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opiates and cancer

i find it kind of humorous in a sad way, that nobody responded to this thread because i made the joke opiate addicts usually die before they ever develop cancer so we will never know IF long term opiate use is ever linked to cancer! :S
 
This is heavily setting off my bullshit alarm. There's no clear pharmacological reason opioids should increase the risk of cancer, you'd think if such a causal link existed it'd have been already well established.

And it stinks that they're talking about it in relation to opium. I don't suppose what the data really shows is a link between smoking opium and cancer? Cause I could believe that a lot more. Smoking anything isn't exactly good for your body.

I dunno, this just really seems dubious to me. I don't believe that if opioids as a class of drugs were carcinogens that we wouldn't have established that long ago.
 
^ as logic will presume, ALL regular opiate addicts dont live long enough to ever establish connection between regular opiate users and cancer. and that is exactly what i meant earlier in the thread
 
allone said:
^ as logic will presume, ALL regular opiate addicts dont live long enough to ever establish connection between regular opiate users and cancer. and that is exactly what i meant earlier in the thread
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Except that's, kinda nonsense. Not every opioid user dies before they're in their 60s. Lots of them live that long.

And it wouldn't be hard to establish that pancreatic cancer in that population is much higher than normal.
 
JessFR said:
Except that's, kinda nonsense. Not every opioid user dies before they're in their 60s. Lots of them live that long.

And it wouldn't be hard to establish that pancreatic cancer in that population is much higher than normal.
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so you are telling me, example being me, starting when im in my 20s abusing opiates that i actually have a chance of living to 60s to actually show if i can get cancer or not? i wont live to 60s as i am a major opiate user. FACT! I wont be able to be part of that statistic, because Ill be dead by then. Just like any major serious opiate user!!!
 
allone said:
so you are telling me, example being me, starting when im in my 20s abusing opiates that i actually have a chance of living to 60s to actually show if i can get cancer or not? i wont live to 60s as i am a major opiate user. FACT! I wont be able to be part of that statistic, because Ill be dead by then. Just like any major serious opiate user!!!
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Lol, yea no.

There are LOTS of men and women who are in their 60s now who either abused opiates throughout their 20s and 30s and then quit, or throughout their 20s and 30s and then got on methadone, or less frequently have used from then until now.

I've seen lots of older methadone users at clinics who have been on opioids most of their life. If they had far higher pancreatic cancer risk we would be able to establish it.

And this isn't even getting into correlation not being causation. A fuck ton of opiate addicts are also smokers, it's a strong correlation, and smoking causes cancer.

That doesn't mean opioids cause cancer.

I don't believe they do. Neither do it believe 100% of heavy opioid users in their 20s and 30s are dead before they reach 60, that's absurd and easily disproven.
 
I was late to the heroin game. I didn't start using until I was 35. IV first time out. Fast forward 20 years and I am still alive and using every day. Did a two year bid in

prison, but other than that I have used continuously. I guess I am what you would consider a high functioning addict. Completed college, always had a job...until COVID

anyway. But the way in which I use my drug may be different than you. I don't use heroin to spend the day on the nod. I use heroin so I can wake up each day, climb out

of bed and get shit done. I am extremely lucky I have never had an overdose situation and I lately, have been using Fent test strips. I am assuming all of the dope I do has

some analogue and its true. Every strip has come up positive. So, I am all about harm reduction for ME. And this may sound like just another excuse to use (as if I need one),

but I believe its been the best antidepressant without taking away all of my emotions. So, Allone, it is very possible to live into the golden years with a habit. Are you familiar

with William Burroughs? I've also got two dealers that I've developed long-term drug relationships with, that are older than myself and started in their 20's and 30's. Its

entirely possible.
 
I've seen a bunch of older people at methadone clinics. Sure they're not the most common, but they're hardly exceedingly uncommon either.

There's a lot of people who managed to get their heroin habit under control with methadone in the 80s in their 20s and have been on it 40 years into their 60s.


I fear I may wind up one of them. :( hope not.
 
There are all sorts of opiate addicts who make it to old age, it's just not all that common for IV drug users in general. Presuming that you can get a consistent supply of good quality drugs, so you know what you're taking and not accidentally ODing from stuff that has fentanyl in it or is way stronger than you're used to, opiates actually are some of the least toxic drugs there are. You aren't damaging yourself by taking, not in a toxicity sort of way anyway (unless you OD of course, but ODing is avoidable if you're not rolling the dice with sketchy supply that might be fentanyl, or super pure when you're used to stuff that's weak).

It is true that a lot of opiate addicts die young, but it's mostly due to using drugs that are contaminated or of wildly varying strength, and the issues that come with a life of crime and/or homelessness, which, sadly, a lot of addicts face (but is not the drug's fault, it's the fault of the way we have set up society to punish addicts).
 
About 5 years ago the man I got hep C from sharing a needle, died at 78. Would shoot heroin and meth together. Died from pulmonary issues, not his daily use. Used to live in San Francisco in the Hait, back in those days.
 
Well many cancer patients including some of my family swear by low dose naltrexone. One of my family members thought he was a dead man, no treatment was working.. He spent all his money expecting the worse than got on LDN. Now he’s got a monster debt he doesn’t know how to handle lol.

I’m gonna start it myself as soon as I can afford it.

I’ll tell you this, opiates definitely don’t help cancer based on my experience. My cancer started when I was at my highest Suboxone dose. And when the pain got bad and I started using benzoylmorphine the tumors grew exponentially.

-GC
 
This title jumped out to me!1 I got Head & Neck cancer 12 years ago. That was my introduction to opiates, ( due to radiation pain, and Chemo.!
so that has been my journey the last 12 years ,With chronic pain and side effects, my pain has continued as all Radiation patients will attest to.
I feel that 30+ years in 12 step program and sober from Alcohol hasprogramed my brain of the damages of addiction! I struggle with the question of Dependence vs Addiction?? I Know I am addicted to alcohol { I have all the emotional, physical, financial Scars to prove it!} Vicodin addiction?? i dont know? But I do go through withdrawals when I stop taking them :sick:
 
Dependence is very easy to determine. Stop taking it, if you feel unwell you're dependent.

Addiction is.. Subtle and complicated and hard to know if you have if you haven't had loads of experience with it. Eventually to can pick up the tells, but even then addiction can creep up on you.
 
Xorkoth said:
There are all sorts of opiate addicts who make it to old age, it's just not all that common for IV drug users in general. Presuming that you can get a consistent supply of good quality drugs, so you know what you're taking and not accidentally ODing from stuff that has fentanyl in it or is way stronger than you're used to, opiates actually are some of the least toxic drugs there are. You aren't damaging yourself by taking, not in a toxicity sort of way anyway (unless you OD of course, but ODing is avoidable if you're not rolling the dice with sketchy supply that might be fentanyl, or super pure when you're used to stuff that's weak).

It is true that a lot of opiate addicts die young, but it's mostly due to using drugs that are contaminated or of wildly varying strength, and the issues that come with a life of crime and/or homelessness, which, sadly, a lot of addicts face (but is not the drug's fault, it's the fault of the way we have set up society to punish addicts).
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im pretty sure injecting ANYTHING that might seem "harmless" can turn pretty harmful pretty quick when IV. i think a statement like "opiates are some of the least toxic drugs out there" is quite dangerous! even snorting heroin, which i did to avoid the many harms i have caused during IV, i still got several severe lung infections from snorting. who knows the damage caused to the brain from insufflation... ugh
 
You've missed my point though. All I'm saying is that in terms of toxicity, opiates are less damaging than most drugs. I would never say or mean to imply that one is more likely to harm their lives from cigarettes than opiates. In a perfect world where someone always practiced proper technique, and had 100% pure drugs and weighed their doses to ensure they never took more than they meant to, and always had the supply available to maintain their habit, opiates would cause less damage to the body than most other drugs. But in the real world, this is not true in practice because of many reasons.

Someone could be on methadone or suboxone for decades without many ill effects, besides severe dependence and a reduction in testosterone.
 
speaking of suboxone, this shit should be checked for causing severe fatigue. been on on and off most of my life and i always quit it main reason being SEVERE FATIGUE and BREATHING ISSUES. not sure what it does but its damn horrible if unchecked. the warning listing states endocrine issues long term use...
 
Nah, chill depends. Many people thought that heroin gives you HIV, no you get HIV by using the same needles [ so on ]. So drugs themselves mostly and I say this with a grain of salt doesn't cause any major issues but how your health is yeah that's where you need to you know.
 
Xorkoth said:
You've missed my point though. All I'm saying is that in terms of toxicity, opiates are less damaging than most drugs. I would never say or mean to imply that one is more likely to harm their lives from cigarettes than opiates. In a perfect world where someone always practiced proper technique, and had 100% pure drugs and weighed their doses to ensure they never took more than they meant to, and always had the supply available to maintain their habit, opiates would cause less damage to the body than most other drugs. But in the real world, this is not true in practice because of many reasons.

Someone could be on methadone or suboxone for decades without many ill effects, besides severe dependence and a reduction in testosterone.
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The worst physiological damage is the damage done to the (mu)opioid receptors. Endorphins are instrumental in our will to live and multiply. Which sort of makes it "instinct" to take more opioids, once you started, it's like injecting "will to live". Our body cannot be without opioids. The brain gets used to the foreign release of opioids instead of the natural ones, sees "Oh awesome, I don't have to produce my own opioids anymore" and dims the body's production of enkephalins, endorphins, etc more and more. It takes very long until that production is back to normal.

In terms of toxicity opioids are poppycock (pun intended)
 
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