Kratom Kratom and GERD/IBS

[xtcgrrrl]

I took a few capsules of a kratom extract (Hush softgels) and almost immediately had a very familiar sensation - feels like the pain of gastritis. The gurgling, the sour feeling in the pit of your stomach, the acid reflux, ugh all of it. I have been diagnosed with these conditions (GERD and IBS) for a long time, but kratom has never bothered me before, that I’ve noticed. I suspect that RIGHT NOW I have a stomach ulcer and that’s the culprit. But I need to take kratom for an unrelated condition, herniated discs/arthritis. Would plain leaf be better than those gels, which probably were concentrated using something that disagrees with me?

 

[Juicewrldfan]

My wife has IBS and GERD as well. She takes kratom capsules. Usually about 2.1 grams, but she also has fibromyalgia and arthritis pain. It doesn't usually effect her, but they are gluten free so maybe thats why? I dont know if your capsules are gluten free. In my opinion, I think that maybe you should try making into a tea and draining out the powder plant matter and see how that impacts your symptoms. The only thing is if I make a tea like that I usually double my dose because you wont get the same potency that you would get from taking the plant matter in. So, you may have to adjust your dose.

I guess gluten is really bad though for IBS so definitley check to see if your capsules contain any gluten. They probably dont, but some do. Do you have a list of ingredients for your capsules? They use nano technology to absorb faster?

 

[xtcgrrrl]

My wife has IBS and GERD as well. She takes kratom capsules. Usually about 2.1 grams, but she also has fibromyalgia and arthritis pain. It doesn't usually effect her, but they are gluten free so maybe thats why? I dont know if your capsules are gluten free. In my opinion, I think that maybe you should try making into a tea and draining out the powder plant matter and see how that impacts your symptoms. The only thing is if I make a tea like that I usually double my dose because you wont get the same potency that you would get from taking the plant matter in. So, you may have to adjust your dose.

I guess gluten is really bad though for IBS so definitley check to see if your capsules contain any gluten. They probably dont, but some do. Do you have a list of ingredients for your capsules? They use nano technology to absorb faster?

The only ingredients, as far as I can see, are safflower oil and the extract itself

 

[Juicewrldfan]

The only ingredients, as far as I can see, are safflower oil and the extract itself

Hmm...looks like they are vegetable capsules so that shouldn't affect your ibs and safflower seed is a low fodmap food so that shouldn't affect your ibs either. Im not sure. I would try it as a tea with the plant matter drained out, unless you want to give it another shot to see if it was just a fluke.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

Most extracts are highly acidic due to how they're made.

I think I've read gel caps themselves can give people stomach issues(?)

Making tea won't help if you have an ulcer, as mitragynine is poorly soluble in water unless acid is added to ph <4. Need to avoid acid with an ulcer.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Most extracts are highly acidic due to how they're made.

I think I've read gel caps themselves can give people stomach issues(?)

Making tea won't help if you have an ulcer, as mitragynine is poorly soluble in water unless acid is added to ph <4. Need to avoid acid with an ulcer.

Shoot, i forgot to add that part. I add citric acid to min. Good point.

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Most extracts are highly acidic due to how they're made.

I think I've read gel caps themselves can give people stomach issues(?)

Making tea won't help if you have an ulcer, as mitragynine is poorly soluble in water unless acid is added to ph <4. Need to avoid acid with an ulcer.

This is what I was worried about, that extracts themselves are acidic. Thanks, this info was helpful.

 

[CmonYouShouldKnowBetter]

I took a few capsules of a kratom extract (Hush softgels) and almost immediately had a very familiar sensation - feels like the pain of gastritis. The gurgling, the sour feeling in the pit of your stomach, the acid reflux, ugh all of it. I have been diagnosed with these conditions (GERD and IBS) for a long time, but kratom has never bothered me before, that I’ve noticed. I suspect that RIGHT NOW I have a stomach ulcer and that’s the culprit. But I need to take kratom for an unrelated condition, herniated discs/arthritis. Would plain leaf be better than those gels, which probably were concentrated using something that disagrees with me?

Hush is manufactured by OPMS. These shots are infamous for containing all kind of shit including antihistamines. There could be anything in there. Also, what you are describing could be related to the ethanol vs C02 vs whatever they used for extraction

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Hush is manufactured by OPMS. These shots are infamous for containing all kind of shit including antihistamines. There could be anything in there. Also, what you are describing could be related to the ethanol vs C02 vs whatever they used for extraction

There’s no way there could be antihistamines in there since I always get that familiar opioid itchiness from those

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I took a few capsules of a kratom extract (Hush softgels) and almost immediately had a very familiar sensation - feels like the pain of gastritis. The gurgling, the sour feeling in the pit of your stomach, the acid reflux, ugh all of it. I have been diagnosed with these conditions (GERD and IBS) for a long time, but kratom has never bothered me before, that I’ve noticed. I suspect that RIGHT NOW I have a stomach ulcer and that’s the culprit. But I need to take kratom for an unrelated condition, herniated discs/arthritis. Would plain leaf be better than those gels, which probably were concentrated using something that disagrees with me?

So I have bladder cystitis which is basically ulceration of the bladder .

Kratom was the most painful drug I could try. Complete catastrophic pain. I could take all other drugs and not feel pain but Kratom would cause extreme burning. Alcohol and ketamine would cause the pain too….but no other opioid agonist pharma nor illicit would cause issues …but Kratom was like setting a bomb off inside me

It is very nasty nasty stuff. Damages the liver some say and is confirmed to often be full of toxic heavy metals also per the FDA

 

[CmonYouShouldKnowBetter]

There’s no way there could be antihistamines in there since I always get that familiar opioid itchiness from those

That was just one example. Ever notice that the ingredients are never listed on those? Ever seen a compehensive lab test on one? I tested an OPMS for fentanyl one - positive. It may have been counterfeit or it may have been a false positive for some other adulterant but the point is - you dont know whats in there at all. In fact, OPMS is being sued right now!!

 

[Burnt Offerings]

So I have bladder cystitis which is basically ulceration of the bladder .

Kratom was the most painful drug I could try. Complete catastrophic pain. I could take all other drugs and not feel pain but Kratom would cause extreme burning. Alcohol and ketamine would cause the pain too….but no other opioid agonist pharma nor illicit would cause issues …but Kratom was like setting a bomb off inside me

It is very nasty nasty stuff. Damages the liver some say and is confirmed to often be full of toxic heavy metals also per the FDA

The hepatoxic effect seems pretty marginal, a rare occurrence for a small subset of chronic users who experience a full recovery upon abstinence.

Kratom - LiverTox - NCBI Bookshelf

I also found this part interesting, regarding the FDA:

“The US FDA and the Drug Enforcement Agency have put out notices of concern about use of kratom as a dietary supplement because of safety issues, including adverse effects of respiratory depression, aggression, hallucinations, delusions, insomnia, vomiting and severe withdrawal.”

Most users of kratom would have trouble identifying with the side effects listed I would think, especially casual users.

I’m not trying to shit on the FDA unnecessarily, I actually think they have a positive and important role to play. As a consumer I want to be protected against potential harm in the food/drugs I consume. But on the other hand, I think it’s pretty clear that their influence regarding kratom, especially when viewed in the context of the “opioid epidemic” and the US government’s attitude towards psychotropic/recreational drugs generally speaking.

Anyway, I enjoy kratom which is why I’m defending it right now. I find it a fun, mild substance and I’ve never experienced any kind of adverse health effects from it, whether related to liver, testosterone or whatever…and I get regular health checkups. Just my opinion though.

 

[xtcgrrrl]

So I have bladder cystitis which is basically ulceration of the bladder .

Kratom was the most painful drug I could try. Complete catastrophic pain. I could take all other drugs and not feel pain but Kratom would cause extreme burning. Alcohol and ketamine would cause the pain too….but no other opioid agonist pharma nor illicit would cause issues …but Kratom was like setting a bomb off inside me

It is very nasty nasty stuff. Damages the liver some say and is confirmed to often be full of toxic heavy metals also per the FDA

I have interstitial cystitis (a very similar condition) and kratom was the only thing keeping me sane during flare-ups. In fact, it worked a little TOO well; it probably masked the pain before it got really bad and therefore I didn’t seek treatment as soon as I should’ve. But my experience is like night and day from yours.

The heavy metals thing only occurs in…drumroll please…kratom that’s been grown in soil contaminated with heavy metals fortunately, there are lab tests to detect this, and I usually only buy my plain leaf from Viable Solutions, who not only test their kratom (every batch) but provide you with the test results. Yes, it does require a leap of faith, faith that they’ll be providing the true, unaltered test results…but I have a very sensitive system and have never had an issue with their products.

I do wish kratom was universally tested and regulated, but for now, the best you can do is to read and research on your own. And I want to note that, after switching to plain leaf from the Hush extracts, I was able to weather the rest of my stomach troubles, without having to give up kratom. I’ve since taken the Hush softgels, without incident. I do really like the King kratom extracts as well, though, and when my stomach isn’t the best I use those and not the Hush ones, which seem to be more caustic. And I can’t say enough good things about the Nava leaf kratom cookies, yum!

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I have interstitial cystitis (a very similar condition) and kratom was the only thing keeping me sane during flare-ups. In fact, it worked a little TOO well; it probably masked the pain before it got really bad and therefore I didn’t seek treatment as soon as I should’ve. But my experience is like night and day from yours.

The heavy metals thing only occurs in…drumroll please…kratom that’s been grown in soil contaminated with heavy metals fortunately, there are lab tests to detect this, and I usually only buy my plain leaf from Viable Solutions, who not only test their kratom (every batch) but provide you with the test results. Yes, it does require a leap of faith, faith that they’ll be providing the true, unaltered test results…but I have a very sensitive system and have never had an issue with their products.

I do wish kratom was universally tested and regulated, but for now, the best you can do is to read and research on your own. And I want to note that, after switching to plain leaf from the Hush extracts, I was able to weather the rest of my stomach troubles, without having to give up kratom. I’ve since taken the Hush softgels, without incident. I do really like the King kratom extracts as well, though, and when my stomach isn’t the best I use those and not the Hush ones, which seem to be more caustic. And I can’t say enough good things about the Nava leaf kratom cookies, yum!

yea I have IC according to the professor of urology at a top 3 university that diagnosed me. I just call it bladder cystitis because nobody knows that interstitial cystitis is cystitis of the bladder without looking it up.



Just hold Kratom in your mouth for 30 seconds and it burns the inside of your mouth like a pepper or chemical or something …I can’t imagine putting that burn into my bladder even diluted

Are you the same girl from *a big social media platform* that also says mdma doesn’t bother your IC bladder I think I’ve read your posts there under the same username?

What does actually bother your bladder? Does alcohol? Do other stimulants like caffeine or cocaine bother it? Do you have food triggers or are your flares just totally random? Sometimes my flares are random and can’t be traced to anything but most often it’s tied to cheating on my diet

I’m wondering if your cystoscopy showed damage to your bladder wall (ulceration or glomerulations/redness)…or if you’re one of those IC patients that has a normal cystoscopy but still has all the pain of IC.

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Are you the same girl from *a big social media platform* that also says mdma doesn’t bother your IC bladder I think I’ve read your posts there under the same username?

I don’t have this username anywhere else except Discord, so definitely not me!

My flares seem to be random, but I do know that stress can be a trigger for me. Also constipation (I have IBS-C.) And I have a hypertonic pelvic floor, which is DEFINITELY connected to the IC. The pelvic floor dysfunction is because of a compressed pudendal nerve, which is due to a herniated disc at L4/L5 I incurred in 2012, while pregnant with my son. (I feel like I’m playing “the hip bone is connected to the…thigh bone” here ). Because of the sciatica from the herniated disc, I did this thing my physical therapist recommended, which is where I would sit on a tennis ball to work out the acute pain in my butt (you could say that it was a LITERAL pain in my butt having a slipped disc and sciatica thank you thank you I’ll be here all week!) but anyway, I did that a little TOO vigorously, hence the compressed nerve.

My doctor found extensive scarring on the inside of my bladder. She believes this was due in part to the recurrent UTIs I had all my life, and the excessive use of antibiotics to deal with these. (I am genetically prone to UTIs because I have a short, curvy urethra. Just like I’m a short, curvy woman, lol. Anyway my mom and sister both struggled with these as well, so it most likely is genetic.)

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I don’t have this username anywhere else except Discord, so definitely not me!

My flares seem to be random, but I do know that stress can be a trigger for me. Also constipation (I have IBS-C.) And I have a hypertonic pelvic floor, which is DEFINITELY connected to the IC. The pelvic floor dysfunction is because of a compressed pudendal nerve, which is due to a herniated disc at L4/L5 I incurred in 2012, while pregnant with my son. (I feel like I’m playing “the hip bone is connected to the…thigh bone” here ). Because of the sciatica from the herniated disc, I did this thing my physical therapist recommended, which is where I would sit on a tennis ball to work out the acute pain in my butt (you could say that it was a LITERAL pain in my butt having a slipped disc and sciatica thank you thank you I’ll be here all week!) but anyway, I did that a little TOO vigorously, hence the compressed nerve.

My doctor found extensive scarring on the inside of my bladder. She believes this was due in part to the recurrent UTIs I had all my life, and the excessive use of antibiotics to deal with these. (I am genetically prone to UTIs because I have a short, curvy urethra. Just like I’m a short, curvy woman, lol. Anyway my mom and sister both struggled with these as well, so it most likely is genetic.)

Mine was caused by ketamine abuse. So we probably have different stuff going on but the pain probably feels the same and this has got to be the most stubborn type of pain to medicate that exists.

My bladder has been found to have low levels of exotic bacteria that shouldn’t be there that don’t show up on standard UTI tests. They had to do a special pcr test.

Anyways I took antibiotics and the bacteria resolved but it didn’t change anything about the pain.

When I’m in a flare the only thing that actually works sometimes is getting a steroid instillation….opioids give me like a 4 to 6 hour window without pain if I dose high…but I always worry about opioids because they make it harder to piss…which as you know is not a good side effect when you already can’t piss due to a locked up bladder neck.

What’s your take on pharma opioids (not kratom) as to how they affect your pain and symptoms…sure they numb it but any residual negative side effects or anything ? I would imagine if you have IBS c opioids are a no go…do you take amitriptylene or Elmiron?

Amitryptiline caises worse comstipation than opioids imo

I’ll share one more thing with you…they thought I had IBS C for about one year because I had never ending symptoms of it for a whole year and had every test in the book. Finally they found out through one test I had an abnormal gut flora and gave me some weird antibiotic and it instantly went away and never came back

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Mine was caused by ketamine abuse. So we probably have different stuff going on but the pain probably feels the same and this has got to be the most stubborn type of pain to medicate that exists.

My bladder has been found to have low levels of exotic bacteria that shouldn’t be there that don’t show up on standard UTI tests. They had to do a special pcr test.

Anyways I took antibiotics and the bacteria resolved but it didn’t change anything about the pain.

When I’m in a flare the only thing that actually works sometimes is getting a steroid instillation….opioids give me like a 4 to 6 hour window without pain if I dose high…but I always worry about opioids because they make it harder to piss…which as you know is not a good side effect when you already can’t piss due to a locked up bladder neck.

What’s your take on pharma opioids (not kratom) as to how they affect your pain and symptoms…sure they numb it but any residual negative side effects or anything ? I would imagine if you have IBS c opioids are a no go…do you take amitriptylene or Elmiron?

Amitryptiline caises worse comstipation than opioids imo

I’ll share one more thing with you…they thought I had IBS C for about one year because I had never ending symptoms of it for a whole year and had every test in the book. Finally they found out through one test I had an abnormal gut flora and gave me some weird antibiotic and it instantly went away and never came back

You did steroid instillations? I did those but not with steroids. They used a combo of heparin, lidocaine and saline. Every damn week for a year, I had to go in to the hospital to get my bladder cathed, sometimes twice a week. It got so that I didn’t even notice when they stuck a tube up my urethra, I was so used to it. But it, miraculously, worked. I was SO relieved. That pain is the worst on earth, and I’ve had 3 children! But childbirth, as painful as it is, ENDS. This was that level of pain, burning fiery pain, but neverending. The only thing that helped me was lying in bed with an ice pack directly applied to my privates. They never gave me opiates, because “opioid epidemic” so I cannot speak to how that may or may not have been effective. Kratom was my only option, so I took it. They did prescribe me a very low dose of Amitriptyline, in fact I still have some of it around. I don’t take it now, because I’m returning to the babymaking gig. It MIGHT have helped, a little? Hard to tell. My urologist also told me to take marshmallow root and aloe vera. I was also taking linaclotide (Linzess) to become more regular (never got to the point where I was pooping every day, unfortunately; once every 3rd day was as good as it got. Now with the purging of all meds and other things for the purposes of purifying my body so as to be a healthy place in which to incubate a tiny human, it’s back to once a week IF IM LUCKY. Sigh. It was nice while it lasted…)

You may have (or had, rather) SIBO, not IBS, if an antibiotic cured it! I suspect I may have that as well; took an antibiotic recently in order to do this test for the fertility clinic and I felt FANTASTIC for the duration of the treatment. Regular, no nausea, etc. but I can’t get my GI doc to take me seriously when I suggested it. Come on, doc, who knows my body better than me?! Seriously tho. It felt like I was on drugs, and I mean the fun kind. They’re not wrong when they say the gut contains the bulk of your serotonin! My mood can be directly traced to how good or bad my gut issues are that day (and btw, my monthly cycle impacts this as well. My gut, I mean, although also my mood; it’s all in roughly the same area, maybe there’s a connection there? or maybe it’s just difficult to be happy when you’re constantly nauseous, idk)

 

[LucidSDreamr]

You did steroid instillations? I did those but not with steroids. They used a combo of heparin, lidocaine and saline. Every damn week for a year, I had to go in to the hospital to get my bladder cathed, sometimes twice a week. It got so that I didn’t even notice when they stuck a tube up my urethra, I was so used to it. But it, miraculously, worked. I was SO relieved. That pain is the worst on earth, and I’ve had 3 children! But childbirth, as painful as it is, ENDS. This was that level of pain, burning fiery pain, but neverending. The only thing that helped me was lying in bed with an ice pack directly applied to my privates. They never gave me opiates, because “opioid epidemic” so I cannot speak to how that may or may not have been effective. Kratom was my only option, so I took it. They did prescribe me a very low dose of Amitriptyline, in fact I still have some of it around. I don’t take it now, because I’m returning to the babymaking gig. It MIGHT have helped, a little? Hard to tell. My urologist also told me to take marshmallow root and aloe vera. I was also taking linaclotide (Linzess) to become more regular (never got to the point where I was pooping every day, unfortunately; once every 3rd day was as good as it got. Now with the purging of all meds and other things for the purposes of purifying my body so as to be a healthy place in which to incubate a tiny human, it’s back to once a week IF IM LUCKY. Sigh. It was nice while it lasted…)

You may have (or had, rather) SIBO, not IBS, if an antibiotic cured it! I suspect I may have that as well; took an antibiotic recently in order to do this test for the fertility clinic and I felt FANTASTIC for the duration of the treatment. Regular, no nausea, etc. but I can’t get my GI doc to take me seriously when I suggested it. Come on, doc, who knows my body better than me?! Seriously tho. It felt like I was on drugs, and I mean the fun kind. They’re not wrong when they say the gut contains the bulk of your serotonin! My mood can be directly traced to how good or bad my gut issues are that day (and btw, my monthly cycle impacts this as well. My gut, I mean, although also my mood; it’s all in roughly the same area, maybe there’s a connection there? or maybe it’s just difficult to be happy when you’re constantly nauseous, idk)

Yes my doctor uses a steroid in addition to the heparin lidocaine. The function of the steroid is to being down the swelling. Same concept of when they inject steroids into a bulging disc in your spine…brings down the inflammation

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Yes my doctor uses a steroid in addition to the heparin lidocaine. The function of the steroid is to being down the swelling. Same concept of when they inject steroids into a bulging disc in your spine…brings down the inflammation

I actually get that done, too, lol. (Yeah, my body has been through some shit!) I get epidural steroid injections every 3 months for the herniated discs I mentioned. But these days I have to get that done quite a bit higher up, as well, because I have spinal stenosis (THANKS DAD) and arthritis in my spine and neck. Life is pain…but pain is how you know you’re alive!

However, the pain from an active IC flare, I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy, not that I have one…I wouldn’t wish it on HITLER. I love life, but I was about 2 weeks away from committing suicide at the time that my urologist started treatment. I couldn’t have lived with it for much longer…and when the pain went away, it was EUPHORIA, the likes of which I have never experienced. The absence of pain was, in itself, like the high from a drug.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I actually get that done, too, lol. (Yeah, my body has been through some shit!) I get epidural steroid injections every 3 months for the herniated discs I mentioned. But these days I have to get that done quite a bit higher up, as well, because I have spinal stenosis (THANKS DAD) and arthritis in my spine and neck. Life is pain…but pain is how you know you’re alive!

However, the pain from an active IC flare, I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy, not that I have one…I wouldn’t wish it on HITLER. I love life, but I was about 2 weeks away from committing suicide at the time that my urologist started treatment. I couldn’t have lived with it for much longer…and when the pain went away, it was EUPHORIA, the likes of which I have never experienced. The absence of pain was, in itself, like the high from a drug.

I would wish IC pain on hitler and plenty of other ppl that have caused way worse pain to innocent ppl.

You must be more forgiving than I.

But yea the steroid/heparin/lidocaine combo is pretty good. Why not add steroid? Seems like your doctor is missing out on an additional very good opportunity to address the inflammation part of a flare.

My doctor says he’s never used another formulation (like dmso). Sometimes they get stuck in their ways and just keep doing the same shit and not experimenting.

Anyways they steroid used for these bladder instills is called solumedrol if you want to ask about it.

Have u ever tried the dmso instills? I know that stuff is really good at bringing down flammed rash type stuff on my skin but I am a bit scared to put it inside my bladder because it burns a bit when you put it on your skin.