• N&PD Moderators: Skorpio | thegreenhand

Lemon Balm (Melissa officinalis) Is An Anxiolytic, Hypnotic Antidepressant

Self-medication of any kind can be dangerous, but IMO it is better to provide people with milder herbal options before you start charging into the hardcore pharmaceuticals.

There are worse things you could do than treat yourself with a 10-20x extract of Melissa spp. for a few days to see if it makes you sleep better. At least there is some modicum of evidence that it may be effective.

Given that the first line defence is going to either be a SNRI, trazodone-type drug, or benzodiazepine, a mentha family herb seems almost quaintly old-fashioned.
 
It encourages people to self medicate on the basis of studies like the one above and hearsay etc

That's what people SHOULD do, is self-medicate. There's no reason for the authoritarian approach we have now with doctors and prescriptions and all that horseshit.
 
That's what people SHOULD do, is self-medicate. There's no reason for the authoritarian approach we have now with doctors and prescriptions and all that horseshit.

QFmotherfuckinT

further, our current approach isn't inherently better than trial/error. for some many(most?) folk it sure may be, but for many self medication > dr.'s.
 
Let me try this on desktop. The Cloudflare "Checking your browser..." security check won't let me post on mobile. :(

Just thought I'd post an anecdote about Lemon Balm Extract. I suffer from mild social anxiety and have benefited greatly from phenibut but being very concerned about dependence and tolerance I only use it once a week. I saw another post where a guy took basically a whole bottle of lemon balm extract and reported no ill-effects. The nootropic site I order phenibut has a new LBE product and highly tout its anxiolytic effects so I decided to give it a try.

Got the product, tested one 600mg capsule. Nothing. Next morning was perfect for a test as I was in a situation that normally causes me much anxiety (being around family that I don't enjoy spending time with but it's important that I act like I do).

I took 3g of the "cyracos" LBE and noticed absolutely nothing at all for the better or worse. Next I'm going to wait until another such situation and try 5g and will report back.
 
I haven't evaluated it for synergistic effects, but IIRC Melissa does have some effects on GABA-transaminase inhibition, as well as on neuronal nicotinic ACh receptors.

As for valerian, IMO one would need to use a LOT for an excessive time, to wind up in trouble in terms of GABAa receptors. I find that it produces a natural, although extremely rapid tachyphylaxis. I tend to use it only occasionally, but when I do, a couple of boxes of high dose extract tablets, for its powerful oneirogenic effects. To this effect at least, it becomes near impossible to do so three nights in a row (or days for those who sleep during the daytime usually), night 1-full effects, night/sleep period 2 in a row, very much weakened. Night/sleep cycle 3 in a row, tachyphylaxis to the effect has set in and its almost impossible to push past. Wonderful herb, even if it does smell like somebody soaked a pair of old gym socks in pentanoic and propionic acid then shit out a swallowed vomit smoothie into said old sweaty sock, before farting into it a few times, following through a bit.

I would be somewhat impressed if a man could physically manage to swallow abusive level doses for long at all without coughing up their spleen in a chunky butyric acid flavoured soup afterwards. Valerian stinks like Theresa May's policies, and is about as pleasant as her face is fuck ugly.

For Melissa, its best grown and use fresh picked. I find its lovely used to make a cup of lady grey tea, with a bit of grated lime zest, using a hot infusion made from several handfuls of freshly picked flowering young balm tops, a little splash of lime juice, and used to make the tea, lady grey having a lovely citrusy flavour, and it helps calm the caffeine edge.

I'm not best to evaluate the GABA-T inhibition of balm vodka though, I take chlormethiazole, and sometimes nitrazepam with it, plus opiods, so alcohol has a great deal of potentiation and synergism from the chlormethiazole, its one to be fucking careful with alcohol, especially taking benzos like nitraz.

But I can tell you one thing-It IS fucking tasty stuff, some great quality vodka distilled from the herb, it makes a most admirable liquor, especially with a few drops of diethyl ether equivalent added to a bottle so that much would be in every shot. Distill the vodka from the chopped, bruised balm with a little ether in it, then add a little more EtOEt to the distillate, gives it a lovely sweetness. Some added flavour can be given by adding fresh lime peels, bruised, and a little lemon slice and lime slice during the distillation.

I'd like to experiment more with herb and fruit blends during the distillation stage. Let it sit and stew for several days in the bottle, with the little bit of diethyl ether, THEN distill, after the flavours have all percolated into the vodka, adding a bit more ether for flavour after. Makes it lovely and sweet and aromatic, heady.

GRRR, this fucking cloudflare shite, its making it REALLY difficult to post and especially to PM.
 
I haven't evaluated it for synergistic effects, but IIRC Melissa does have some effects on GABA-transaminase inhibition, as well as on neuronal nicotinic ACh receptors.

As for valerian, IMO one would need to use a LOT for an excessive time, to wind up in trouble in terms of GABAa receptors. I find that it produces a natural, although extremely rapid tachyphylaxis. I tend to use it only occasionally, but when I do, a couple of boxes of high dose extract tablets, for its powerful oneirogenic effects. To this effect at least, it becomes near impossible to do so three nights in a row (or days for those who sleep during the daytime usually), night 1-full effects, night/sleep period 2 in a row, very much weakened. Night/sleep cycle 3 in a row, tachyphylaxis to the effect has set in and its almost impossible to push past. Wonderful herb, even if it does smell like somebody soaked a pair of old gym socks in pentanoic and propionic acid then shit out a swallowed vomit smoothie into said old sweaty sock, before farting into it a few times, following through a bit.

I would be somewhat impressed if a man could physically manage to swallow abusive level doses for long at all without coughing up their spleen in a chunky butyric acid flavoured soup afterwards. Valerian stinks like Theresa May's policies, and is about as pleasant as her face is fuck ugly.

For Melissa, its best grown and use fresh picked. I find its lovely used to make a cup of lady grey tea, with a bit of grated lime zest, using a hot infusion made from several handfuls of freshly picked flowering young balm tops, a little splash of lime juice, and used to make the tea, lady grey having a lovely citrusy flavour, and it helps calm the caffeine edge.

I'm not best to evaluate the GABA-T inhibition of balm vodka though, I take chlormethiazole, and sometimes nitrazepam with it, plus opiods, so alcohol has a great deal of potentiation and synergism from the chlormethiazole, its one to be fucking careful with alcohol, especially taking benzos like nitraz.

But I can tell you one thing-It IS fucking tasty stuff, some great quality vodka distilled from the herb, it makes a most admirable liquor, especially with a few drops of diethyl ether equivalent added to a bottle so that much would be in every shot. Distill the vodka from the chopped, bruised balm with a little ether in it, then add a little more EtOEt to the distillate, gives it a lovely sweetness. Some added flavour can be given by adding fresh lime peels, bruised, and a little lemon slice and lime slice during the distillation.

I'd like to experiment more with herb and fruit blends during the distillation stage. Let it sit and stew for several days in the bottle, with the little bit of diethyl ether, THEN distill, after the flavours have all percolated into the vodka, adding a bit more ether for flavour after. Makes it lovely and sweet and aromatic, heady.

GRRR, this fucking cloudflare shite, its making it REALLY difficult to post and especially to PM.

I keep getting posts erased. Drives me in-fuckin-sane when a long post disappears.

I LOL'ed at your post.
 
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Why, whats funny?

And I've been taking to copying posts to clipboard before trying to post or PM, because of this noxious cloudflare bollocks.
 
Maybe its funny because someone doesnt feel like ether smells ans tastes good.

Well, for my side i do like diethylether smell. However, everyone around me disagree strongly.
 
Why, whats funny?

And I've been taking to copying posts to clipboard before trying to post or PM, because of this noxious cloudflare bollocks.

This...

even if it does smell like somebody soaked a pair of old gym socks in pentanoic and propionic acid then shit out a swallowed vomit smoothie into said old sweaty sock, before farting into it a few times, following through a bit.

I would be somewhat impressed if a man could physically manage to swallow abusive level doses for long at all without coughing up their spleen in a chunky butyric acid flavoured soup afterwards. Valerian stinks like Theresa May's policies, and is about as pleasant as her face is fuck ugly.
 
Another anecdote on lemon balm extract's anxiolytic effects. (or lack thereof?)

Long story short, today I was forced to spend time with a person who sends my social anxiety off the charts. This guy is a schmoozing bullshit artist who I'm obliged to be polite to. Perfect opportunity to test my new lemon balm extract called cyracos.

As previously posted, I initially took one 600mg tablet (recommended dose). Nothing.

Two days later took five 600mg tablets. Nothing.

Today took eight 600mg tablets for a dose of 4.8g about 90 minutes before meeting Asshole and nothing. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

Zero improvement for mood or anxiety.

At this point, do I toss this shit in the trash, take one per day til they're gone or try taking 12g? My main goal with this stuff is to have a second-string to go to in between my weekly phenibut dose. (2g)
 
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I would be wary of any commercial "extracts", compare the situation with kratom... whole or crushed leaf is going to be the better source of active principles.

Besides lemon balm is cheap and easy to grow.
 
Lol, i just ate 800g of freah leaf (As said, it is very common food ingredient in thailand)
Feeling nothing! Just abit relaxes but it maybe because i like eating aromaric herbs myself.
 
I would be wary of any commercial "extracts", compare the situation with kratom... whole or crushed leaf is going to be the better source of active principles.

Besides lemon balm is cheap and easy to grow.

I love the convenience of extract capsules though. I take bacopa and cordyceps (along with caffeine/theanine, rhodiola, panax ginseng and fish oil) every morning along with yogurt, ginger and turmeric root and get a massive boost in mood and motivation.

Every time I order I try a new nootropic substance and now I can mark this one off the list, unless something unexpected happens and the daily dose accumulates and "works."
 
I just noticed that Lemon Balm is good at masking Kratoms ugly taste. Unfortunately i never noticed any effects when the Lemon Balm is consumed alone.
 
Lol, i just ate 800g of freah leaf (As said, it is very common food ingredient in thailand)
Feeling nothing! Just abit relaxes but it maybe because i like eating aromaric herbs myself.
taking back to life an old thread...
in my case I've used lemon balm in different ways, but mainly oral, and FRESH
it must be fresh, otherwise it barely works, one leaf is not enough,
3-4 leaves minimum are needed to feel an effect, it's quite apparent, not placebo. Has even a bit of euphoria and it's pretty calming. Chewing and keeping the leaves in the mouth for a long time, like with kanna, it's the way I did.
Maybe I was not used to gabaergics (I'm still not I guess, since I don't like benzos) by that time but it worked for me.

I find that skullcap (scutelaria lateriflora) + lemon balm + lemon verbena, makes a great relaxing tea, very very good if the 3 herbs are fresh (easy to grow).
 
taking back to life an old thread...
in my case I've used lemon balm in different ways, but mainly oral, and FRESH
it must be fresh, otherwise it barely works, one leaf is not enough,
3-4 leaves minimum are needed to feel an effect, it's quite apparent, not placebo. Has even a bit of euphoria and it's pretty calming. Chewing and keeping the leaves in the mouth for a long time, like with kanna, it's the way I did.
Maybe I was not used to gabaergics (I'm still not I guess, since I don't like benzos) by that time but it worked for me.

I find that skullcap (scutelaria lateriflora) + lemon balm + lemon verbena, makes a great relaxing tea, very very good if the 3 herbs are fresh (easy to grow).

Quidding and Fresh is definitely the way to go with a lot of psychoactive herbs.

-GC
 
Standardised extracts should be illegal in a modern society, like in the UK they sell 'standardised extracts' of valerian root and St John's Wort, without prescription, it's not a good way to help people.
Why's that? Should people only have access to the plants themselves, with variable levels of active components in them?

If the 'standardised extract' is made in a reproducible way I see no harm.
If one looks in PUBMED, assuming the published things are true.

Most Plant origin medication, often used for centuries, does the same thing as our pharma drugs.

The only difference, often they have benificial (side) effects. instead of side-effects you don't want.
Mulungu/ Erythravine is better then Diazepam or alike at stopping an insult/ seizure. But without the residual grogginess/ addictive nature and cognitive effects.

Passiflora I just read is an excellent anti-epileptic. One I would have like to have tried before they shoved their pharmaceutical's in me. But its also anti-anxiety and sleep improving.

And the list goes on. And dr's they don't give a shit about it if you mention it. Which is so encouging, knowing you are working with morron's.
 
Is self-medication with aromatic plants dangerous?
It’s efficient to treat light insomnia or anecdotal anxiety. People should be able to manage “everyday life troubles” without seeing a physician!
People who experience psychotic breaks from too much cannabis use would say that it is.

As alpha methyl says below, there is documented withdrawal syndrome in people that take large amounts of supplements like Valerian root and kava kava.

It's very rare for an effective anxiolytic that works on the GABA system to not provoke withdrawal upon cessation of use.

My experience with lemon balm is that it is extremely mild, and depending on the tone of your GABAergic system, it may provide significant anxiolysis or very minimal.

As indicated, it is a GABA transaminase inhibitor which means it inhibits the enzyme that breaks down GABA, so gaba remains circulating longer providing a calming effect.
 
If one looks in PUBMED, assuming the published things are true.

Most Plant origin medication, often used for centuries, does the same thing as our pharma drugs.

The only difference, often they have benificial (side) effects. instead of side-effects you don't want.
Mulungu/ Erythravine is better then Diazepam or alike at stopping an insult/ seizure. But without the residual grogginess/ addictive nature and cognitive effects.

Passiflora I just read is an excellent anti-epileptic. One I would have like to have tried before they shoved their pharmaceutical's in me. But its also anti-anxiety and sleep improving.

And the list goes on. And dr's they don't give a shit about it if you mention it. Which is so encouging, knowing you are working with morron's.
When you propose that these botanicals are

"excellent anti-epileptics"

What double blind clinical studies do you use to base your assessment on?

I'm not aware of any well-designed double blinded human clinical studies with rigor concerning passiflora incarnata or any of the other passiflora varietals, nor mulungu/erythravine alkaloids with respect to epilepsy.

I see a few studies concerning rats and induced seizures that may or may not actually be representative of epilepsy.
 
People who experience psychotic breaks from too much cannabis use would say that it is.

As alpha methyl says below, there is documented withdrawal syndrome in people that take large amounts of supplements like Valerian root and kava kava.

It's very rare for an effective anxiolytic that works on the GABA system to not provoke withdrawal upon cessation of use.

My experience with lemon balm is that it is extremely mild, and depending on the tone of your GABAergic system, it may provide significant anxiolysis or very minimal.

As indicated, it is a GABA transaminase inhibitor which means it inhibits the enzyme that breaks down GABA, so gaba remains circulating longer providing a calming effect.
Cannabis is a recreational drug and a medicin, so offcourse their are contra indication's for some. Btw those wd's can, just like placebo effect's excist be, placebo wd. Not disrespecting to the one that had em as the effect's are the same, real or placebo.

For the herb that gave me instant trouble: Ginkgo Biloba extract. My favorit among trees to look at. But taken orally as extract at prescribed dose it consequently gave me blood noses. After a few day's I made the connection and stopped and no more blood. St. Johnswort imo should at least have a warning for interaction's with a.o. Methylphenidate. Alarming all MPH's annoying side effect's were doubled. And it seemed to double the duration, normally its a short acting stim.
 
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