less is more.....

Oh yeah, I agree completely, I am in no way wanting to justify the behavior of someone who actively promotes the uninformed use of mass quantities of any kind of drug, esp to people who are being initiated into the scene. Thats more of a question of personal responsibility than anything else.
Im not venerating the "the more the better" philosophy either, but I totally feel the need to stand up for people who ARE informed and decide to take more than 1 or 2 pills. Esp since most of the postings here jumped on the bandwagon
smile.gif
You seem to be a very thoughtful and considering person to me from all your postings, and Im not suggesting you're a rave nazi at all(hahaha!), but in all honesty, dont you sometimes see stuff posted that seems a little "my way or the highway"? I think "open-minded" is a phrase we use a lot when we talk about taking these mind-altering substances, they are going to widen our horizons, expand us as humans...but we end up being as small as we ever were before them when we decide whats good or bad for others based entirely upon what we have found to be good for ourselves.
BTW, yes, I am a nightmare of a conservative liberal
smile.gif

------------------
"For goodness sakes, would you look at those cakes?"
 
Soulwatcher, Rob, BayRollerSF, very good vibes from you, liquidocean always thought provoking.
I am jumping in here a little late but there are some things I would like to voice. There are some very profound messages here. For me E is a very spiritual experience, it helps me break down the barriers that myself and society has placed on me. To share my E trips with people is very special to me, sharing a part of your soul should only be with those who you feel are worthy of it, because it is a great gift to share someone’s energy.
My doses vary depending on what I am seeking, if hanging out with close friends, one hit is beautiful. If with that special someone that helps my soul, I typically dose a little higher, two hits. Different doses for different energy levels. I am not to the point in my life that I have figured out the toggle switch, to really help the energy along, so sometimes I need some higher doses, a little stronger catalyst to help me to those higher states.
I always find that music and dance, are the easiest ways that I gain higher energy levels. Both are pure energy and an easy way to sync in with the surrounding energy, usually I do this in my living room, where I am comfortable, alone or with 1 or 2 close friends and just let it go. Not always on E either, though I think most people prefer it, but I have an amazing experience doing it on shrooms, and a life changing experience on a hit of acid. Not many visuals, I always refer to it as my trip within a trip, but actually a chance to ride the cosmic train of energy.
And nothing so raw, so pure, and energy enhancing as sex. Not just with anybody(that is for me, may be different for others) but with the one I vibe so well with. Clarity prevails and the world is blown apart. A true shamanic experience!
Thanks for letting me share a few of my thoughts and for really giving me a good thought to go from, it has really got me going, thanks.
nexusflip
 
[too tired to put effort into intelligent remarks]
i WOULD like to give respect to PaRaDoX's post... he makes a good point.. and it's that people will abuse anything.
it's along the same lines that:
some people only work enough to stay alive... and enjoy the rest of their time how they see fit.
other people work nonstop and complicate their lives to find meaning.
you just have to accept that some people accept simplicity and others insist on complication. there will always be those who take it easy and those who don't.
um.
uh.
i hope that made sense... that there was some connection there.
um.
im goin to bed.
*whew*
-matt
 
Wow,
I've been away from Bluelight for a few days after an awesome Xperience 2/6 and I've got to say that posts like this just leave me thinking and grinning from ear to ear...so much thought, wisdom, wit and compassion...
Thank you LiquidOcean for starting this thread and thanks to EVERYONE for thoughtful comments. I rolled with a friend at MASS on Sunday...his first time in 4 months and my usual once/twice a month excursion. After about 2 hours, I reached into my pocket for a boost and he grabbed my hand, and told me:
"You don't really need it; look into my eyes and feel the energy that flows between us...It will carry you wherever you want to go" ...He was SO right...I looked through his eyes right into his soul and the rest of the room disappeared. Another hour went by before I came up for air...
And it reminded me of why LESS can be MORE and why I still cherish the E experience...Used in moderation, it helps remind us our capacity to love and opens portals to our own souls and the souls of others...
And oh yeah, great sex later, all the more meaningful because of our shared journey
smile.gif

Liquid, I'm usually rolling at the gay clubs. I haven't been to many mixed events in the city, mostly because I don't know anyone to show me the scene, but I am very curious.
Any suggestions?
PLUR to all who know how to love
---------------------------------------------
Sometimes you can see THE LIGHT
In the STRANGEST of PLACES
If you look at it RIGHT
smile.gif

---------------------------------------------
 
As a fairly new roller on the scene I must say this is a very helpful topic. I've been rollin since august(about once a month) and I found a few of those times, one pill didn't do a damn thing. I was pretty pissed when I went to a rave and got tired early. so after a couple more months I decided to drop 2. The first one actually hit me, so I popped the second, MAN, I've never felt this before. I'm guessing that I had bunk pills before because this time, only one got me up. It actually scared me a little because I didn't have the control I'd had before.
Since that night, I've skipped the last two raves all my friends went to. Now I find myself looking forward to rolling much more, it makes it more special, kinda like a treat for being good.
I also think there might be an issue of people you're with, not wanting them to do to much. This is also somewhat of a selfish reason, but when I'm ravin, I want my friends to be rollin hard as hell but not so hard that they're just dazing around. I want to be able to look at them and say this kicks ass! I want them to reply hell ya!, not just a meloncholy nod. I don't know, maybe it's selfish, but I want to have fun with my friends, not just dance around in a dazed frenzy.
------------------
"Reality is just an Illusion caused by a lack of mind altering substances."
 
mmm... how much would I love to be the kind of person that has an inner peace and finds the same beauty in nature as they do in love. I would give anything to feel atune with everything around me and live in tranquility. However, unfortunately for me, I'm not one of those kinds of people.
So... I have to depend on that which is artificial in order to achieve my desired mindset. For me, it's not about amount, it's about whatever it takes to make me feel happy.
I do agree with you though, less IS more. And I almost always take just one pill (1/2 doesn't do it for me) but sometimes I'll take another 1/2 or another pill because I feel neglected by the e. And if I notice myself having relapses of these feelings then it is time for me to take a break. I just listen to my body.
I don't take any drug that I feel would rule me instead of me ruling the drug. I wont take anything I don't want to get myself into, knowing the repercussions. (unfortunately though, I have accepted smoking) And I trust myself enough to make that decision. But I think that is a choice everyone has to make for themselves.
moderation is the key - but to what? for whom? it might be for me, but you have to respect someone's right to chose. Hey - s long as it's personal - it's their own lives they're fucking with.
 
Education is the key. As an older raver (23), I am constantly struck by the exorbitant drug intake of many members of our scene. Mostly younger kids, although I have lately witnessed more older yuppie types overdoing it as yuppies were famed for doing with coke back in the 1980s. Younger kids usually lack the awareness and common sense to make rational judgments that weigh the risk/benefits of their activities. Often this is because they are not aware of the serious mental and physical consequences of drug abuse. I was hanging out with a 19 year old kid who initially struck me as rather mature; I quickly realized that he was overdoing it with E. I tried to avoid preaching, but I told him that he was going to build up a tolerance and risk damaging his brain. I shared the fact that I roll infrequently (every 6 weeks at most) and usually only take one unless the pill happens to be especially weak. Once the person has the information, it is their decision, and I commend organizations like Dancesafe and the founders of this board for putting the information out there.
 
Why has no one mentioned the fact that if you take half an E and wait an hour before taking the other half, you will get higher and for a longer period of time, than if you just did the whole pill all at once. (this also works with LSD, mushrooms & mescaline)
Thus, LESS IS MORE.
Otherwise there isn't much I can contribute to this thread because most of it has already been said. I'm 26 and only dose rarely (3 times a year)and the only time I did two pills at once, I found myself TOO HIGH (and I only did 2 because I was told they were weak). I also find that since I've begun spreading the times I dose apart by at least 4 months, that each time is just as intense as the last time, (and my first time too!- if I'm careful about the setting) I've never understood those who need a lot of drugs to get them to where they want to go, but its their choice, not mine. I do agree that I worry about the kids doing so much that they'll burn out by age 17, but I know its unlikely anyone that age is going to listen to an older person anyway, so I just keep my mouth shut unless I'm asked.
I see no point in dosing at parties/clubs anymore unless its something insanley special like seeing Kevin Yost on valentines day with my GF. I'm part of the 'stamina massive' though, so extra energy was never the reason I did E in the first place. Besides, the runners high (which you can get from dancing for a long time) feels *amazing* and very close to an MDMA/crystal buzz.
peace n' respect
a rather sketchified 009 <---not enough sleep
 
Just a few things:
To the person who said that tolerance doesn't seem to ever go away...yes it does. Your comment just means you personally are not taking long enough breaks from rolling in order for your tolerance to go away.
The entire issue of "more": Again, I cannot stress enough...WHY people take drugs is much more important than how much or what they take.
With certain substances some people's metabolism/blood pressure/body weights, etc require HIGHER doses than an "average" person in order to get the same effect. For example, I need 2 pills to roll really hard, even if the dose per pill is high. It's just the way my body is. Same with prescription pills. Compared to other friends and family, my prescription strengths tend to be 200-300mg stronger per dose than theirs because of my weight/metabolism.
I also don't roll much, however, so if and when I do, I don't worry about taking a high dose because I know it will be a few months until I choose to roll again.
Liquid: don't feel sad seeing kids going crazy...they think they know everything and you can't tell them anything. We were that way when we were young, and all you can really do is be there to catch them when they fall. I agree, it's very upsetting to witness, but then, it's not your responsibility to raise them. You can provide a positive role model for them and hope they'll follow through.
So...who's worse? The person who takes like 3-4 pills per roll but only rolls 4 or 5 times a year or the etards who roll every weekend for 3 years? It's all about perspective...but even more important is causation. I think kids who roll every weekend are just chasing a high...and that leads to abuse.
Again, I think drugs should not even be allowed until you're 21 or older....by then you'd be able to fully appreciate what you're doing and WHY you choose to do it.
Remember...you can change nobody except yourself. Make informed choices, share knowledge with others and hope that they will learn before they make mistakes and hurt themselves.
Jim
 
OK... Just so you know where I'm coming from... When I am at a party, I generally drop 3-4 pills in the course of the night. This is enough for me to roll hard while I'm dancing/running around the party. When my friends and I get together to roll together, my normal dose is 6-7 pills. It all depends on what I plan to be doing... In either case, the size of my dose is of NO MEANING WHATSOEVER!!! I don't think I'm "tough" because I eat alot of pills... I thank god I can buy rolls cheap so it doesn't cost me an arm and a leg to get high. I wish I could roll the way I want to off of one or two pills, but it just doesn't work that way for me...
Dosage is not a status symbol... Whether a high or low dose... Maybe some of us like to roll harder than others. What's wrong with that?
------------------
PLUR
Tig
*****************************************************************
Rip Krew in da house! WORD UP!!!
*****************************************************************
Peace Out to my ERF Krew!
*****************************************************************
Binkies are way functional, they're kewl, and they're cute!
THEY ARE *NOT* LAME!!! grrrrr... = P
 
I agree with the less is more concept but it is just not applicable to everyone. My last 5 rolls have been 1-2 good pills and lasted under an hour. Obviously I have built a high tolerance which sucks because I am wasting large amounts of money and not achieved the level of highness that I would like.
I am one of those people who needs to take more only because of my tolerance. I would love to take 1/2 a pill and roll balls all night long but it just doesnt happen. Even 60 pills of 5-HTP between my last 2 rolls didnt make much of a difference...
Fucking tolerance sucks..
Skipp-E
 
Since my toleration is very low, i don't worry. I've learned my limit and only do as much as my body needs which a max of 2pills. Always know your bodies limitations and don't do more than you can handle.Set boundaries and limitations for yourself and know when to say Enough is Enough.
*~*angie*~*
ps: my 2 cents
[This message has been edited by raverbunnie79 (edited 10 April 2000).]
[This message has been edited by raverbunnie79 (edited 10 April 2000).]
[This message has been edited by raverbunnie79 (edited 24 May 2000).]
 
I think its best to use the minimum amount of any substance to get the desired result. I took 1 1/2 at once Saturday, and I definitely like the feeling of just one good pill more, followed by 1/2 about an hour into the peak. This method seems to make the roll last longer. It is a better more controlled feeling also. I wanted to experiment by taking it all at once this weekend, and I found that I felt less in control. I was "floored" , and wished I had taken only 1 to start. To top it off, the roll was so intense, it ended rather abruptly after 3 hours. It was as if all my seratonin was flooded and gone by the intensity of the peak, instead of a nice 5 hour controlled roll with the 1 and then 1/2 an hour later method. Anyone else feel like this?
 
Hey liquidocean!!!! This is the exact thread I was talking about when I was asking where it could be found!!! Awesome!
smile.gif
 
thank you diva and bunnie, i didn't know anyone was looking for it, i just know it's a good inspiration.
it's fascist to dictate what people can and can't do, but it's caring to advise people on what they should do. something like dosing MDMA has a significant drop-off in effects at a certain dosage (i'm guessing 160mg+), and that if a whole scene develops a tolerance, then it's very easy for something like speed or meth or coke to come in and drag it down.
If you don't believe you could get euphoric off of 1.5 hits, give yourself a 2-3 week break and try it. You'll save money, enjoy yourself, be gentle on your body, and get more out of the experience.
Actually, jrEwing, i like taking .5 pill followed by 1 pill, as well as 1 pill followed by .5 pill. If i get there early, i do the first, if i get there late, i do the second.
If you believe you need MDMA to have a good time, or that more MDMA will necessarily make you feel better, it's really gonna put a damper on your vibe.
Sometimes its fun to be spontaneous, and sometimes its fun to explore different spaces under different influences, but our bodies, minds, and souls are like bank accounts, they earn interest, and the more you deposit, the more you can withdraw.
Keep adding thoughts, thanks to all that have added to this and to those that have taken away some wisdom from this. Peace.
------------------
[email protected]
[This message has been edited by liquidocean (edited 11 April 2000).]
 
i just found this by searching for some of liquidocean's powerful words...
i hope more of us take the time to read this post...
my best and most powerful roll was off one pill (it wasn't even one of my first rolls), and my best acid trip was off 1/2 hit of blotter. i prefer to roll at home or with friends outside of a rave than to roll at a rave....i definitely see the spiritual side of the drug, and i get so much out of it, especially combined with acid. for me, mdma stirs up questions in my mind, which are answered with the aid of lsd. although, i have noticed increasingly that i have more "advanced" or more worldly thoughts sober than ever in the past....mdma and lsd have definitely opened my mind in ways that i never could have imagined. i rarely do drugs JUST for "fun"....sure i always have a wonderful time when i am under the influence, but i love my life all the time, sober or not.
well that's just my little input....i didn't have much of public interest to say, but i wanted to bump this thread so more people could be exposed to such an important concept
smile.gif
once again liquidocean, thank you
smile.gif

love and light
jen
------------------
"Once you are real you can't be ugly except to people who don't understand."-The Velveteen Rabbit
"....she finds God when she's dancing..."
 
bump....more people should read this....i'm also interested in hearing other's opinions
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top