Meth - New - weird or normal effects?

[SteveS505]

I am brand new here and very new to drug use. I appreciate your help and patience as I figure out how to navigate this site, which seems great but a little confusing.

My question is regarding meth use.

Basically - I can be prone to anxiety / panic attacks. What I’m finding is two things.

Again - I’m brand new to this. Less than a year. When I smoke - my heart rate really goes up. Sometimes I measure it with a small oximeter I keep with me. I can be up in the 130s, even 140s. Now, that could be the meth, or, you could argue that it’s my anxiety and the fact that I keep checking it that’s keeping it high. But - does anyone else have this? Is this dangerous? It can stay high like that for hours.

Second, when I’m coming DOWN, for about 8-12 hours, I can feel my heart beating / pounding in my chest. There’s no real pain, but I’m super jittery / jumpy and I literally feel my heart beating - again - this is especially when I’m coming down.

I VERY MUCH enjoy smoking meth, and I seem to be able to do it without becoming highly addicted. I can do it just like once or twice a month.

But I’m a worrier - and I’m worried about these symptoms.

I’m 55, in reasonably good health, slightly high blood pressure (but just slightly high and that’s controlled with a daily pill), and I had a full cardio work-up a year ago (stress test, etc) and my heart was in good shape.

Is this just my stress / anxiety? Is this normal? Or do I have some allergy / strange / unique adverse reaction to meth that I need to just basically decide not to do it?

I will also say that when I smoke - it’s VERY light use. Like, compared to some of the guys I’ve seen, I’m like at 10% of the volume they do.

But - this advanced high heart rate and the heart pounding is very real and I’m trying to see how dangerous / not dangerous it may be.

Any advise at all, greatly appreciated.

 

[RxVeritas]

Firstly, welcome to Bluelight!

Secondly, if you're already prone to anxiety, methampetamine will no doubt exacerbate any existing anxiety you have. An increase in heart rate is to be expected if you're using meth. I can tell you from personal experience, as somebody with significant Generalised Anxiety Disorder (I'm currently on 3mg/day Xanax ER and 2400mg/day gabapentin) when I have used methamphetamine in the past, especially for extended periods of time, during the comedowns I would get such bad rebound anxiety that it was borderline crippling and I was not a functional person without a benzo, opiate, shit ton of weed, or alcohol (although I hate alcohol), lyrica would probably work too, but hopefully you get the idea there.

To be on the safe side, and for the sake of harm reduction, I personally would not recommend you continue to use methamphetamine for the time being, as it's also possible that there may be some kind of negative interaction with your blood pressure medication as well,

however,

There's a very, very good chance that somebody else will come along who knows their shit and can do a better job of giving you an answer.


Oh, and welcome to bluelight, again!

 

[SteveS505]

Thank you!

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

I am brand new here and very new to drug use. I appreciate your help and patience as I figure out how to navigate this site, which seems great but a little confusing.

My question is regarding meth use.

Basically - I can be prone to anxiety / panic attacks. What I’m finding is two things.

Again - I’m brand new to this. Less than a year. When I smoke - my heart rate really goes up. Sometimes I measure it with a small oximeter I keep with me. I can be up in the 130s, even 140s. Now, that could be the meth, or, you could argue that it’s my anxiety and the fact that I keep checking it that’s keeping it high. But - does anyone else have this? Is this dangerous? It can stay high like that for hours.

Second, when I’m coming DOWN, for about 8-12 hours, I can feel my heart beating / pounding in my chest. There’s no real pain, but I’m super jittery / jumpy and I literally feel my heart beating - again - this is especially when I’m coming down.

I VERY MUCH enjoy smoking meth, and I seem to be able to do it without becoming highly addicted. I can do it just like once or twice a month.

But I’m a worrier - and I’m worried about these symptoms.

I’m 55, in reasonably good health, slightly high blood pressure (but just slightly high and that’s controlled with a daily pill), and I had a full cardio work-up a year ago (stress test, etc) and my heart was in good shape.

Is this just my stress / anxiety? Is this normal? Or do I have some allergy / strange / unique adverse reaction to meth that I need to just basically decide not to do it?

I will also say that when I smoke - it’s VERY light use. Like, compared to some of the guys I’ve seen, I’m like at 10% of the volume they do.

But - this advanced high heart rate and the heart pounding is very real and I’m trying to see how dangerous / not dangerous it may be.

Any advise at all, greatly appreciated.

Have a fast-acting benzodiazepine (such as alprazolam) and a beta-blocker (such as propranolol) around. Keep at least two whole blisters (or 15 pills) with you at all time. At least that way if your meth high goes south and you are into a panic state, you have a backup. I don't touch stimulants unless I have benzos or propranolol. Also, use it in moderation. Avoid binges.

 

[SteveS505]

Thank you! Can you explain what you mean by a “blister”?

Also - how would I know WHEN to use Alprazolam or Propranolol? For example - what would be an unsafe HR over what period of time? (By the way - I’ve been reading a bunch of your threads and you seem extremely knowledgeable so I’m grateful for your response!)

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

Can you explain what you mean by a “blister”?

Blister pack - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

how would I know WHEN to use Alprazolam or Propranolol?

When you have an "panic attack" (your HR is high, you feel lightheaded, feel chest pain characterized as feeling like a pinching sensation with a needle). Or when you're tachycardic (HR higher than 120-130 for long time). Feeling of impending doom can provoke a panic attack. It's also important to learn the difference between a heart attack and a panic attack: https://health.clevelandclinic.org/the-difference-between-panic-attacks-and-heart-attacks/

 

[SteveS505]

I’m OFTEN tachycardic even WITHOUT meth just from anxiety. So, just getting ready to party, I’m amped up and my HR is probably around 90-100. So generally, I try to just ride out the 120-130 for a few / several hours, because I’ve read the threads about the danger of getting into the upper / downer cycle. So I’m other words - I can have an HR of 120-130 and still not be in “panic attack” mode. (I know - because I have had FULL ON panic attacks and I know the difference.)

But are you recommending I should do the propranolol or Xanax simply because my HR is around 120-130? ( I REALLY appreciate having someone to talk this through with!)

 

[RxVeritas]

I have chronic high blood pressure caused by my anxiety, by my daily benzos keep by BP around 130/70. Were I not to take my xanax, I would probably be about 145/85 which I've been told (by a physicians assistant, not a real MD Psychiatrist like the one I recently started seeing) is right at the edge of potentially prescribing me a beta blocker or something. I'm not sure how I feel about everyday use of beta blockers, but coming from somebody who takes daily xanax that probably doesn't mean much.

Beta blockers, like propranolol, basically reduce the physical symptoms of anxiety such as increased heartrate and blood pressure. It's also fairly common knowledge that concert musicians (more often orchestral) will sometimes take beta blockers before a concert, because they do a great job of steadying shaky hands.

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

I have chronic high blood pressure caused by my anxiety, by my daily benzos keep by BP around 130/70. Were I not to take my xanax, I would probably be about 145/85 which I've been told (by a physicians assistant, not a real MD Psychiatrist like the one I recently started seeing) is right at the edge of potentially prescribing me a beta blocker or something. I'm not sure how I feel about everyday use of beta blockers, but coming from somebody who takes daily xanax that probably doesn't mean much.

Beta blockers, like propranolol, basically reduce the physical symptoms of anxiety such as increased heartrate and blood pressure. It's also fairly common knowledge that concert musicians (more often orchestral) will sometimes take beta blockers before a concert, because they do a great job of steadying shaky hands.

Propranolol for anxiety usually doesn't make me significantly bartarded (which is why I mostly don't take benzos with stimulants), so I still have the benefit of focus/concentration, etc. that comes with the stimulants but not the anxiety (my anxiety is almost always physical, so propranolol works best for me to take in combination with stimulants, especially when I'm doing some physical activity).

 

[RxVeritas]

Propranolol for anxiety usually doesn't make me significantly bartarded (which is why I mostly don't take benzos with stimulants), so I still have the benefit of focus/concentration, etc. that comes with the stimulants but not the anxiety (my anxiety is almost always physical, so propranolol works best for me to take in combination with stimulants, especially when I'm doing some physical activity).

It's good that you know what works for you, and I'm right there with you in that. I've taken beta blockers several times and they are very effective for bringing down BP and shaky hands without affecting my thought process at all.

Thing is, I need thought processes to be affected, which is why benzos work so well for me. I have a lot of OCD tendencies as well, although I've internalized (is that the right word here?) or suppressed them to the point where, aside from some Dermatillomania scarring on my forearms (which i know will fade eventually, and it's really difficult for me not to be self conscious about it although I've made progress there), even unmedicated, the OCD tendencies wouldn't be noticeable or manifest outwardly. In this unmedicated scenario I would, however be in a state of hypervigilance, scanning my environment (or failing to, because of tunnel vision), and have a BP of 200/120, while trying to go about my day.

I like benzos because they more or less shut down all my OCD bullshit as well as keep my anxiety at a very manageable level.

If I were about to get up on a stage with the boys and play some guitar/keys/whatever, in front of a room, I definitely wouldn't turn down a beta blocker, but in that case I'd prefer a benzo.

 

[SteveS505]

This is all super helpful and I’m very grateful for this site and your responses. So, I’d never even CONSIDERED the propranolol kind of as an alternative to the Xanax, but having a similar effect.

So two questions…

If I tried the propranolol route, WHEN do I take it? Just before I start smoking the meth? In the midst of my session? After? Again - just because of my anxiety, my HR and BP is going to be spiking even without the meth. I’ve been trying NOT to add the Xanax or propranolol in and ride out the high HR and BP for several hours. But maybe that’s not the right thing?

Final question - I’ll be doing Viagara along with all this. Is that ok? I know not to do poppers with it.