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Keep in mind that no one single interpretation is automatically correct. Lynch has repeatedly stated that his films can be viewed in any which way the viewer pleases.
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Film & TV Moderators: ghostfreak
Film Mulholland Drive
- Thread starter Catch-22
- Start date
techno lego
Bluelighter
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What about the part where they find the dead body which is actually herself at the end of the movie?
I so need to watch this movie another ten times.
I so need to watch this movie another ten times.
The Neoracle
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What's with the "Silencio" thing? And that theatre or whatever.
pr0ficient
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Okay, I think I have the entire movie figured out, except for two things. I don't understand what the guys were asking a whore if Rita was a whore. I also don't understand why Rita had 50 grand in her purse?
Can someone help me out here...thanks.
Can someone help me out here...thanks.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
***********SPOILER ALERT*******************
RE: the money in Rita/Camilla's purse: the money first appears in the dream part of film in Rita's purse. Rita has amnesia & her & Betty set out to solve the mystery of who Rita is, what happened to her & what the money is for. In the waking/real part of the film we learn the truth: Diane (who played Betty in the dream) has inherited money from her dead aunt. She later pays the hitman to kill Camilla (who played Rita in the dream) with the cash which she carries in a purse exactly like the one Rita had.
The bit with the whore is still a puzzle. I think that the hitman is also a low level pimp & that Diane was one of his whores. Think about it: Diane is a failed actress who was probobly broke until her aunt died & left her the money. Most folks don't know how to hire a hitman & its not like they advertize in the Yellow Pages. She most likely went to him because he's the lowlife she knows.
I think we would've learned a lot more about the whore if "Mulholland Drive" had been picked up as a series. From what I've learned from people who have seen the original pilot version & from the excepts of the scripts for the first 3 subsequent episodes that have been floating around the net, the Diane/Betty/Rita/Camilla story was wrapped up in the pilot, then the second episode was to center around the hitman. The cops in the begining also have a much larger role in the pilot.
***********SPOILER ALERT*******************
RE: the money in Rita/Camilla's purse: the money first appears in the dream part of film in Rita's purse. Rita has amnesia & her & Betty set out to solve the mystery of who Rita is, what happened to her & what the money is for. In the waking/real part of the film we learn the truth: Diane (who played Betty in the dream) has inherited money from her dead aunt. She later pays the hitman to kill Camilla (who played Rita in the dream) with the cash which she carries in a purse exactly like the one Rita had.
The bit with the whore is still a puzzle. I think that the hitman is also a low level pimp & that Diane was one of his whores. Think about it: Diane is a failed actress who was probobly broke until her aunt died & left her the money. Most folks don't know how to hire a hitman & its not like they advertize in the Yellow Pages. She most likely went to him because he's the lowlife she knows.
I think we would've learned a lot more about the whore if "Mulholland Drive" had been picked up as a series. From what I've learned from people who have seen the original pilot version & from the excepts of the scripts for the first 3 subsequent episodes that have been floating around the net, the Diane/Betty/Rita/Camilla story was wrapped up in the pilot, then the second episode was to center around the hitman. The cops in the begining also have a much larger role in the pilot.
pr0ficient
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This is very interesting, and I think anyone that believes that 2 hours of the movie was a dream should check this out: http://www.imdb.com/oldboards/showpost.pl?Cat=&Board=b0166924&Number=1263181&page=3&view=collapsed&sb=5
It has flaws, but so does the idea of her sleeping for 2 hours.
It has flaws, but so does the idea of her sleeping for 2 hours.
The Neoracle
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Its not that ALL she does is dream--the first part is a combo of her dreams & fantasies. Thre "Betty"/"Rita" part of the film is almost like a bizzare Walter Mitty take off. Diane/"Betty" is an unstable woman to begin with & the deed she did just sent her off the deep end. In the end her even her dreams & fantasy life betray her.
Moose onE
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mulholand drive
this has become the current favorite movie of mine. its fucked up and twisted, and i'd like to discuss it. so what did you like/dislike??? what was your original theory behind whats actually going on?? how come the brunette is so hot???
if you havnt seen this movie. go rent it today, it kicks ass.
this has become the current favorite movie of mine. its fucked up and twisted, and i'd like to discuss it. so what did you like/dislike??? what was your original theory behind whats actually going on?? how come the brunette is so hot???
if you havnt seen this movie. go rent it today, it kicks ass.
I LOVE "Mulholland Drive", & for me it was the best American film since "Pulp Fiction".
I used to post here a lot as "evsid" (I had to ditch the email account that ID was attatched to), & if you do a search you will find another discussion thread on "Mulholland Dr" where I wrote a long & detailed account of the movie. But in a nutshell:
***********S P O I L E R A L E R T************
The film is all all about dreams, the actual "slumber" type (including nightmares) as well as goals, desires, apirations & Los Angeles itself (often referred to as "La La Land" & "Dreamland"). It is the story of a woman named Diane Selwyn who came to Hollywood after winning a jitterbug contest. Not much happened for her professionally as she learned she was just another marginally talented blonde. The only remarkable thing that happened to her was that she began a relationship with the actress (Camilla Rhodes) who got the lead role in the first movie that Diane auditioned for. For a while they were obviously happy & Camilla even helped Diane by getting her bit parts in her films.
At some point Camilla got tired of this arrangement & broke things off with Diane. She severs ties forever rather cruelly at a party she invites Diane to--the party is at Adam Kesher's house, who is Camilla's new boyfrfiend. It is at this party that Camilla not only flaunts another lesbian relationship in Diane's face but she & Adam announce their upcoming nuptials. It is also at this party that we find out that Diane's aunt has just died & left her a chunk of money.
After the party the already emotionally fragile Diane breaks. She uses the $10,000 her aunt left her to pay a hitman to kill Camilla. The hitman tells her that when the deed is done he will place a blue key on her coffee table.
Then Diane really goes off the deep end. The first 2 hours of the film are her dreams, fantasies & wish fufillment. Her dreams & fantasies mimick a noir film. She recasts herself in the role of "Betty", a talented innocent who is on the verge of conquering Hollywood. Camilla is recast in the role as "Rita", a beautiful amnesiac who is totally dependant on Betty & who has escaped a murder attempt. Camilla's new girlfriend is re cast in the role of "Camilla Rhodes", an actress who only makes it in Hollywood because sinister underworld types force her on the geeky director, Adam Kesher. Adam retains his name but in this dream he is an impotent pipsqueak who after throwing a tantrum does what he is told.
At some point though Diane is brought back to reality by a lound knock on her door. She rouses herself from her dream state & it is then that she sees the blue key on her coffee table. Wracked with guilt & disgust with hersellf she shoots herself.
You can also surmise that the entire first 2 hours are what is running through Diane's mind after she has killed herself.
I LOVE this film & can discuss it forever & hope this thread stays at top for a while.
[ 31 October 2002: Message edited by: cydonorb ]
I used to post here a lot as "evsid" (I had to ditch the email account that ID was attatched to), & if you do a search you will find another discussion thread on "Mulholland Dr" where I wrote a long & detailed account of the movie. But in a nutshell:
***********S P O I L E R A L E R T************
The film is all all about dreams, the actual "slumber" type (including nightmares) as well as goals, desires, apirations & Los Angeles itself (often referred to as "La La Land" & "Dreamland"). It is the story of a woman named Diane Selwyn who came to Hollywood after winning a jitterbug contest. Not much happened for her professionally as she learned she was just another marginally talented blonde. The only remarkable thing that happened to her was that she began a relationship with the actress (Camilla Rhodes) who got the lead role in the first movie that Diane auditioned for. For a while they were obviously happy & Camilla even helped Diane by getting her bit parts in her films.
At some point Camilla got tired of this arrangement & broke things off with Diane. She severs ties forever rather cruelly at a party she invites Diane to--the party is at Adam Kesher's house, who is Camilla's new boyfrfiend. It is at this party that Camilla not only flaunts another lesbian relationship in Diane's face but she & Adam announce their upcoming nuptials. It is also at this party that we find out that Diane's aunt has just died & left her a chunk of money.
After the party the already emotionally fragile Diane breaks. She uses the $10,000 her aunt left her to pay a hitman to kill Camilla. The hitman tells her that when the deed is done he will place a blue key on her coffee table.
Then Diane really goes off the deep end. The first 2 hours of the film are her dreams, fantasies & wish fufillment. Her dreams & fantasies mimick a noir film. She recasts herself in the role of "Betty", a talented innocent who is on the verge of conquering Hollywood. Camilla is recast in the role as "Rita", a beautiful amnesiac who is totally dependant on Betty & who has escaped a murder attempt. Camilla's new girlfriend is re cast in the role of "Camilla Rhodes", an actress who only makes it in Hollywood because sinister underworld types force her on the geeky director, Adam Kesher. Adam retains his name but in this dream he is an impotent pipsqueak who after throwing a tantrum does what he is told.
At some point though Diane is brought back to reality by a lound knock on her door. She rouses herself from her dream state & it is then that she sees the blue key on her coffee table. Wracked with guilt & disgust with hersellf she shoots herself.
You can also surmise that the entire first 2 hours are what is running through Diane's mind after she has killed herself.
I LOVE this film & can discuss it forever & hope this thread stays at top for a while.
[ 31 October 2002: Message edited by: cydonorb ]
Moose onE
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cydonorb- i'm aware of that entire story, but i am sure that isnt the story that you thought was going on after the first time you viewed it. this is one of those movies in which the first time you see it will be priceless, kinda like fight club. with further viewings you develop more of an idea about whats happening and catch the little things that you didnt catch before. my question is what was your initial theory about what was going on in the movie???
the first time i watched this movie, i was with 3 otehr people. after the movie was over the 2 girls we were with had no idea what the movie was about, and i dont blame them. my friend and i on the otherhand came up with 2 completely different interpretations about the movie and discussed and debated one anothers points for a good amount of time after the movie was over. not very many movies have me thinking about it long after i watched it.
well basically my initial theory in a nutshell was that the story was cyclical/non-linear, in that characters were switching places at different points throughout the movie. the initial swingers scene kinda is responsible for that way of thinking. my friends theory involved diane's aunt who flew to canada, pulling all the strings behind the scenes and fuckin with the director. both of our stories had valid points as well as many many flaws. but that i think is genius of the film. there is no official story, dave lynch lets the viewer interpret the movie as they see fit.
the dream story that was described in the above post is the one that makes the most sense, however i have a hard time just accepting the fact that it was just a dream. its a very intricate dream, and it being a dream allows room for anything to happen. i kinda think thats the easy way out of explaining the movie. i want there to be a way to connect all the little coincidences in the movie without throwing in the dream explanation. it just doesnt make sense, and thats the beauty of it. its all in how you interpret it.
after viewing it several times however, i have adopted that the dream explanation is in fact the most accurate story. right after the first swingers intro you see a big pink pillow followed by a thump. that is diane falling asleep and that is where the dream begins. on another note, something that has nothing to do with the movie, but offers validity to the dream episode, is that the 24 hours preceding hours prior to the dream have the most impact on the persons dream. this is what psychologists and peoples who interpret dreams beleive is true. that little bit of information is what convinced me that the dream explanation is the most accurate. some examples: the $50K that rita has is the 50K that she pays the hitman; the blue key to the mysterious box is the blue key the hitman shows her; the man at winkies who relives his dream is actually standing in winkies while diane hires teh hitman....etc. another thing that make sense in the dream is that she dreams of having sex with someone who she is atracted to in real life. that is not uncommon to happen.
there are a few things that still dont make sense in the dream explanation. where did the old people come from????? what was the bums role in the movie???? why did diane dream about the image of her future dead self in her dream?????? what was with the silencio scene????? (which in fact is my favorite scene in the movie???? what was the point in the prostiture scene by piinky's? was that just a scene for the sake of a scene, kinda tarantino style???
well, i'll leave it at that. now that i threw out an essay about the movie, lets discuss it further.
the first time i watched this movie, i was with 3 otehr people. after the movie was over the 2 girls we were with had no idea what the movie was about, and i dont blame them. my friend and i on the otherhand came up with 2 completely different interpretations about the movie and discussed and debated one anothers points for a good amount of time after the movie was over. not very many movies have me thinking about it long after i watched it.
well basically my initial theory in a nutshell was that the story was cyclical/non-linear, in that characters were switching places at different points throughout the movie. the initial swingers scene kinda is responsible for that way of thinking. my friends theory involved diane's aunt who flew to canada, pulling all the strings behind the scenes and fuckin with the director. both of our stories had valid points as well as many many flaws. but that i think is genius of the film. there is no official story, dave lynch lets the viewer interpret the movie as they see fit.
the dream story that was described in the above post is the one that makes the most sense, however i have a hard time just accepting the fact that it was just a dream. its a very intricate dream, and it being a dream allows room for anything to happen. i kinda think thats the easy way out of explaining the movie. i want there to be a way to connect all the little coincidences in the movie without throwing in the dream explanation. it just doesnt make sense, and thats the beauty of it. its all in how you interpret it.
after viewing it several times however, i have adopted that the dream explanation is in fact the most accurate story. right after the first swingers intro you see a big pink pillow followed by a thump. that is diane falling asleep and that is where the dream begins. on another note, something that has nothing to do with the movie, but offers validity to the dream episode, is that the 24 hours preceding hours prior to the dream have the most impact on the persons dream. this is what psychologists and peoples who interpret dreams beleive is true. that little bit of information is what convinced me that the dream explanation is the most accurate. some examples: the $50K that rita has is the 50K that she pays the hitman; the blue key to the mysterious box is the blue key the hitman shows her; the man at winkies who relives his dream is actually standing in winkies while diane hires teh hitman....etc. another thing that make sense in the dream is that she dreams of having sex with someone who she is atracted to in real life. that is not uncommon to happen.
there are a few things that still dont make sense in the dream explanation. where did the old people come from????? what was the bums role in the movie???? why did diane dream about the image of her future dead self in her dream?????? what was with the silencio scene????? (which in fact is my favorite scene in the movie???? what was the point in the prostiture scene by piinky's? was that just a scene for the sake of a scene, kinda tarantino style???
well, i'll leave it at that. now that i threw out an essay about the movie, lets discuss it further.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Before I saw "Mulholland Drive" I had heard that characters changed places & that the story folded into itself, so I had a suspicion during the first 2 hours that I was watching a dream or fantasy. By the way I do not think that the first 2 hours are just ONE of Diane's dreams--I believe parts of it are actual dreams, parts nightmares & a lot of it a fantasy life that she retreats to, sort of like a demented "Walter Mitty".
When I first saw the film it hit me as a noir tragedy, a mourful nocture to what could have been for Diane. I guess a lot of that was due to the attatchment I felt to the "Betty" character. I usually hate chirpy charcaters like that (which is why I cannot watch any movie with Meg Ryan), but Naomi Watts infuses an intelligence, spirit & likability to Betty. I almost didn't want to believe that the skanky Diane was the real Betty.
I loved the film so much I went back to see it the next day. I have never been a big David Lynch fan & with the exception of the pilot & first season of "Twin Peaks" I think his work is overrated & is full of missed opportunitues. "Mulholland Drive " to me is the film he's been trying to make his whole career. I say that because it was with the second viewing that I realized that the central theme of the film is dreams, literally & symbolically (see my comments above), a theme he has been kicking around since "Eraserhead". All of his films (except "Elephant Man" & "Straight Story") are about dreams, nightmares, fantasy lives & wish fufillment. This time he really hit the bullseye.
What also says a lot about the film is the incredible sex scenes between Naomi Watts & Laura Elena Harring. They are the first explicit sex scenes I've seen in a recent movie that look like they were made by people who actually like sex. Roger Ebert noted the same thing & went on to say that they reminded him of sex scenes from the great 1970s films. Whats really amazing is that I found them VERY hot and I'm a gay man!!! Hats off to you Mr Lynch, it is a unique lesbian sex scene that gets a gay man hot & bothered!! I think I responded to the passion of the 2 women...but who knows (& no I am not a closet straight guy!).
When I first saw the film it hit me as a noir tragedy, a mourful nocture to what could have been for Diane. I guess a lot of that was due to the attatchment I felt to the "Betty" character. I usually hate chirpy charcaters like that (which is why I cannot watch any movie with Meg Ryan), but Naomi Watts infuses an intelligence, spirit & likability to Betty. I almost didn't want to believe that the skanky Diane was the real Betty.
I loved the film so much I went back to see it the next day. I have never been a big David Lynch fan & with the exception of the pilot & first season of "Twin Peaks" I think his work is overrated & is full of missed opportunitues. "Mulholland Drive " to me is the film he's been trying to make his whole career. I say that because it was with the second viewing that I realized that the central theme of the film is dreams, literally & symbolically (see my comments above), a theme he has been kicking around since "Eraserhead". All of his films (except "Elephant Man" & "Straight Story") are about dreams, nightmares, fantasy lives & wish fufillment. This time he really hit the bullseye.
What also says a lot about the film is the incredible sex scenes between Naomi Watts & Laura Elena Harring. They are the first explicit sex scenes I've seen in a recent movie that look like they were made by people who actually like sex. Roger Ebert noted the same thing & went on to say that they reminded him of sex scenes from the great 1970s films. Whats really amazing is that I found them VERY hot and I'm a gay man!!! Hats off to you Mr Lynch, it is a unique lesbian sex scene that gets a gay man hot & bothered!! I think I responded to the passion of the 2 women...but who knows (& no I am not a closet straight guy!).
LilBlondie
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thanks... that summary really helped. now i want to go rent it again so that i can have an even better understanding. thanks again!!!
Infinite Jest
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ice-9
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sorry if i'm a little late on this, but salon.com did an excellent breakdown of this movie that i think many of you would be interested in.
*=Regulator=*
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I have just watched this film and thought it was amazing.
The acting by the two female leads is probably the most impressive I have even seen, especially that of Naomi Watts. The dream state of the film facilitates a passion between the two characters that is amazingly intense and real. The passion is so effectively punctuated by the fact that the surrounding reality is so flimsy. The first sex scene is the most intensely erotic I have ever seen in any movie. The love, passion, innonence and awakening it conveys is mindblowing.
The transformation in the character of Naomi Watts for the audition is astonishing. This scene alone makes the movie unforgettable. It is a travesty that Watts did not receive an Oscar for her role.
While the ambiguity in the film is what makes is brilliant, it is also frustrating. It is refreshing to see a film that respects its audience but I wish Lynch would have created a slightly more coherent storyline, particularly towards the end.
Having said that I have only watched the film once and that was before I read the dream state hypotheses that seem to make sense.
I can't wait to see this film again.
It seems that no one has mentioned the clues that Lynch provides on the inset of the DVD in the Australian edition (and maybe others). From what I can remember these are:
1. Watch the first minute carefully, several major clues are revealed.
2. Watch the position of the red lampshade.
3. Where is Aunt (name?) ?
4. Watch the movements of the ashtray.
5. Was Cammila's career a result of her talent alone?
6. What happens at Club Silencio?
7. What is the significance of the various phone calls and messages?
8. What is the name of the movie that Betty auditions for?
There's a couple more which I can't remember but I'll post later.
Note that these clues are provided by Lynch himself.
Can anyone comment of the significance of the ashtray, the lampshade and the name of the movie for which is auditioned?
The acting by the two female leads is probably the most impressive I have even seen, especially that of Naomi Watts. The dream state of the film facilitates a passion between the two characters that is amazingly intense and real. The passion is so effectively punctuated by the fact that the surrounding reality is so flimsy. The first sex scene is the most intensely erotic I have ever seen in any movie. The love, passion, innonence and awakening it conveys is mindblowing.
The transformation in the character of Naomi Watts for the audition is astonishing. This scene alone makes the movie unforgettable. It is a travesty that Watts did not receive an Oscar for her role.
While the ambiguity in the film is what makes is brilliant, it is also frustrating. It is refreshing to see a film that respects its audience but I wish Lynch would have created a slightly more coherent storyline, particularly towards the end.
Having said that I have only watched the film once and that was before I read the dream state hypotheses that seem to make sense.
I can't wait to see this film again.
It seems that no one has mentioned the clues that Lynch provides on the inset of the DVD in the Australian edition (and maybe others). From what I can remember these are:
1. Watch the first minute carefully, several major clues are revealed.
2. Watch the position of the red lampshade.
3. Where is Aunt (name?) ?
4. Watch the movements of the ashtray.
5. Was Cammila's career a result of her talent alone?
6. What happens at Club Silencio?
7. What is the significance of the various phone calls and messages?
8. What is the name of the movie that Betty auditions for?
There's a couple more which I can't remember but I'll post later.
Note that these clues are provided by Lynch himself.
Can anyone comment of the significance of the ashtray, the lampshade and the name of the movie for which is auditioned?
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