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[LSD Subthread] The Clean vs. Dirty Acid Debate (Part 1 - Archived)

Dave82 said:
How do you distinguish the difference?
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Blotters with DOx or 5meoAMT will taste like shit every time. There's no way to avoid that.

So if you throwing down big bucks on a sheet, insist on tasting a tiny bit of the trim.

Also you can usually even smell it a little bit. =D
 
Man I had some good 2c-i the other night, good thing I didn't get any of that bad 2c-i again ---- The shit you guys are saying doesn't even make sense, a chemical is a chemical is a chemical, and ESPECIALLY with LSD, your gonna be hard pressed to make anything other than the LSD matter at such low dosages. Give me a fucking break.
 
this is "clean" acid, this is "dirty" acid...

is it just me, or is LSD just LSD no matter what? i have a long argument with a couple friends about this weekend. one didn't know what she was talking about, the other's only point was that white fluff & amber (for example) have different levels of chemical purity.

am i the only one that thinks this is completely silly & that purer acid just means a different method of synthesis?
 
Well LSD is LSD no matter what- unless it not. Such degradations in a product can render LSD into inactive isomers, iso-LSD for one, can't remember another one. They are inactive but as ergolines they may have some addittion to the trip. Any perception of 'clean' or 'dirty' acid is a misnomer- really, LSD is LSD.

"Purer" LSD implies that LSD, like for example cocaine, can and is cut with things, which it isn't. If an LSD tab is 'not pure', the LSD is and has to be; its what it may have degraded to which makes it 'not-LSD'. Chemical purity doesn't imply 'good' or 'bad' LSD as there is only one kind.
 
I, for one, however believe that individuals involved with synthesizing, laying, and distributing the LSD can impart some of their vibrations, energies, karma, or whatever you want to call it to the LSD crystal itself, which in turn can affect the individual experience that the LSD produces. (It's no coincidence that we are dealing w/CRYSTALS.) This has a great deal to do with why some LSD feels better than others, and why LSD obtained from "commercial" sources often winds up being more of a recreational, versus a spiritual, type of experience. Of course, LSD is LSD is LSD, and it's affects on your mind will be the same, but there is much to be said for the energies that it creates.
 
^But no matter who the chemist is, the molucule is LSD. If the Dalai Lama synthed some up, sure it would be cool conceptually, but do a GC/MS test on it and it will be LSD- nothing more or less, if the Dalai is a good cook. What do you mean its no coincidene that we're dealing with crystals? Does the meth crystal lattice allow the energy of the methcook to be imparted into it? Whilst I do believe some crystals have the capacity to hold and impart energy, I don't believe such as sugar and salt, which are crystals, to be particualryly magical.

I do believe in unseen and unknown energies, but in the real world, it doesn't matter who makes the acid- its acid. Its who TAKES the acid that counts. The rest is western hogwash. Would psilobyin mushrooms that grew under stonehenge be more potent? Not for any real reason no, but they would be more 'fun' and aethestically pleasing to consume.
 
1. swilow?

2. Of course you are correct. The energies of the person who made/distributed the acid particularly when this is known to the person taking the acid, is very much a subjectively determined thing and therefore affects the attitude of the person who is tripping towards the LSD as the trip begins and therefore can alter it's course. This is simply a matter of set and setting. However I believe that something in there that goes beyond. I do not have a physical explanation for this nor would it show up on a GC/MS. But there is so much about LSD that is unique, even on a chemical level (piezoluminescence (sp?)) and historically (spontaneous mystical experiences, peculiarly presciences, etc ...) I don't think it's too far out to believe that "unseen and unknown" energies are both emanated and absorbed by LSD on a "physical" (meta-physical?) as well as an experential level.
 
Sure, energies exist but I don't believe they can be put in to crystals of any kind.

There's only one kind of lsd so if they think it's clean or dirty maybe it's their mind that is clean or dirty instead of the lsd as it is the only thing that can make their trip different.
 
swilow said:
Well LSD is LSD no matter what- unless it not. Such degradations in a product can render LSD into inactive isomers, iso-LSD for one, can't remember another one. They are inactive but as ergolines they may have some addittion to the trip. Any perception of 'clean' or 'dirty' acid is a misnomer- really, LSD is LSD.

"Purer" LSD implies that LSD, like for example cocaine, can and is cut with things, which it isn't. If an LSD tab is 'not pure', the LSD is and has to be; its what it may have degraded to which makes it 'not-LSD'. Chemical purity doesn't imply 'good' or 'bad' LSD as there is only one kind.
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+1


The message i have entered is too short.
 
I think its all in peoples head.

If you get it from a person whose giving you great vibes and he tells you a good story about how this was imparted with spiritual energies then the though is likely to come up subconsciously during your trip
 
swilow said:
Well LSD is LSD no matter what- unless it not. Such degradations in a product can render LSD into inactive isomers, iso-LSD for one, can't remember another one. They are inactive but as ergolines they may have some addittion to the trip. Any perception of 'clean' or 'dirty' acid is a misnomer- really, LSD is LSD.
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mmhmm, i believe the other inactive isomer is lumi-lsd.
 
I hate the train of thought that since acid can be so subjectively interesting, it must therefore have some special 'energy' beyond its physical form. The fact that a 'mere' chemical, which we can make and study and experiment on, can have such profound effects is far more interesting than some medieval hogwash about magical energies. I don't mean any offence to those who hold these beliefs, but I do think that this obscurantist tendency is a big part of what gives psychedelics (and their users) a bad social image.

'Dirty' LSD means the LSD is not pure LSD. This could mean active cuts (yes, it's possible.... DOx on tabs, any number of things in microdots or candies or other such things), sloppy synth jobs leading to, e.g., iso-LSD, or a different substance entirely with no actual LSD. 'Clean' means LSD is the only active ingredient.
 
solistus said:
I hate the train of thought that since acid can be so subjectively interesting, it must therefore have some special 'energy' beyond its physical form. The fact that a 'mere' chemical, which we can make and study and experiment on, can have such profound effects is far more interesting than some medieval hogwash about magical energies.
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The hogwash you speak of is one and the same with the extremes that I see developing in the future of neuroscience, it is just approached and verbalized in a different way. One day we will have explanations for all of this. But until then I can only call it as I see and feel it, and how I see and feel once the "I" that is seeing and feeling is gone ... and I feel structures and energies and relationships beyond what we can presently explain in chemistry or pharmacology. A 'mere' chemical, LSD certainly is not, it is a remarkbly complex and unique one who's properties are not fully understood by neurology, pharmacology, chemistry, or anything else.

I don't mean any offence to those who hold these beliefs, but I do think that this obscurantist tendency is a big part of what gives psychedelics (and their users) a bad social image.
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Perhaps. There are certainly tendencies in the psychedelic movement towards an unfortunate kind of elitism, obscurantism, cult of personality, and any other number of ills. I'm with you on that. It's part of the danger of the seriousness of the things that we are dealing with. LSD is serious business. I try to explain what it has done and where it has taken me and words fail, science fails, and the whole of human experience and expression fails because there was not even a human experiencing or expressing what the I-apart-from-I feels. I try to use language that attempts to explain or share the experience, but 'tis truly through a glass darkly.

'Dirty' LSD means the LSD is not pure LSD. This could mean active cuts (yes, it's possible.... DOx on tabs, any number of things in microdots or candies or other such things), sloppy synth jobs leading to, e.g., iso-LSD, or a different substance entirely with no actual LSD. 'Clean' means LSD is the only active ingredient.
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^Truth.

Although I think DOx, all conspiracy theories aside, is a relative rarity, at least from LSD that is obtained through certain channels; I do not know what the street dealers are selling, in fact, I have never bought LSD from the same people that I would get, say, weed or dope, from.

Sorry for the TL;DR

<3 Peace and Love,
SKL
 
swilow said:
^But no matter who the chemist is, the molucule is LSD. If the Dalai Lama synthed some up, sure it would be cool conceptually, but do a GC/MS test on it and it will be LSD- nothing more or less, if the Dalai is a good cook. What do you mean its no coincidene that we're dealing with crystals? Does the meth crystal lattice allow the energy of the methcook to be imparted into it? Whilst I do believe some crystals have the capacity to hold and impart energy, I don't believe such as sugar and salt, which are crystals, to be particualryly magical.

I do believe in unseen and unknown energies, but in the real world, it doesn't matter who makes the acid- its acid. Its who TAKES the acid that counts. The rest is western hogwash. Would psilobyin mushrooms that grew under stonehenge be more potent? Not for any real reason no, but they would be more 'fun' and aethestically pleasing to consume.
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Disclaimer (drunk )



Bestest post you ever made :) <3
 
I have read that the LSD can be pure or impure and that it depends on how skilled the cook is in many cases. I have taken some LSD and gotten body cramps shitty feelings in my back and just a dirty body load. It cant all be set and setting like I read it has to do with how many washes the chemist does on the final product as leftover ET can have some nasty body reactions. but I could be wrong thats just always been my understanding. As far as DOX being rare I call BS last two blotters I have gotten have been something other than LSD for sure. bitter taste and a long duration.
 
well, my only experience with acid that might be considered "bad" was borat's deadheads (for those of you who know what those are). they gave me pretty bad stomach ache and a general body load that i never really get with acid. of course, they tasted like bigfoot's dick, so maybe they were an RC. But that just seems doubtful because quantitatively it seemed like acid (comeup and duration), and it seemed similar subjectively too.

that's basically the only thing that might lead me to believe that there's "bad" acid.

however, is it possible that there's an active but less preferable analog that is sometimes accidentally synthed instead of (or in addition to) lsd?
 
drew345 said:
I have read that the LSD can be pure or impure and that it depends on how skilled the cook is in many cases. I have taken some LSD and gotten body cramps shitty feelings in my back and just a dirty body load. It cant all be set and setting like I read it has to do with how many washes the chemist does on the final product as leftover ET can have some nasty body reactions. but I could be wrong thats just always been my understanding. As far as DOX being rare I call BS last two blotters I have gotten have been something other than LSD for sure. bitter taste and a long duration.
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Maybe; when erowid did an analysis of street acid they found some unreacted ergotamine, and a few unidentifiable compounds. The ergotamine probably isn't prevalent in large enough amounts to effect the trip unless you eat a lot of it; the normal medical dose is 1mg+ after all. It's possible the other peaks were other reagents, maybe unreacted diethylamine?
 
Maybe it is all an unbroken karmic chain that is a reflection of your self and your thoughts. If you are searching for a enlightening trip full of love maybe you will find some LSD that was made and put out with the intentions of giving people a enlightening trip full of love and good vibes. If you are looking for some stuff to get fucked up and see fuck up shit maybe you will find some black gels from some sketchy crackhead.
Just a thought. ;)
 
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