Methamphetamine + Hydromorphone

[Sase]

So coming up, for my last IV use, I plan on slamming meth and Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) together. How much should I do? Should I adjust my regular dosages? Generally when I slam meth, I do ~.25 in a shot, and I would be good for ~8 hours. When doing a D, I would do half of a pill (4mg) at a time. I was planning on doing a shot of .25g of meth and 4mg of hydromorphone in a single hit. Has anyone done this combination? What should I expect to feel (do I get both rushes, no rush, etc.)?

 

[Larc]

I know nothing of your past/drug history, tolerances, etc so I csnt help much.

Usually we recommend halving your normal doses of the drug to be safe.

 

[Fenta]

250mg Meth? Are you serious about that? 2mg Hydromorphone i.v.should be no risk - if Hydromorphone is down your alley in general. Combination of these drugs doesn't increase the harm - it reduces it!

 

[Sase]

Yeah, people often said that 250mg was a really high dose, I assume that my base tolerance was really high from a life time of prescribed adhd amphetamines. I don't feel much of anything until about 200mg so I usually would do around 250mg. I see mixed information about the riskiness of mixing different drugs, and that's what I'm mainly trying to figure out.

 

[Fenta]

How often du you take Meth (and/or other stimulant drugs)?

The combination of these drugs reduces the harm - the Meth promotes breathing (acts as an analeptic (okay that potential is not that strong like that of Doxapram e.g., but in any case with positive tendency)) and Opioids have inhibitory effects on the norepinephrine-release. I'm a bit uncertain about hydromorphone's exact strength of that effect, I never did research regarding that. Oxycodone for instance was very powerful. So opioids have soothing effects to the cardiovascular system and reduce the psychical stress, at least the morphine-analogons and the agents of the Fentanyl-family. Less effective is Tilidine and even dangerous can be Tramadol, Tapentadol, Pethidine or Meptazinole.

When I took MDPV, this (is known to) induce(d) a distinct tachycardia, I had to treat with agents that blocks beta- or alpha-receptors. With Oxycodone, I usually needed nothing less plus it had anxiolytic effect. I usually take either opioids or opioids and stimulants, but not stimulants stand-alone (except from my 2010+ MDPV-use and that ended in a disaster...)

 

[Larc]

Combination of these drugs doesn't increase the harm - it reduces it!

This information is extremely dangerous misinformation, can a mod please delete that post. Even a few people reading it and taking it as fact could be detrimental to many lives

 

[SKL]

The combination of these drugs reduces the harm

+1 for this poster not knowing what he is talking about despite the attempts at using medical terms

 

[Fenta]

@Larc/SKL: Well, I'im willing to discuss it, but then please explain why you disagree to what I said! The only real danger I see is the higher potential for addiction.

 

[SKL]

MA could possibly counteract the sedating and even the respiratory depressant effects of opiates, yes, but to say this "reduces the harm" because, more or less, the two of them supposedly balance one another out, is not good advice. Particularly because one may wind up underestimating how intoxicated one is per amount of drug ingested and then wind up taking it too far. This is how the speedball kills so readily, although in this case you are not dealing with cocaine's very short duration, but it is stilla problem. These two drugs discussed in the OP can potentially be taken safely together in proper amounts and with prope precautions, but saying concomitant use "reduces the harm" is not good advice as it may lead the OP to disregard precautions and portion contro

 

[MrRoot]

Speedballs (combination of uppers and downers) are quite deadly because often people think that other drug's effects cancel out the effects of the other drug.

While you have a lot of medical literature of pharmacology of any given drug these often are from experiments done with persons who are naive to the drugs.

Someone who has been on amphetamine like substances for a prolonged time has had his body adjusted to the effects of the drugs even to a point that "normal" persons can't tell if they are high or not.

That same applies to opiates. If opiate user's body wouldn't adjust for the constipatory effects they couldn't shit at all for example.

Also it is often that people tend to take either uppers or downers so they don't know a lot about the effects of the other type drug.

So when you have been taking oxycodone daily for years your body has adjusted to the negative side effects such as respiratory depression on their tolerance level.

This often leads to a people thinking they may take more of the drug other than they are using. This of course often leads to visit to ER or even death.

This happens more often with person who has been on uppers and decides to add downer to their combo and think they can safely use more downers because "their effects cancel out each others". Not true and edpecially not true if the other type of drug has been used for a long time.

 

[Fenta]

@SKL: Thank you! I'm willing to admit that my formulation spread a wrong expression. I agree to what you said, but this is not contrary to my position - of course you are right about the danger of winding up, but I (meant to) related just to: Taking x Meth or taking x Hydro vs. taking the same amounts combined. And that is actually beneficial and not more dangerous. The amounts have to be respected as well, if they are much too high, there is no advantage anymore. The amount of Meth he proposed could be a problem, but I never dealt with high-dose-Meth and don't want to exactly estimate how dangerous this is.

@MrRoot: I agree with you as well, but that's a general problem and is a result of a fatal overestimation of the advantages this combination provides in principle.

But you are both right, I will be more careful in future to prevent misunderstandigs and underestimation of any risks which are for me understood. Sorry!

 

[Sase]

The information that Fenta gave is what I was mainly wondering. I know that the main danger with speedballing comes from people overestimating the dosage they can handle. I don't plan on doing more than what I do in a single shot. I know individually, I can handle 250mg of methamphetamine, or 4mg of hydromorphone. If what Fenta is saying is true, combining that amount would reduce my chances of going into cardiac arrest, which was my main concern every time I did meth, because everyone always said, "man, that amount would kill me." I have read people saying that mixing uppers and downers puts an overall greater strain on the heart, but most people seem to agree with what Fenta is saying.

 

[Sase]

I am also really wondering of anybody else here has done this, and what I could expect from it. Will I still get the cough from the meth, or the rush from the D? I know everyone's different and experiences drugs differently, but if anyone has any experience with shooting meth with an opioid, I would love to hear your insight.

 

[Fenta]

As I said, not with Hydromorphone, but mainly with Codeine and Dihydrocodeine. I would have preferred Morphine, Oxycodone oder Fentanyl but in Germany it's hard to find reliable sources and at that time I took Meth I had no other. Well, Cod or DHC do also.
I tried Meth stand-alone, but found it simply too stressing, it was partly uncomfortable. The Opioid didn't just calm me down a bit, it comes forward with inducing an additional euphoria merging with that of the Meth. The result was comfortable. Keeping the opioid-level constant smoothened the usually very uncomfortable feeling when Meth-effect comes to an end. But I was careful enough not to wind up doses too much.

Hydromorphone is no such strong antitussive than Hydrocodone. And it depends on what causes the cough. It will be have suppressing effects, but sometimes a product with herbal ingredients have supporting effects.
The Hydromorphone will not have any effects on the Dopamine-rush I would describe as obstructive. It's likely a bit softer/smoother. I like that!

I'm not a specialist for high-dose-use and I would avoid that! Not just because of the pure acute-physical danger of cardiovascular problems, hyperthermia, convulsion, stroke and other things that can cause sudden deatch, but because of the neurotoxicity - Methamphetamine is known for causing axonal degeneration with long-lasting reductions of the levels of Dopamine and Serotonin. This axonal damage seem to depend to core-temperature (the higher the temperature the more severe the damage). Higher doses are suggested to cause more long-lasting damage (prolonged anhedonia, parkinson's diease, cognitive impairments, ...). I did not take it very often and even so I was very careful. One should always think about if it's worth the fun. You are aware?

 

[Sase]

Yeah, I'm aware. It's the reason it will be my last time doing anything that's not a "hippie drug". A friend who knows how much I normally do, said to do no more than 200mg, so I guess that's what I'll be doing.

 

[Tanner Blaze]

River Phoenix, John Belushi, and Chris Farley all paid the ultimate price for speedballing. Is it really worth it?