses that could be in double digits. It's not misunderstanding it that will lead to it regulated, but it getting misused. You want it for ORT well that's fine and candy just tell your doctor to do tests line EKGs and stuff to watch for signs of deterioration, but at that point you might as well get on methadone. Suggesting lope for anything it's not sold for such a ORT instead of an anti poop medication or drug regulators will use it as an excuse to put more regulation in our so it becomes more expensive to make available. You really need to accept that live just isn't as vague and logical than that in fact it is quite illogical where the mean on negative infinity to infinity isn't 0, which is the median, but pi if I'm not mistaken yet that is not commonly accepted although it's more a math joke although I guess it's not funny because I have to explain it, but it's more to reiterate what I'm saying logic isn't logical.

Anyways I'd love to continue rambling this random conversation, but I will have to go. I'll conclude again lope has effect on the heart to be aware about in high doses recently has been becoming a big issue with causing heat problems due to cardiotoxity in subjective amount for everyone and for certain times because everyone's different. One may be OK and one may not be able to even take a 2 mg dose.

 

[ABetterWay]

I personally find benadryl and I assume anti histamine causes chills and those weird temperature, goosebumps, and general skin crawling feeling.... I mean opiates cause histamine release so when you stop your already losing histamine activity, but to add an anti histamine on top... I mean it doesn't take a genius to see 1+2=3

You know, not ONCE on any opiate, opioid, including heroin have I itched lol. I do have done strange heath issues and I also never throw up in withdrawal, I hardly throw up period even when very nauseated. Antihistamines help me personally but others say not so much. I guess we are all different biochemically. It's hard to say what will help someone unless they try out, aside from the clear things like lope for the liquid guts lol.

I'm with you on the heart thing with lope too.PPeople without experience or knowledge, and/or who have underlying conditions they may not be aware of even, may take some, feel better, then take a bunch more without researching and bam . While in withdrawal, most will do anything to make it stop, and especially to the young and/or inexperienced, they may think there'snothingto too m of a good thing if out stops symptoms. FFecal impaction is another danger.

I've had times where I could still go with moderate lope doses, others where I couldn't on small doses . I have digestive issues, but I'm aware of them. Some people aren't. Better safe than sorry .

If I'm recalling correctly lope blocks sodium channels, perhaps why it makes me pee constantly (tho I also have bladder issues lol). So therefore that could also be a problem for some underlying conditions or interact with other meds

I'm also a huge fan of using at least a drug interaction checker for whatever arsenal of withdrawal, aids you decide to use.

 

[Nether Animal]

The problem with antihistamines is that they'll most likely increase RLS

This. There have been many instances where i was rattling and took some promethazine or benadryl and it made everything unbearable. Like I almost cracked and went screaming down the street at 4am I was so restless.

Huge risk taking some of those IMO. And whoever keeps mentioning clonodine.... its a godsend for certain symptoms but I've noticed that doctors aren't very keen on prescribing it even in low doses. They always give me valium or another low dose benzo instead.

 

[KraziKat]

Is Kratom considered a supplement to help withdrawal, or is its use during WDs simply equals still using?
I'm 11 days from my last pill, had only 2 sub strips to work with. I'm on 1 mg now every other day, but using kratom on the days between. Am I being stupid for using the kratom? (I had about a 150-200 mg roxy habit for a couple years)

 

[svacheme3]

Still using, as it helps because it directly binds to opioid receptors. It's weaker though so it's a better taper than whatever its replacing tho.

 

[KraziKat]

Rinse and repeat no more

Still using, as it helps because it directly binds to opioid receptors. It's weaker though so it's a better taper than whatever its replacing tho.

Thanks for the feedback. I can sustain on sub every other day, but without the kratom boost on the off days I don't feel quite well. Methinks I should save the kratom until all my subs are gone and only use as needed post-sub. I'lll have been on sub maintenance for less than 3 weeks. I do NOT want to get more subs, nor do I want to inherit a kratom addiction once again. Viscious cycle. Pills. WD. Subs. Kratom. Rinse and Repeat

Today I took .5 sub. I'm thinking if I can feel okay after tapering down to .5 and then maybe a day or two of .25... I jump and just white knuckle any discomfort I have. I have two kilos of kratom which I'll flush or give away. Maybe.

 

[keeping]

Today I took .5 sub. I'm thinking if I can feel okay after tapering down to .5 and then maybe a day or two of .25... I jump and just white knuckle any discomfort I have. I have two kilos of kratom which I'll flush or give away. Maybe.

do it man, this is the perfect time to get off subs.
you haven't been on subs long enough for the withdrawals to be anything more than uncomfortable and annoying.
yeah half your dose, stabilize, half that , rinse and repeat
stock up o comfort meds; immodium (careful with that one - lope is an opiate), ibuprofen, buscopan, diazepam or z-drugs like ambien (but only if you can trust yourself with them), weed if you smoke, videogames/movies

you can go it (y)

 

[KraziKat]

Thank you. I need some help right now. I hate the sub, and the more I read about and the shittier I feel, I'm almost inclined to go back to my DOC, roxies, to get off the sub. It's been 3 weeks of subs, and I have like 3 .5 crumbs left....

It's stupid to use SAO to avoid sub ceasing discomfort, right?

I just feel so achey, lethargic, jittery and anxious. Want my life back so bad.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

Do you have a hard time quitting kratom? Maybe you can use it strictly for smoothing out your jump off the subs.

 

[KraziKat]

So would you say that kratom is better than subs when it comes to finally stopping everything?

 

[Slow_Mobius]

Ive never been through sub WD, but i find kratom WD to be relatively manageable and I know that many others have successfully used kratom to quit subs. If your goal is to be clean of everything, you'll still need to be disciplined enough to taper off the kratom, but it might be easier for you to taper down on the subs, switch to kratom, taper the kratom, and then jump off.

Jumping off subs too early is a recipe for relapse and furthering that brutal cycle you were taking about.

 

[Gambler]

Ibuprofen , Imodium , benadryl for sleep , if you can get some muscle relaxers that helps , if you are not scared of trading one drug for another Foclin will increase your dopamine ( danger is abuse ).best if luck . I stopped Aug .1 2014 . Methadone and suboxone are much harder to stop IMO than fast acting opiates.

 

[Gambler]

Opiate addiction my experience .

My experience when I was on 240+ mg oxy a day I could get 60 norco 10s take 24 1st day then 12 then 8 , 5 , 3 , 3 , 2, 1 ,1/2 , 1/2 ,1/4---x4 days , and I would be fine , but methadone & then Suboxone were hell for me .

 

[Coolwhip]

KRATOM, if you need it in a hurry you can get it at a headshop, otherwise order it on the internet, much cheaper, if you are trying to quit just take it for 3-5 days, and benzos/somas for sleep, but don't combine them and don't take them for more than 2 weeks....then methacodones list is pretty much the gold standard(plus DXM and melatonin)...its nice to try to stay healthy with vitamins and supplements and such and will help with PAWS but won't do shit for acute WD, but 5-HTP, tryptophan, Mucuna Pruriens/tyrosine, and DLPA are fucking worthless.

I recently quit suboxone by taking kratom for 2 weeks, then akumma seed extract for 3 days, then valium for a week(saved the valium until I was off all opiates), it was pretty much painless. And I was still on a fairly high dose of bupe when I switched to kratom(shooting 2mg 2x a day) the first few days were still pretty bad even taking 40g a day. It would have been a LOT easier if I wasn't shooting my subs or had tapered more.(although I did get it down to 2mg in the morning and 1 at night for monday-thursday, then took 2mg sublingually friday morning as my last dose) And the best way to take kratom is to parachute throughout the day(lasts longest and most effecient), but at night make a cup of tea, put it in the fridge, and have it ready to chug when you wake up in the morning because you are going to be hurting hard when you first wake up and tea hits the fastest and you won't feel like making it in the morning. I could have done this in 5-7 days, but I couldn't take off work so I started the kratom friday night, and the weekend sucked, but by monday I was able to work on kratom while I tapered, and the akumma seed extract made for a super soft landing physically, while the valium kept my head straight for that first week of no opiates at all.

 

[kingshawaiian]

Kratom seems to work wonders for the WDs.

 

[KraziKat]

While tapering down to .5 of sub I was hating the way it made me feel. I was in acute WDs every day and miserable. I decided subs are evil, and can't fathom being on them for YEARS like some people are... so I googled around and stumbled upon a site with someone suggesting using short-acting opiates to "rip the sub off the receptors" and then detox from the blues.

It made sense at the time, and I only bought 15 from the dealer, who said goodbye to forever. I texted my other source for pills as well and told him I'm out of the game. But after 3 days of using the blues and no sub, I'm regretting it. Just so confused.

Here's where I'm at: Today is Friday, I last took 1 mg sub on Sunday. I started on low dosing of blues on Tuesday, but of course ramped up to 90 mgs yesterday. Today I woke up feeling WDs, so have been on blue pieces spaced out throughout the day so far.

I have a total of 2 mg sub broken up into about .5 pieces, eyeballed. I have 4 blues left. I have a fair amount of kratom. I have MJ and booze, of course, and access to anything OTC.

I want to be free of this opiate addiction nightmare and vicsious cycle. How would you advise me going forward based on the above? Any help/advice is greatly appreciated. I'm a 41 year old father of two, btw, and I need to be present and well enough to care for them, and I need to be functional for work. I've decided I am NOT going to buy any more pills or sub strips to get through this. Or Ever again for that matter.

Thank you for reading and thank you in advance for any advice you may have!

 

[Coolwhip]

If your already down to .5 your almost there, try to get even lower with the rest of your subs and switch to kratom, do just enough to make it bearable before stopping, kratom is shorting acting so it'll work for what you are trying to do, unless you can have the self control to take really tiny amounts of oxy then I'd get rid of them now before stopping the bupe.