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Opioids Making a Nasal Spray with Pure Fentanyl Powder (Fentanyl Solubility Questions)

D

Deathly

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 17, 2011
Messages
23
Hey,

I recently acquired about 50mg of Fentanyl Hydrochloride powder and I am looking to make a solution to use in a 30ml refillable nasal spray bottle that I just bought. I am well aware of how dangerous Fentanyl is especially in a concentrated powder form. I do have a very high tolerance (can easily tolerate 800mg of oxycodone orally over a 24 hour period) this will make the handling of the powder a bit less dangerous. I also have some safety gloves/glasses and a milligram scale.

The nasal spray bottle I have comes with 30ml of a solution that is 15% Polyethylene Glycol and 5% Propylene Glycol with a pH of 6.0 in water based formulation. So that is 4.5ml of PEG and 1.5ml of PG by volume. The package says each bottle is approx 300 sprays, so 10 sprays/ml and 0.1ml per spray. I would ideally like to dissolve either 30mg or 45mg of fentanyl into 30ml of solution which would equate to 100mcg/spray or 150mcg/spray. Fentanyl HCl is essentially insoluble in water (200mg/Litre at 25C) so I would like to know how soluble fentanyl HCl is in PEG, PG, Ethanol? or are there any other safe easy to obtain solvents that could be used in a nasal spray? To be safe, I was thinking that I would then remove a small amount of the current solution and replace it with Ethanol, maybe even as several ml of vodka or another spirit.

Would this work? Any thoughts on whether I should add ethanol? Anyone have figures on Solubility of Fentanyl HCl in ethanol? Polyethylne Glycol? Propylene Glycol?

Please let me know your thoughts.

Thanks in advance
 
I agree it very dangerous, and that is the reason I posted this on a Harm Reduction board.
 
rhizome said:
This is extremely dangerous, and has no place on a Harm Reduction board. That's my thought.
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What a dumbass comment. He is asking how to make the nasal spray properly to REDUCE HARM. Reading some of this guy's other posts he seems like a condescending know it all who enjoys stimulants and feels he has to chime in on some opiate talk about how he fentanyl is so dangerous...it can be used safely, but you know maybe someone is interested in the best way to do that. f'n nitwit
 
OP, are you sure what you have is what you think it is? And if so how are you sure? Pure fent powder I would imagine is insanely hard to come by. However there are quite a few fent analogues out there sold as RCs, and I would bet the likelihood of what you have is an RC.
 
I'm not sure why you think the solubility of fentanyl HCl is so low. The solubility of fentanyl HCl is ~10 mg/mL in phosphate-buffered saline (pH 7.2).

The water solubility of freebase fentanyl is listed as 200 mg/L, but that is not the same thing as fentanyl HCl
 
serotonin2A said:
I'm not sure why you think the solubility of fentanyl HCl is so low. The solubility of fentanyl HCl is ~10 mg/mL in phosphate-buffered saline (pH 7.2).

The water solubility of freebase fentanyl is listed as 200 mg/L, but that is not the same thing as fentanyl HCl
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Qft.

I unfortunately have expirence making liquid solutions of what was sold to me (and I assume is fentanyl going from how potent it was) and the HCl is fairly water soluble.

All I'm going to say is use that dust mask, I'd use distilled water instead of other solvents, and make sure you fucking weigh it three times, and do your math four times. Write it down on a piece of paper and read it again.

It can be done, just know it can be extremely dangerous if you don't know what your doing or make a mistake.

Also, I'd lower the concentration per spray. Shoot for something like 40mcg per spray, and pump the sprayer four times for a dose. Easier to titrate and safer if you fuck up on the math a bit, it also Makes it easier when you have to ween yourself of the stuff as well haha. But then again that's not really funny, its sad.....
 
I made a Solution with PFBF dissolving ~40-50mg in 10ml. Unfortunatly i had the base and needed to add a little ascorbic acid. My sprayer also distributed 0,1ml per full spray (confirmed by practical tests). I filtered the solution to avoid undissolved particles to cause hot spots in the solution. I would make a concentration of 1mg/ml. Even PFBF was strong with 4-5mg/ml after 4-8 sprays.
 
Mad Dash said:
OP, are you sure what you have is what you think it is? And if so how are you sure? Pure fent powder I would imagine is insanely hard to come by. However there are quite a few fent analogues out there sold as RCs, and I would bet the likelihood of what you have is an RC.
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You're very correct. pure fentanyl/fentanil in powder form is rare, but is made. It is easier and safer when it is obtained purely in a pre-made formula in 1mg/1ml.

However if you're serious about making this into a nasal solution it is possible but not really worth it. Fentanyl is better served orally, IME. Maybe make a fentanyl tincture? It would rock your world.. Couple drops under the tongue and you're done.

Now 100/250mcg sprays would be a decent dose, even though a lot of people in the hospital get 500/750mcg nebulized sometimes and that is for the opiate tolerant person. I read you said 800mg oxy/QID, but remember, Fentanyl/Fentanil is a bit stronger than oxycodone.

I would store the stash for a day when you're a bit more experienced with the stuff and know how to make a tincture bottle. It'll last longer and be stronger.
 
Mad Dash said:
OP, are you sure what you have is what you think it is? And if so how are you sure? Pure fent powder I would imagine is insanely hard to come by. However there are quite a few fent analogues out there sold as RCs, and I would bet the likelihood of what you have is an RC.
Click to expand...
trip407 said:
I made a Solution with PFBF dissolving ~40-50mg in 10ml. Unfortunatly i had the base and needed to add a little ascorbic acid. My sprayer also distributed 0,1ml per full spray (confirmed by practical tests). I filtered the solution to avoid undissolved particles to cause hot spots in the solution. I would make a concentration of 1mg/ml. Even PFBF was strong with 4-5mg/ml after 4-8 sprays.
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And PBF is somewhat neck and neck with Fentanyl itself
 
thedukeofraoul said:
Now 100/250mcg sprays would be a decent dose, even though a lot of people in the hospital get 500/750mcg nebulized sometimes and that is for the opiate tolerant person. I read you said 800mg oxy/QID, but remember, Fentanyl/Fentanil is a bit stronger than oxycodone.
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Do NOT make a 750mcg dose spray-nebulizer is close to IV dosing, which is a fraction of that. And an 800mg oxy QID (which reads as 3200mg of oxy per day) is equally LETHAL to even a highly tolerant opioid user. Fentanyl isn't just a bit stronger than oxy, it's incredibly stronger by weight-oxy is in milligrams and fentanyl in micrograms. Fentanyl also has a longer half life. Here is my research on nebulizing fentanyl-a medical journal contribution: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/12615585/
Please provide yours with those ludicrous numbers. Good luck on that.
 
I've read studies where the BA of nasal-sprays of Fentanyl became greater with dextrose, sp you might wanna check that.

Is PH-important for getting a homogen solution with Fentanyl HCL and destilled H2O?
 
I make my liquid in smaller amounts then combine them into a larger batch. I have pure Fu-f, not sure whether it's the HCL or salt form but it does not dissolve in water. I put absolut vodka into an oral syringe and put four or five drops into the "pot." I then can dissolve up to 20mg in those few drops. Any more than that and I have to add more alcohol. Then I add the desired amount of water and it mixes totally clear.

I tried using ascorbic acid but I only had it in tablets so when I crush them and tried to use the powder I couldn't tell if the Fu-f had dissolved due to the fillers.
 
RTrain said:
What a dumbass comment. He is asking how to make the nasal spray properly to REDUCE HARM. Reading some of this guy's other posts he seems like a condescending know it all who enjoys stimulants and feels he has to chime in on some opiate talk about how he fentanyl is so dangerous...it can be used safely, but you know maybe someone is interested in the best way to do that. f'n nitwit
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This
 
Oh sorry just reread your post and saw you have actual fentanyl. I imagine it will still dissolve nicely in alcohol though. Definitely don't go with the 20mg I mentioned! But at least you know a lesser amount will dissolve np
 
Your too right. This is what harm reduction is all about. Gotta be a nitwit!
 
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