LSD flashbacks on Weed/ How long for HPPD to disappear?

[TheCuriousOne]

I've taken LSD about five times in the last three months.
Since I've candyflipped about 3 months ago, I have moderate HPPD.
I do get negative afterimages (ghosting), visual snow, static patterns on surfaces, walls are melting & breathing, lights have halos around them etc.

It's really annoying when reading and at nights. I don't have any anxiety, but I always keep thinking of how I've damaged my brain forever and I will have this until I die.

Everytime I smoke weed, everything gets intensely trippy. I get OEVs and CEVs and this LSD mindset.
Once I smoked weed on XTC and I had a complete flashback of my previous Candyflip. It was exactly like it, I was tripping balls and it actually scared me a bit.

This really sucks. I don't want to give up psychedelics and weed forever. I want to use them and after tripping I want to go on with my life, but not with this constant trippy eyesight.

Is here anyone that had moderate to severe HPPD and just stopped doing any drug (including weed) and had its HPPD vanished completely? If yes, how long does it normally take? 3 months? Or several years?
Or am I doomed forever?

I am really feeling uncomfortable right now

BTW: I'm only talking about HPPD and not psychosis or DP/DR.

 

[mastersplinter420]

Honestly man the only way your going to somewhat recover is to take a break from tripping. I'm an experienced tripper, but I spread my trips out so things like these don't occur to me. My best advice for you is to lay off any psychedelic for as long as possible, drink lots of water, workout and eat healthy

 

[sekio]

Everytime I smoke weed, everything gets intensely trippy.

I think that's the point

I do get negative afterimages (ghosting), visual snow, static patterns on surfaces, walls are melting & breathing, lights have halos around them etc. [...]
It's really annoying when reading and at nights.

Aside from not concentrating on these symptoms and avoiding any drugs that could stimulate your visual cortex too much (cannabis, psychedelics, dissociatives), there's not much you can do. Consider seeing an optometrist to make sure you don't have anything wrong physically with your eyes, or adjust your reading setup to have brighter lights.

If it makes you feel any better, I have all that HPPD-type stuff going on as well, and have to some extent experienced it even before I did any drugs. I find that unless I'm seriously loaded, the distortion never gets so bad that it really interferes with my sight - that is, if I can't make out an image it's always because my eye lenses aren't perfect (optometrist told me so), not because visual snow is so strong I can't make out the words - and adjusting my focal length, the lighting, or looking from another angle fixes it. This is why I'm a firm believer of the "check with your optometrist, then stop worrying about it" treatment. The other reason I advocate it is because we don't have any effective treatments for nonspecific visual noise beyond, say, antipsychotics and sedatives, which don't always help.

Fun experiment: get a book of optical illusions at a dollar store and go through it with a child sometime. Anything that involves ghosting, op-art, the like... ask 'em if they ever see "floaters". The answers could surprise you

 

[TheCuriousOne]

Aside from not concentrating on these symptoms and avoiding any drugs that could stimulate your visual cortex too much (cannabis, psychedelics, dissociatives), there's not much you can do. Consider seeing an optometrist to make sure you don't have anything wrong physically with your eyes, or adjust your reading setup to have brighter lights.

Yes, but how long does it take to go away by... let's say 80%?
Can you tell me when was the last time you've tripped or smoked weed? More than 3 months ago?


I think I will go to an optometrist, but there's one thing I fear. What if he will force me some glasses because of my bad eyesight? Could that result in the loss of my driver license because of me denying glasses?


another thing:
I really plan to stop with all psychedelics for a while, but me and some friends were planning on to try mescaline in 2 weeks. This is my only opportunity to try it and I always wanted to try it. I will do that but afterwards I am 100% sure of abstaining for at least 6 months. Would I be back to normal by then, and would smoking weed feel like it used to be back in the day (without feeling like tripping balls) ?

 

[sekio]

Yes, but how long does it take to go away by... let's say 80%?
Can you tell me when was the last time you've tripped or smoked weed? More than 3 months ago?

I'm not sure how you can tell how much "percent" visual distortions you're experiencing. Let's just say, I don't find they bother me. I can "read over" them, they're just background noise. And I consume cannabis on the regular... not so much psychedelics but I fancy some once in a while. For a day or so afterwards I might notice the visual noise a little more but I never find it to be an issue.

Of course, everyone is different. Some people find that HPPD type stuff is a problem for them for months on end after a single dose of whatever. Some people shrug it off in a day. It's really dependent on how well you integrate your trips and trust your senses, and how susceptible you are to anxiety. (as well as the typical stuff... set and setting, dose, etc... "emotionally charging" the issue - "will I be like this FOREVER???" - will also make it worse to an extent.)

I think I will go to an optometrist, but there's one thing I fear. What if he will force me some glasses because of my bad eyesight? Could that result in the loss of my driver license because of me denying glasses?

You might be required to wear glasses to operate motor vehicles if your eyesight is bad enough. It's not something you should be worried or afraid about... there's a million and one types of lenses, frames, contacts, LASIK, etc. - and it's better that you can see properly on the road, rather than be an injury waiting to happen.

If you can't read street signs very well, or constantly have trouble reading newspapers or books, then you may well need glasses... that's just something that happens to people, coincidentally, sometimes around the same time they discover psychedelics Think of it as getting a tool that will help put your mind at ease. Being able to read is a good thing, if you get frustrated because your vision needs correction, fixing it will make you feel a lot better.

But, like I said, it may be as simple as not reading under the right lighting, you might need glasses only for reading, or maybe not at all. You really should see an optometrist once in a while anyway, just as a preventative thing.

Just remember, having a certain amount of visual noise and the like is totally normal. If you can't read things, or the "noise" is constantly bothering you, that's another issue. Having a kind of zen attitude about the noise is the best treatment. I've heard clonazepam as a treatment, for this reason...

 

[Lightning-Nl]

Hey, sorry about the long post. Back on my amps after a couple weeks, and I tend to go over and beyond lol. Anyways, I'd really appreciate it if you'd read my post and give me your honest thoughts < Thanks as always.

Some people shrug it off in a day. It's really dependent on how well you integrate your trips and trust your senses, and how susceptible you are to anxiety. (as well as the typical stuff... set and setting, dose, etc... "emotionally charging" the issue - "will I be like this FOREVER???" - will also make it worse to an extent.)

I'm sure you already know how intense my anxiety is, Sekio. So I won't go into that. However, I've been curious about psychedelics for a long-time and I want to try one sometime in my life. However, I'm quite afraid to. First off - having predisposed anxiety about something that could very-well cause anxiety... will cause anxiety. (Pretty much THE reason why I'm benzo'd full-time now). Since I fear having anxiety - I will have a massive panic attack if I take a psychedelic.

Anxiety-aside, would you recommend that I take a psychedelic? I smoke weed occasionally. Usually once per month. Why so infrequently? Because weed always gives me hallucinations. At times when I've smoked 'danks', I've experienced full-fledged visual and auditory hallucinations. These are neutral at first - but quickly turn hostile. I will see shadow people out of the corner of my eye. It's always the shadow person that I refer to as 'The G-man", because he looks like an FBI-agent from the 50's.

So, I usually ALWAYS have to combine weed with a benzo if I smoke some. This doesn't make the hallucinations go away - it just makes them neutral again, and not frightening. The problem doing that then, is the fact that I will literally start 'nodding'. I'll start falling asleep. Even if I'm standing up, I'll instantly drift off and the only thing that wakes me up is the feeling that I'm about to fall backwards.

Anyways, I also have HPPV like symptoms all the time. I've had them ever since I was born. Visual snow - visual disturbances of all kinds (seeing objects move out of the corner of my eyes, seeing a very bright light out of the corner of my eye, seeing the outlines of faces in patterns, etc). I also have closed-eye hallucinations. When I close my eyes, I see purple blobs moving around, over layed on top of visual static.

Also, in relation to this thread, I believe I have repressed memories of childhood-abuse. These memories must have been so traumatic and scary that I can't remember them. But I know they're there. I can feel it in my head like a ball of lead. I seem to remember very-small bits of it every now and then. I also have (what I believe to be PTSD flashbacks). Out of nowhere, I'll get this incredibly odd and powerful feeling that something is about to change.

This will last for several minutes and then out of nowhere... BAM! I instantly feel like a child again. It's the strangest phenomena I've ever experienced. I'll start feeling like I'm back in the house that I grew up in, and once I realize that - I'll get this overwhelming feeling of dread. I'll become so scared (again out of nowhere) and literally freeze. I won't be able to move, I feel petrified. This becomes so scary that I start panicking and will think 'I'm about to be attacked.' and will feel so jacked up on my own adrenaline that I have a panic attack.

Every time this had happened, I've taken a benzo and it will usually end the episode before I can actually uncover any memories. I know I need to know what happened. I need to know why I'm so scared all the time. But it's almost like... I don't want to remember... No, I do! But I don't want to have to experience that trauma, so I take the benzo to kill it. I really wonder what would happen if I went through the entire flashback...

Anyways, do you think it would be a good idea (at this point in time) for me to take a psychedelic?

 

[sekio]

Anyways, I also have HPPV like symptoms all the time. I've had them ever since I was born. Visual snow - visual disturbances of all kinds (seeing objects move out of the corner of my eyes, seeing a very bright light out of the corner of my eye, seeing the outlines of faces in patterns, etc). I also have closed-eye hallucinations. When I close my eyes, I see purple blobs moving around, over layed on top of visual static.

All normal stuff. The human visual system is... noisy, to say the best. A lot of perception happens at a much higher, symbolic level rather than looking at the raw pixels, as it were. Phosphenes when you close your eyes are kind of neat. They come and go for me and seem to be much more prominent when I'm very relaxed, smoked cannabis, or about to go to sleep.

Personally I think if you have consistent problems with cannabis being an anxiety/unpleasant hallucination trigger you shouldn't bother with the stuff. It's really not for everyone, and forcing the issue never ends well. There's lots of other drugs out there that don't cause the same irrational anxiety response that cannabis does.

Be sure to moderate your cannabis intake very tightly. Most cannabis these days is fairly potent for someone who doesn't have a tolerance (read: not a daily/weekly smoker) and "a little dab'll do ya".
Taking smaller doses more frequently rather than large doses infrequently is a way to mitigate side effects too.

Repressed memories are generally considered to be pretty much entirely suggestion unless there is evidence to back them up, due to people's propensity to, well, believe what they prefer to be true rather than what is congruent with the evidence. There were a few court cases where this was a rather major issue (c.f. some parents could claim financial gains if their children were abused) However taking benzos every time you have an otherwise irrational panic response is not a healthy instinct... talk with someone and figure it out next time?

Taking psychedelics is always a gamble. In a guided setting, sure. If you're just gonna drop acid and expect enlightenment, that's far more risky. Stick with something you have had a good experience with before, if possible.

 

[TheCuriousOne]

I wouldn't take psychedelics if this "HPPD" is somehow bothering you, your mindset is not positive (not being able to accept your repressed subconsciousness) and you suffer from anxiety. I will guarantee you that your symptoms WILL get worse.

But if you really want to experience psychedelics and want a GOOD trip, just make sure to trip with a very close friend that is helping you to process your thoughts during the trip. Most importantly, have a benzo ready if you feel like the trip is getting too overwhelming. Do not exceed 150 micrograms of LSD/ 2 grams of shrooms.

 

[pmoseman]

I wouldn't take psychedelics if this "HPPD" is somehow bothering you, your mindset is not positive (not being able to accept your repressed subconsciousness) and you suffer from anxiety. I will guarantee you that your symptoms WILL get worse.

But if you really want to experience psychedelics and want a GOOD trip, just make sure to trip with a very close friend that is helping you to process your thoughts during the trip. Most importantly, have a benzo ready if you feel like the trip is getting too overwhelming. Do not exceed 150 micrograms of LSD/ 2 grams of shrooms.

Could it be that this person doesn't have any friends?

To answer your original question, I think it takes years for it to recover.

 

[sekio]

I personally think if you need to have a benzo on hand to use a psychedelic, you aren't properly mentally prepared or something is not right with dose/set/setting. Using even moderate doses of benzos can have a pretty severe impact on the intensity level of your trip, leaving you disappointed.

In an ideal setting you should be able to use your desired psychedelic at a moderate dose level without having massive anxiety, etc. - most psychedelics are actually pretty forgiving compared to cannabis, unless you push the dose.

Having benzos as a psychological crutch is not good for your mind at all. It's no different than needing to drink alcohol when you're stressed - it builds a habitual dependence and lets you run away from your problems rather than confronting them. For real emergencies (you fall down and break your leg and have to go to A&E) having access to some are handy - but they should not, as a rule of thumb, be an escape rope that you use at the first sign of rough waters.

 

[TheCuriousOne]

@SwampFox56
If you have nobody to trip with and you have some sort of anxiety disorder, I would NOT recommend you to mess with psychedelics (especially if Cannabis is too much for you).
The trip could easily overexert you during the peak. Let's pretend you get major anxiety attacks during the peak and there's no one to calm you down. This could lead to more anxiety and HPPD (then everytime you get anxious, you'll also get HPPD symptoms). Take my word, don't do it. Wait till you are in a better mental condition.

I personally think if you need to have a benzo on hand to use a psychedelic, you aren't properly mentally prepared or something is not right with dose/set/setting. Using even moderate doses of benzos can have a pretty severe impact on the intensity level of your trip, leaving you disappointed.

Yes, but you can never be 100% prepared for your first psychedelic trip, because it will be just so mind-blowing. On top of that, people with anxiety should have a benzo on hand if things go wrong. Just the fact that they have it in hand could actually ease the anxiety, without even taking it.

If you can not find any benzos, you can drink a little bit of alcohol (2-3 beers) as well to ease anxiety. This helped me personally.

To answer your original question, I think it takes years for it to recover.

Several years? What if you just smoked cannabis occasionally... would that bring all your symptoms back?

 

[BenzosBudOrBooty]

The longer you go without any psychedelics (WEED INCLUDED) the quicker it will go away. If you stop smoking weed and psychedelics it will go away in a few months for me.

 

[pmoseman]

I would guess you should avoid any stimulants as well.

 

[TheCuriousOne]

Quitting cold turkey on every substance for a few months sound very harsh to me... but for the sake of my fucking eyesight... I will do it :D

Beforehand: I will try out Mescalin in 2 weeks. after that I will abstain for exactly 3 months and I will post in here if it will vanish some time later.

 

[Nicholai]

All that visual shit actually lasted a few years for me(even while not smoking weed, which did indeed make it worse.). I was eating way more acid and other drugs than what you describe, though. For a while there, I was tripped, or rolling, or K'd out at least once or twice a week.

BTW SSRIs seem to make the symptoms of what you describe worse, as well.

 

[pupnik]

it lasts longer when people are fascinated with it.
being appalled or horrified is equivalent to being fascinated.
if you relax and are aware of it but not moved either way, then it will fade most naturally.

 

[TheCuriousOne]

it lasts longer when people are fascinated with it.
being appalled or horrified is equivalent to being fascinated.
if you relax and are aware of it but not moved either way, then it will fade most naturally.

Yes! Very important. Integrating it into your life rather than fighting it will make it vanish after some time ime.

But I think there's a certain level of HPPD you should not cross. Having full blown hallucinations which completely interrupt the everyday life. Compared to the "real" HPPD I only have mild HPPD symptoms as described above. Tbh, it's sort of mild to moderate but nothing severe.

I think tripping too often on many synthetic substances and combinations within little time intervals might just induce this severe HPPD (which I'm scared of), that might stay with you for life and never going away.

Lucky me, I haven't crossed that line and I only have milder symptoms as what someone with diagnosed HPPD would have, so 3-4 months of complete abstinence should cut it right away for me at least.

How long should I space out my trips to avoid this actually?
Would smoking cannabis really bring me back to square one?

 

[sekio]

How long should I space out my trips to avoid this actually?
Would smoking cannabis really bring me back to square one?

It's too highly variable between people, nobody can say until you try.

 

[Lightning-Nl]

I personally think if you need to have a benzo on hand to use a psychedelic, you aren't properly mentally prepared or something is not right with dose/set/setting. Using even moderate doses of benzos can have a pretty severe impact on the intensity level of your trip, leaving you disappointed.

In an ideal setting you should be able to use your desired psychedelic at a moderate dose level without having massive anxiety, etc. - most psychedelics are actually pretty forgiving compared to cannabis, unless you push the dose.

Having benzos as a psychological crutch is not good for your mind at all. It's no different than needing to drink alcohol when you're stressed - it builds a habitual dependence and lets you run away from your problems rather than confronting them. For real emergencies (you fall down and break your leg and have to go to A&E) having access to some are handy - but they should not, as a rule of thumb, be an escape rope that you use at the first sign of rough waters.

If feeling like I'm about to go insane, about to have a panic attack, or that I'm manic - are those not emergencies?

Because those were exactly the reasons when/why I would take my benzos. Also, Ethanol has many more actions around the body than just being a GABA pam. It's also an NMDA antagonist, glycine antagonist, adenosine reuptake inhibitor and Ganglionic nAChR agonist. It's also a prodrug for a potent and very neurotoxic DA reuptake inhibitor (Acetaldehyde). You really can't compare benzos to ethanol.

However, I took them too often (because my panic attacks happen too often) and with Lorazepam being especially addictive (physically), I began having severe migraines once I wouldn't have taken a benzo after 16ish hours.

The solution? Take another Ativan. That's why they moved me to Klonopin twice a day (once in the morning. Once at night (with Temazepam). I really like the lack of any anxiety (this excludes normal anxiety - which I still get, but normal anxieties for me would turn into full blown panic attacks the majority of the time) and it's also working pretty good for social anxiety. They moved me to Klonopin because I was having panic attacks (not kidding) about everything. Personal, I believe that's a legitimate reason to be on a benzo full-time.

Downside? Klonopin is incredibly physically addictive (due to its 50+ hour half-life). Klonopin has severely degraded my motivation. I can't seem to do the things I want to do anymore. And it severely offsets the focus and motivation enhancing effects of Adderall. But it's working. And that's what matters at the moment.

I made a plan with my doctor to taper off the Temazepam in a couple months. Next month I'm bumping down to 15MG's a night. Then 7.5MG's then none. I like that plan tbh. While Temazepam is awesome and is the only benzo that I've ever taken that gives me any sort of euphoria, being on 30 milligrams + 2 milligrams of Klonopin a day is an extremely high dose of benzos. And the longer I wait - the harder it will be to stop.

 

[Lightning-Nl]

Also, my weed usage was just an average. I only ever buy weed once every... 4-5 months or so. I'll only get a gram and smoke it all in about 4 days.

I rarely use weed. For that exact reason - it's exacerbates... everything. My HPPV-like symptoms, my anxiety, my depression, etc. Just every once in a while, I'll get this urge to get really fucked up. And weed is the best drug I've ever tried for getting you very high.

Also. Just a couple days ago, I had the unique opportunity to take one of those brand new CBD only pills? Anyways, it was by far the best anxiolytic and antidepressant I've ever had. Better than stimulants for depression, better than benzos for anxiety and it gave me no high at all. I didn't feel euphoric (perse) but rather... Just very relaxed. But it was a very different kind of relaxation. Benzos make you feel very relaxed, but then you're tired as shit. Stimulants makes you feel much less depressed but make you feel jacked up. CBD was a combination of both without any if the side-effects of the other.

Whenever it is CBD becomes prescribable - I'm definitely going to switch off benzos in favor of CBD.