Less anxiety since stopping opioids?

[Abyssos]

I am dependent on Klonopin. I used to take up to 5mg for 16 months and started tapering in August. I am now down to 0.15mg and I have days where I feel normal for a few hours but most days are horrible. Anxiety, derealization, depersonalization, visual snow, tinnitus, neck and chest tightness.

In October I started to take Oxycodone again which I used in the past aswell. I used it to battle the Klonopin induced fatigue and depression. It helped a ton for many months but the longer I took it the more anxious I became. Normally it made me euphoric, calm, optimistic. But the lower I got with the Klonopin dosage, the worse I felt taking Oxycodone. After taking it, my heart rate goes up, I get jaw, chest and neck pain because my muscles tighten up and I feel pretty anxious. That's why I quitted it. I was up to 160mg Oxycodone a day. I got off Oxycodone with Subutex. After I tapered down to 0.5mg Subutex because it gave me a weird "foggy/disconnected" anxiety, I switched to Kratom for a week. Kratom caused alot of anxiety aswell so I took my last dosage of 3g 40h ago. I only needed Kratom because the restless legs from the Subutex withdrawal are horrible even with Clonidine and Lyrica at night which I both take since a week. But I will stop those two meds this week aswell as I don't like the idea of becoming dependent on it.

Anyways, I still experience chills and strong restlessness from the opiate/Kratom withdrawal. However, my anxiety is much less since stopping opiates. It is still strong due to benzo withdrawal but nowhere as bad.

The reason I got dependent on Klonopin was that I suffered from weird brain zaps, the sudden oneset of visual snow and a panic attack after a few sleepless nights due to stress with my job. I freaked out because I didn't know what those brain zaps were. I was on a moderate dose of Oxycodone back then but I didn't suffer noticable withdrawal when I quitted earlier. I remember that I had depersonalization a few months before this happened already which always lessened when I took a break from Oxycodone. My depersonalization is probably the cause of the chronic opioid usage and cannabis which I have abused for pain back then. That day, the sleep deprivation, the Oxycodone feeling and the weird visual snow threw me into a full-blown panic attack and I ended up on Klonopin. I showed all signs of high glutamate and low GABA. Sensory overload, muscle tightness, hyperventilation, tinnitus, visual snow etc. I couldn't take Oxycodone anymore because it always made me panic back then. The benzodiazepines helped alot the first weeks but I needed to increase the dosage and started to get a different kind of anxiety from Klonopin and immense brain fog. Also worse visual static and a messed up fight or flight response.

Because the benzodiazepines caused horrible symptoms themselves, I started tapering in August and got pretty far.

I took Memantine for a long time during the taper but even with slow dosage increase, I had a disconnected feeling and stopped after 4 months on it. Everything looked a little bit zoomed away on it.

I tried DLPA for my opioid withdrawal and always get anxious on it. Same with Bacopa and Tyrosine. I don't tolerate coffee aswell. Anything that stimulates me makes me anxious. This wasn't the case before my benzo addiction. Now I only take Baclofen ocassionally to treat the muscle tightness and BPC 157 in hope to repair my GABAergic system. Also Ultra Low Dose Naltrexone.

What I am wondering:

Why did my reaction to Oxycodone change within such a small timeframe? It helped alot with the Klonopin withdrawal at the beginning but suddenly itself caused anxiety. Same with every other opioid. Hydromorphone, Subutex, Tilidine aswell. Even Kratom. Is it due to benzo withdrawal? I have read that opioids inhibit GABA indirectly which may be the cause.

When will I be able to take a higher dose of Naltrexone? I took my last dosage of Subutex 8 days ago and the last Kratom dosage 40h ago. I only took 3g Kratom a day to help a little with the RLS.

 

[pally pete]

You've got a lot going on in your head, and you take a shed load of different drugs.

I know personally, when Benzos & Opiates are not such a feature in my life, my anxiety/ depression decreases, but when I up the doses/start to abuse, my anxiety/depression etc go through the roof. It's f***ing awful. I have days where I literally feel like the world is going to end,I feel totally detached from friends/famly, and I'll being in tears.

I'm sorry I can't answer your questions. But I can empathise with you.

Well done on the Benzo withdrawal btw. I started my taper back in August also, began at 28 mg Diazepam, I'm now at 9 mg and just started taking Fluoxetine (Prozac) today, and been put on a waiting list for CBT..

OOD LUCK

 

[Abyssos]

Thanks for your reply. You share the same problem like me. I also feel completly detached from my family and it makes me go insane. I hope it will be over after I have fought the opioid PAWS and the benzo dependence. Congratulations on your taper aswell! What symptoms are you suffering from during this process? Keep going.

 

[Abyssos]

Last dosage of Subutex: 9 days ago
Last dosage of Kratom: 60h ago

Q: Can I start Low Dose Naltrexone? Or will I Run into trouble this early?


I have a symptom that makes me lose it:
A feeling inside my chest and back like an alien wants to jump out of me. It makes me move the whole night!! It feels like RLS but in my back between the shoulder blades and the chest. A deep, achy, jumpy feeling. Clonidine doesn't get rid of it. Not even Lyrica. Is this feeling normal and when does it go away?

I don't have any cravings but not being able to sleep while being in benzo withdrawal aswell is killing me. Seriously. I need advise. I don't want to get back in opioids but my anxiety is through the roof from insomnia. Nothing can put me to sleep.


Help...

 

[adder]

When I quit benzodiazepines, I was one year into buprenorphine maintenance. I took them daily for 9 years, with the last 6 years on 6mg of clonazepam a day and dose reduction from 2mg or 4 mg to zero in the last year, my dose was heavily reduced when I started buprenorphine. I found that buprenorphine helped very very little with benzodiazepine withdrawal, it only helped a little bit with the anxiety and nervousness but it just took the edge off it, did not touch restlessness in all parts of my body at all. When I was at 0.5mg of clonazepam, I switched to 15 mg of clorazepate and took it for a week or so before quitting. If you are at 0.15 mg of clonazepam and have no signs of risk of seizures, then I suggest you stop taking it altogether, this is really too low of a dose to make a difference and right now you're probably only making it worse by taking it, as dependence on benzodiazepines progresses and tolerance raises, benzodiazepine receptors change and don't work properly in the agonist conformation, hence at times people lose effectiveness of their benzodiazepines completely no matter what the dose. At this point there is really no better way other than to ride this out, it took me around a month to feel physically better, of course restlessness continued but it was bearable.

If you still can, then I suggest you go back on buprenorphine, going through both opioid and benzodiazepine withdrawal at the same time is definitely going to be hellish. I would definitely steer clear of naltrexone at this point. I also don't think your doing yourself a favour by taking baclofen, it works on GABA-B receptors which are different from GABA-A receptors which are modulated by benzodiazepines via benzodiazepine receptors, but overall secondary effects from baclofen eventually will make your withdrawal worse. I suffered from some relatively mild withdrawal-like symptoms after taking 10mg of baclofen for a few days straight 3 years after quitting benzodiazepines.

 

[keeping]

I have a symptom that makes me lose it:
A feeling inside my chest and back like an alien wants to jump out of me. It makes me move the whole night!! It feels like RLS but in my back between the shoulder blades and the chest. A deep, achy, jumpy feeling. Clonidine doesn't get rid of it. Not even Lyrica. Is this feeling normal and when does it go away?

sounds like akathisia
and if it is you have my sympathies - used to drive me insane when i was on SSRIs and benzos
seems like a contrived solution but i think the best bet at a cessation of symptoms may be to stop taking so many narcotics?

 

[Abyssos]

Thank you very much for your answers. Shall I quit Baclofen right away, too? I took 10mg a day for three months. I don't feel missing a dosage so I will so a rapid taper, like 10 - 7.5 - 5 - 2.5 - 0 over the next five days. That's ok?

I am anxious going back on any opioid. The stimulation they give me increase my anxiety. Subutex makes me foggy, dysphoric and anxious. And Oxycodone causes overstimulation.

Akathisia - is it due to benzo or opioid withdrawal? I never had RLS or this jumping feeling before I quitted opioids. Not once during my benzo taper. If it's from opioid withdrawal, when can I expect it to go away?

 

[keeping]

akathisia is more commonly associated with benzo withdrawal but it can come from lots of things - even from baclofen
its a horrible feeling of inner restlessness right? like you're compelled to be in constant motion?
mine went away a week or so after i stopped taking my anti-depressants and benzos, but ymmv

i would suggest trying to get off so many meds
goodluck tho man

 

[Abyssos]

Exactly. I have to move my body to feel a few seconds relief. It's an inner, jumpy feeling. I will keep updates here. I hope I will make it...

 

[keeping]

yeah sorry sounds like you got it man, horrible shit to go through
try doing a little googling and see if there's anything you might be doing that you could change to alleviate it?
withdrawing too quickly can be a culprit - as can longterm benzo/antipsychotic use
hope it clears up soon

 

[Abyssos]

Following problem.

I still have RLS so I take 1mg (yes, that's right!) of Oxycodone at night and the RLS is gone for 24 hours. I don't have withdrawal during the day but at night my RLS starts after I slept for one hour.

Is it possible to slowly decrease the evening dose to zero so my body can adjust? This evening I plan taking 0.75mg.