Heroin Need Help (PLEASE) How long should I wait before taking my first dose of Suboxone?

[b00gie]

I know there must be millions of these threads, I've been reading over some of them, but would like to include a little personal info and see if I can get a more personalized response, so I'm sorry for the redundancy but here goes nothing.

I am a 24 y/o female, I am 5'2, and weigh about 105 lbs. I have been using H daily (snorting only) for about 4-5 years now. At most, I would finish a bundle (10 bags) in a day at most, and I would only snort. I never had the guts to bang/shoot. At most, each time I would use, I would only do half a bag to a bag at a time, and 2 bags at a time on very rare occasions.

I think H only got me high for the first couple months I ever started using. After that, literally for the past 4-5 years, I haven't gotten high from using it. I just use it to keep the withdrawals at bay, so I can function through out the day. Yeah, it's as sad and pathetic as it sounds.

I finally mustered up enough courage to get off the stuff with help from Suboxone. I am going to wait as long as humanly possible before taking my first dose of suboxone, with a minimum of at least 24 hours. I just keep reading these horror stories about people still breaking into precipitated withdrawals even after waiting 36+ hours after their last dose, and that's freaking me out and what prompted me to make this thread.

I really would appreciate any advice. I am super freaked out about precipitated withdrawals, and will wait as long as I can, with a minimum of 24 hrs a least for sure. A lot of people say "wait til you're in full blown withdrawal" but I wouldn't know exactly what full-blown withdrawal would feel like, because the longest I've ever waited between doses might have only been a few to several hours.

Just some quick facts:
- 24 y/o female
- 5'2, weighing 105 lbs
- very fast metabolism
- never shot ever, only snorted
- maximum use of a bundle a day, with each dose averaging out to half a bag - whole bag at a time

Also, question: smoking weed usually helps me with my withdrawals, would it be a bad idea to smoke some if things start getting rough??

THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH!!! 8(

 

[Nether Animal]

Seems like most people going into paradoxical precipitated withdrawal get it from trying to inject their bupe. 24 hours should be more than enough. You have a marginal tolerance in the grand scheme of things, so good luck with everything.

 

[Pickledlemons]

24 hours is enough. In my experience 12 hours is usually enough. The important thing is that you are in withdrawal when you take it. Doesnt have to be full withdrawal but when your eyes are tearing up and you're cold and your legs start kicking... you're good.

That being said, precipitated withdrawal is very real!

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

I know there must be millions of these threads, I've been reading over some of them, but would like to include a little personal info and see if I can get a more personalized response, so I'm sorry for the redundancy but here goes nothing.

I am a 24 y/o female, I am 5'2, and weigh about 105 lbs. I have been using H daily (snorting only) for about 4-5 years now. At most, I would finish a bundle (10 bags) in a day at most, and I would only snort. I never had the guts to bang/shoot. At most, each time I would use, I would only do half a bag to a bag at a time, and 2 bags at a time on very rare occasions.

I think H only got me high for the first couple months I ever started using. After that, literally for the past 4-5 years, I haven't gotten high from using it. I just use it to keep the withdrawals at bay, so I can function through out the day. Yeah, it's as sad and pathetic as it sounds.

I finally mustered up enough courage to get off the stuff with help from Suboxone. I am going to wait as long as humanly possible before taking my first dose of suboxone, with a minimum of at least 24 hours. I just keep reading these horror stories about people still breaking into precipitated withdrawals even after waiting 36+ hours after their last dose, and that's freaking me out and what prompted me to make this thread.

I really would appreciate any advice. I am super freaked out about precipitated withdrawals, and will wait as long as I can, with a minimum of 24 hrs a least for sure. A lot of people say "wait til you're in full blown withdrawal" but I wouldn't know exactly what full-blown withdrawal would feel like, because the longest I've ever waited between doses might have only been a few to several hours.

Just some quick facts:
- 24 y/o female
- 5'2, weighing 105 lbs
- very fast metabolism
- never shot ever, only snorted
- maximum use of a bundle a day, with each dose averaging out to half a bag - whole bag at a time

Also, question: smoking weed usually helps me with my withdrawals, would it be a bad idea to smoke some if things start getting rough??

THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH!!! 8(

I am currently on suboxone and once you start feeling your withdrawal starting take the sub and you will be fine.. if you can wait up to 32 hours that's great but I couldn't lol I took it before 24 hours but I had a pretty heavy heroin addiction..

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

I am currently on suboxone and once you start feeling your withdrawal starting take the sub and you will be fine.. if you can wait up to 32 hours that's great but I couldn't lol I took it before 24 hours but I had a pretty bad heroin addiction..

Also yes you can smoke weed, but remember if you are an addict that you don't want to make a habit of smoking weed.. I attend meetings and have a sponsor and work the steps..i struggled with my recovery until I started really working on my addiction.. recovery is not easy or perfect but never give up..

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

Seems like most people going into paradoxical precipitated withdrawal get it from trying to inject their bupe. 24 hours should be more than enough. You have a marginal tolerance in the grand scheme of things, so good luck with everything.

Iv never heard of someone shooting up suboxone.. I heard of them snorting but they say it dosent feel any different than taking it sublingual

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

24 hours is enough. In my experience 12 hours is usually enough. The important thing is that you are in withdrawal when you take it. Doesnt have to be full withdrawal but when your eyes are tearing up and you're cold and your legs start kicking... you're good.

That being said, precipitated withdrawal is very real!

well said! I couldn't agree more,,,

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Hi B00gie and Welcome to Bluelight

It can be difficult to know how much time is long enough for buprenorphinre induction as people can vary in their metabolism, type of opioid in their system, age, etc. In my experience I've found that the COWS scale or Clinical Opioid Withdrawal Scale is well suited to try and find the right amount of W/D/ withdrawal one needs to be in to induce with minimal chance of PW/ precipitated W/D.

It's best to have someone that can help as it's hard to be sick and measure your own vital signs along with symptoms. Even with a long wait and being well into W/D there is no guarantee that PW's will not happen but I think it's your best bet. On the other hand some people can induce 8-12 hours in, with a low COWS score but it hard to know if you're one of those people without several attempts at induction and a high risk of PW's. This COWS system seems to be popular with many Suboxone Doctors and I would highly recommend going this route since you have several years of use. After you induce cannabis might help, but I would just start slow. Other comfort meds are also a good idea, such as 8-12mg of loperamide (immodium), gabapentin/ pregabalin, modest dose of benzodiazepines, ibuprofen/ acetaminophen, multi-vitamin pack, Gatorade and/or juices, anything that would help with influenza can usually be applied to W/D.

A score of 14-18 on the scale is what you should aim for, the higher you can go the better. If you can't make it that high get as close as you can. Take a look and see what you think.

https://www.mdcalc.com/cows-score-opiate-withdrawal#next-steps

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

It's not as hard as people are making it,, once u start feeling any type of withdrawal take the subs!!! Preferably 24 hours of you can,, you will be fine,, sometimes the more you hear people's opinions the more confused and nervous it makes you.. trust me just do what I said and let me know how you feel then

 

[GiNa LyNnxx]

Hi B00gie and Welcome to Bluelight

It can be difficult to know how much time is long enough for buprenorphinre induction as people can vary in their metabolism, type of opioid in their system, age, etc. In my experience I've found that the COWS scale or Clinical Opioid Withdrawal Scale is well suited to try and find the right amount of W/D/ withdrawal one needs to be in to induce with minimal chance of PW/ precipitated W/D.

It's best to have someone that can help as it's hard to be sick and measure your own vital signs along with symptoms. Even with a long wait and being well into W/D there is no guarantee that PW's will not happen but I think it's your best bet. On the other hand some people can induce 8-12 hours in, with a low COWS score but it hard to know if you're one of those people without several attempts at induction and a high risk of PW's. This COWS system seems to be popular with many Suboxone Doctors and I would highly recommend going this route since you have several years of use. After you induce cannabis might help, but I would just start slow. Other comfort meds are also a good idea, such as 8-12mg of loperamide (immodium), gabapentin/ pregabalin, modest dose of benzodiazepines, ibuprofen/ acetaminophen, multi-vitamin pack, Gatorade and/or juices, anything that would help with influenza can usually be applied to W/D.

A score of 14-18 on the scale is what you should aim for, the higher you can go the better. If you can't make it that high get as close as you can. Take a look and see what you think.

https://www.mdcalc.com/cows-score-opiate-withdrawal#next-steps

as an addict you shouldn't take benzodiazepines.. because eventually you will get addicted and abuse them and they are one of the two things that can kill you during withdrawal.. yea I take trazadone to calm down and sleep it works well

 

[b00gie]

thanks to everyone who has responded, i feel a little better. i'm going to take my last dose in a couple hours and hope for the best. since it's the holidays and i have some time off (usually extremely busy) the pressure is on to get it done today/tomorrow. i was honestly just really alarmed at the amount of stories i heard with people breaking into precipitated withdrawal even after 36+ hours. hopefully that won't be the case for me!

i will sign back on later and let you know how it's all going. thank you guys, i've been a lurker on bluelight for a very long time, but needless to say you guys are a beautiful and helpful community. thanks again, and happy holidays!

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Best of Luck to you B00gie !

Hope it works out for you regardless of the method you choose.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Iv never heard of someone shooting up suboxone.. I heard of them snorting but they say it dosent feel any different than taking it sublingual

Buprenorphine (in the US) comes mostly in strips, pills and, well, pills. If someone gets the pills, those are ripe for insulfation. Insulfating buprenorphine increases the BA significantly over sublingual use, so for some people in some circumstances it's a favorable ROA than sublingual (and either way, injecting buprenorphine from pills or strips isn't the best idea, even if they know what they're doing).

as an addict you shouldn't take benzodiazepines.. because eventually you will get addicted and abuse them and they are one of the two things that can kill you during withdrawal.. yea I take trazadone to calm down and sleep it works well

It isn't quite that simple. I also prefer trazodone to most benzos for sleep, but benzos completely are appropriate for some people under certain conditions. No powerful medication like a benzo should be given out willy nilly, but that doesn't mean it should be restricted from someone just because they have the SUD stamp on their file.

thanks to everyone who has responded, i feel a little better. i'm going to take my last dose in a couple hours and hope for the best. since it's the holidays and i have some time off (usually extremely busy) the pressure is on to get it done today/tomorrow. i was honestly just really alarmed at the amount of stories i heard with people breaking into precipitated withdrawal even after 36+ hours. hopefully that won't be the case for me!

i will sign back on later and let you know how it's all going. thank you guys, i've been a lurker on bluelight for a very long time, but needless to say you guys are a beautiful and helpful community. thanks again, and happy holidays!

Welcome to OD b00gie! If you only used 10 stamps a day max you'll be fine waiting about 24 hrs (which it seems like is what it turned out).

Other meds that will really help you detox: clonidine (0.2mg 2x/day), gabapentin (800mg 3-4x/day) and maybe something like diazepam (10mg 1-2x/day) + a non-habit forming sleep aid like trazodone. If I had to choose one of those meds that is most important it would probably be gabapentin.

What else are you doing to help yourself oriented towards success as you continue moving forward?

 

[b00gie]

Other meds that will really help you detox: clonidine (0.2mg 2x/day), gabapentin (800mg 3-4x/day) and maybe something like diazepam (10mg 1-2x/day) + a non-habit forming sleep aid like trazodone. If I had to choose one of those meds that is most important it would probably be gabapentin.

What else are you doing to help yourself oriented towards success as you continue moving forward?

hi there thanks for the info. is gabapentin otc? is clonidine otc? if so i'll try to get to a pharmacy before they all close. i have a bit of xanax and lots of weed to help. also have ibuprofen 600 and 800mg, as well as some tylenol in case the body aches become hard to deal with. just looking forward to kicking this habit man. going to a new school at the end of january, getting a real job soon too, so i feel like this is a great time to just get my life to where i want it to be.

 

[Deftones44]

Hi boogie I literally just created an account just to answer this kind of question while it's still fresh in my mind.. so, I've been on methadone for about 4yrs now and I always heard about precipitated withdrawal but never understood it until last night. So I've been on 120mg for a while and have also been taking more than that in a day. Well I ran out of my methadone and the only thing that I could find was subutex pills not the suboxone which has naloxone.

My last dose of methadone was Friday around noon and I took half of an 8mg subutex the next day Saturday at 8pm. Well that was the worst thing I could have done I literally dove into the worst withdrawal of my life and I mean puking non stop the whole 9 and I've never puked from withdrawal before.. I literally was wishing for my life to end because the pain was completely unbearable. This went on for 4 and a half hours until I finally asked a friend to shoot me with h which btw was my first time ever doing h but I was willing to do anything to make it stop and I couldn't get anything else.. now, when you go from 4yrs on methadone to subs it is worse than going from h or anything else.

Methadone is subs worse enemy so to answer your question I would honestly not even recommend going to subs but if that's what you want and don't want to go to methadone then please please please wait at least 3 days from your last dose of h. This is nothing to play around with believe me when I say that precipitated withdrawal is absolutely the worst thing you will ever go through and is best described as going through hell! I would recommend going to methadone if you can because you can take methadone anytime after your last dose and it will not put you into withdrawal it will actually help..

I personally think that methadone is much better people just don't like it because when you first start going you have to go everyday for a while where as subs you usually get a week at a time to start... Well I really hope this has helped you to realize that subs will put you through hell if your not careful. I literally thought I was going to die so please wait as long as you can.

Btw precipitated withdrawal probably wouldn't hurt as bad and for as long as it did for me if your going to subs from h but I promise it will be the worst withdrawal you have ever had and all the symptoms of withdrawal hit you all at once and is magnified by a million!

I'm completely drained, dehydrated, and shaky still after last night and I've had a total of 3 shots since 1am until now but the nausea and vomiting finally stopped but please please don't think that it won't effect you like it did me because I thought I would be fine but was wrong... please really think about it and good luck and let me know how everything goes...

 

[b00gie]

another question: would it be ok to be asleep for majority if not all of the next 24 hours?

 

[b00gie]

Hi boogie I literally just created an account just to answer this kind of question while it's still fresh in my mind..

I'm completely drained, dehydrated, and shaky still after last night and I've had a total of 3 shots since 1am until now but the nausea and vomiting finally stopped but please please don't think that it won't effect you like it did me because I thought I would be fine but was wrong... please really think about it and good luck and let me know how everything goes...

omg... i'm so sorry you had to experience all of that, sounds fucking terrifying, which is exactly why i made this thread... back to being freaked the fuck out! glad you're feeling better tho

 

[Jabberwocky]

Sleep is good. However I assume you'll use something to make yourself sleep? What would that be?

hi there thanks for the info. is gabapentin otc? is clonidine otc? if so i'll try to get to a pharmacy before they all close. i have a bit of xanax and lots of weed to help. also have ibuprofen 600 and 800mg, as well as some tylenol in case the body aches become hard to deal with. just looking forward to kicking this habit man. going to a new school at the end of january, getting a real job soon too, so i feel like this is a great time to just get my life to where i want it to be.

Those are all prescription meds. They are the basic meds necessarily to kick comfortably.

Kicking with OTC stuff is doable, but very challenging. You options are limited to stuff like Tiger Balm (for RLS), cannabis (depending on the state), loperamide, kratom (please order online and not a head shop), and DXM (use caution and educate yourself before trying it).

Hi boogie I literally just created an account just to answer this kind of question while it's still fresh in my mind.. so, I've been on methadone for about 4yrs now and I always heard about precipitated withdrawal but never understood it until last night. So I've been on 120mg for a while and have also been taking more than that in a day. Well I ran out of my methadone and the only thing that I could find was subutex pills not the suboxone which has naloxone.

My last dose of methadone was Friday around noon and I took half of an 8mg subutex the next day Saturday at 8pm. Well that was the worst thing I could have done I literally dove into the worst withdrawal of my life and I mean puking non stop the whole 9 and I've never puked from withdrawal before.. I literally was wishing for my life to end because the pain was completely unbearable. This went on for 4 and a half hours until I finally asked a friend to shoot me with h which btw was my first time ever doing h but I was willing to do anything to make it stop and I couldn't get anything else.. now, when you go from 4yrs on methadone to subs it is worse than going from h or anything else.

Methadone is subs worse enemy so to answer your question I would honestly not even recommend going to subs but if that's what you want and don't want to go to methadone then please please please wait at least 3 days from your last dose of h. This is nothing to play around with believe me when I say that precipitated withdrawal is absolutely the worst thing you will ever go through and is best described as going through hell! I would recommend going to methadone if you can because you can take methadone anytime after your last dose and it will not put you into withdrawal it will actually help..

I personally think that methadone is much better people just don't like it because when you first start going you have to go everyday for a while where as subs you usually get a week at a time to start... Well I really hope this has helped you to realize that subs will put you through hell if your not careful. I literally thought I was going to die so please wait as long as you can.

Btw precipitated withdrawal probably wouldn't hurt as bad and for as long as it did for me if your going to subs from h but I promise it will be the worst withdrawal you have ever had and all the symptoms of withdrawal hit you all at once and is magnified by a million!

I'm completely drained, dehydrated, and shaky still after last night and I've had a total of 3 shots since 1am until now but the nausea and vomiting finally stopped but please please don't think that it won't effect you like it did me because I thought I would be fine but was wrong... please really think about it and good luck and let me know how everything goes...

That is to say, if someone thinks methadone withdrawal is bad, precipitated methadone withdrawal is even worse. Very true.

But there are a lot of easy ways it can be avoided.

At the end of the day buprenorphine is really helpful when it comes to getting off methadone. It just depends on how you use it. And in that sense it's like any other drug. It depends how YOU choose to use it.

Decisions. Decisions. Decisions

This is why I like being a human. I enjoy learning. I've learned to make the most of mistakes, to treat them as experiments. With each experiment there is the opportunity for success. It's also a good way of someone learning how to cultivate resiliancy.

[/end rand]

 

[Pickledlemons]

omg... i'm so sorry you had to experience all of that, sounds fucking terrifying, which is exactly why i made this thread... back to being freaked the fuck out! glad you're feeling better tho

Dont be freaked out. Methadone half life is way longer than heroin. Just remember what I said, make sure you are in withdrawal before you take it.

 

[b00gie]

Dont be freaked out. Methadone half life is way longer than heroin. Just remember what I said, make sure you are in withdrawal before you take it.

thanks man, that makes me feel better. yeah i looked it up and they said methadone users should wait at least 36 hours, and in some cases 96. crazy...

another question: how long after i take the suboxone do the withdrawals go away? also, do the withdrawals go away COMPLETELY? will i be able to function after my first dose? and from there on out, should i only dose once a day?