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Dissociatives Ketamine - What are your experiences dealing with pre-mature exit from a k hole?

L

LH_Oswald

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Apr 9, 2020
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Am I the only one that has been deep in a hole, flying through dimensions of k-space and been interrupted so that I have to wake out of it and deal with some external shit?

It seems like I am often almost able to shake it off and act like nothings happening, like sometimes it seems like I can insta-sober myself. Is this normal?

What happens to you and how do you deal with it?
 
One time, when I had some K in me, so decided to have a hole, but since I was getting out of an operation, I wanted to sedate myself a bit extra - took 2 mg of Klonopin orally, then waited an hour and filled 2 syringes with K - I put around 100 in my muscle and then the other 50 got IVed. So it was quite a trip, but just after the peak, it seemed that for some unknown reason for me, my father had come to my room and apparently saw that I was in some strange state, which led to him calling my mother in my room too to see me and they started questioning me what is going on, why I am like that, what did I took and etc. etc., while I was still really fucked up, couldn't make sense of anything that was happening - I only knew these were my parents, so their invasive questioning put me in a really nasty loop where it seemed like this will continue forever. In the end I don't know when they left me, but after some time, my mind cleared and I remembered my parents being in my room, but at the same time they weren't here now, so I thought I did hallucinate them, while in the hole...next morning I was doing the usual stuff and was expecting any moment that someone will ask me, but nobody said anything, which led me to think it indeed was a hallucination, until the late afternoon, when my mother just asked me out of the blue "what were you on yesterday?"...So I told her - "Well, since my operation, I can't sleep well because of the pain and I took some klonopin". Then she continued "But yesterday you said it was ketamine...". And I continued with some excuse that I did this to put miself to sleep, because of the pain I have and etc. The moral of the story is, that it sucks when someone tries to engage with you in any form of conversation, while in a k-hole and that people say the truth, when k-ed up, I guess.
 
LH_Oswald said:
Am I the only one that has been deep in a hole, flying through dimensions of k-space and been interrupted so that I have to wake out of it and deal with some external shit?

It seems like I am often almost able to shake it off and act like nothings happening, like sometimes it seems like I can insta-sober myself. Is this normal?

What happens to you and how do you deal with it?
Click to expand...

One time the cops came in at a friend's house, and we were k bombed, and i barely was able to figure out what was going on and why this cop had his tie untied, and i kept thinking it was because maybe he wasn't on official business....idk i just kept wondering whats up with the tie?

so then there's a plate with k on it in the kitchen and my buddy's telling the cop "that's not what you think it is" meaning it's not coke, right....

anyway, there was too many of us, the other call came in, and the cops left saying that we were lucky and they have to go....but i barely came out of that hole until the very end of the ordeal when they finally left

so that's the only story i have where i needed to get it together in a pretty good hole, and i kinda did somewhat get it together, but i really didn't
 
I had been iv'ing ketamine all evening (my usual hole dose IV is about 170-180mg) when I called my wife to check in. She immediately is accusing me of using needles and threatening to kill herself and my then unborn daughter.

Needless to say I dropped what I was doing, threw my stuff in the car and drove over a half hour home, super fucked on k, to find she was just threatening.

The shitty thing was I left in such a hurry that I left a vial of k injection solution laying in the office I had been in working. Lost a damn full time IT job when they found the vial the next morning. This was the worst premature exit ever.
 
LH_Oswald said:
Am I the only one that has been deep in a hole, flying through dimensions of k-space and been interrupted so that I have to wake out of it and deal with some external shit?

It seems like I am often almost able to shake it off and act like nothings happening, like sometimes it seems like I can insta-sober myself. Is this normal?

What happens to you and how do you deal with it?
Click to expand...
No, it's not normal. My gut response is that if this is the case you can't be going deep enough. Reactions to the immobilising effects of K seem to vary, I've always been able to move around a bit although I rarely have any inclination to, but others may be floored and physically unable to move from a K-hole dose. So I can believe that perhaps you can quickly get up, move around, try to act normal, but I have a heard time accepting you can just "shake off" the cognitive alterations. I've been in a place where if someone was standing in front of me yelling that there's a fire I wouldn't even see them, or if I did I wouldn't understand them.

I make sure to always use ketamine somewhere I won't be disturbed for a good while, ketamine and real emergencies seem an obviously terrible mix. That said - I have decided to go out instead of sitting in all night, JUST as I'm slipping into hole space before, and have rapidly reversed it with a few heapings of piracetam, which is essentially a ketamine antidote, so if you think there might be emergencies while 'holin, make sure to have some piracetam around. Noopept works too apprently - so better yet, get yourself a noopept nasal spray for near instant reversal of the majority of dissociative symptoms. Not all of them probably but most of those that make reality a hard place to interact with.

But yeah, I find it very hard to buy anyone just "shaking off" a true K-hole... I'm pretty sure human brains just don't work like that, and the NMDA system is more unique than other NT systems which, if disrupted, the dysfunction could presumably be "weathered" for a time. The systems affected by ketamine and indeed other dissociatives affect things that are too intrinsic in their effects on our perspective of reality, compared to serotonin and dopamine for example which fluctuate up and down often, and dips can be weathered, in the short term. Both of them, can also induce hallucinations, psychosis or death in the right circumstances though. So, I dunno. Maybe you just have an anomalous brain chemistry in some way.
 
I’ve found the term K-Hole can mean vastly different things to different people. For some it’s complete loss of motor function, for others it’s just a heavier K trip. I’ve never holed and never plan to.. It seems if I go any higher than low doses of K it gets dysphoric and panic inducing.

-GC
 
G_Chem said:
I’ve found the term K-Hole can mean vastly different things to different people. For some it’s complete loss of motor function, for others it’s just a heavier K trip.
Click to expand...
Yeah, true, IMO this is annoying and misleading, if you're not in a hole that's difficult if not impossible to climb out of until the drug carries you back out of it - your will being largely uninvolved - then, IMO, it's not a hole.

The "hole" is metaphorical of course but subjectively it's quite literal, consensus reality is largely inaccessible, or at the very least imperceptible.

This is a kind of pet peeve of mine I admit so apologies in advance for being pedantic, I experience the same frustration with people bandying about terms like serotonin syndrome and "overdose" to mean anything but. I do believe definitions are important though when discussing topics without any real authoritative body to refer to and dispell myths and misunderstandings.

I never really get people talking about holing on the stimulating dissos or phenidines either really, to me the realms these substances lead to are not holes anymore than being embarassingly drunk is being in a hole. In fact holes IMO and E remain fairly unique to Ketamine, and very close analogues such as DCK, MXE maybe although M-holes are quite different. I guess that's where the association comes from though, people just think dissos+heavy intoxication = being in a hole.

G_Chem said:
It seems if I go any higher than low doses of K it gets dysphoric and panic inducing.
Click to expand...
Interesting, I love em personally even though I no longer believe there's anything truly profound going on... even knowing that darkside of deceit and endless deadends on the road to promised enlightenment is an allure in some weird and probably psychologically unhealthy way. 😄 But they're not worth it for sure, maybe a couple of times in an individuals lifetime they're worth it - after that there's no truly new value to be found IMO, just different iterations of the same delusions, and many many dangers. They are beautiful illusions though.
 
i think a k-hole is a black and white issue.....either you're ok to move around and talk or you're stuck and cant really move until you come out of it...usually 30 to 45 minutes until im back on my feet

i dont feel it to be pleasurable at all and i kinda can't wait for it to end when it does happen...it seems to be cumulative for me when i do K, like rebumping just adds to the last bump and the bump before and then im stuck in a hole which i wasn't trying to be in....

i just find it be an altered state type of drug rather than anything magical with spiritual insight....but maybe thats just me idk


i used to do coke and then when i ran out, i'd do a big ol bump of K and say goodbye to the coke jones - worked great for that
 
Mr. Krinkle said:
i used to do coke and then when i ran out, i'd do a big ol bump of K and say goodbye to the coke jones - worked great for that
Click to expand...
Love it... drugs go so well together IMO. This sentence brings back many fond memories... Was a time where I made a point of never doing coke unless I had some K for the comedown. Kinda veered into the sketchy when those few lines to come down would turn into a full on disso binge in the early hours through the whole next day, and when I'd be out doing coke having a fun time secretly fantasizing about when I could go back to my flat and start doing ketamine alone. :sneaky: But, I have no regrets at all. I've done enough K now that I get intermittent bladder issues if I dose more often than once every 4-6 months, it seems, and obviously both of them are absolutely terrible drugs for you, but... yeah, nothing quite matches up to K to follow a coke binge, IMO, not even benzos, although I will of course use benzos if I have nothing else.

Mr. Krinkle said:
i think a k-hole is a black and white issue.....either you're ok to move around and talk or you're stuck and cant really move until you come out of it...usually 30 to 45 minutes until im back on my feet

i dont feel it to be pleasurable at all and i kinda can't wait for it to end when it does happen...it seems to be cumulative for me when i do K, like rebumping just adds to the last bump and the bump before and then im stuck in a hole which i wasn't trying to be in....

i just find it be an altered state type of drug rather than anything magical with spiritual insight....but maybe thats just me idk
Click to expand...
Despite what I just said about K holing... I would somewhat dispute that they are ENTIRELY black and white - I almost never totally lose awareness of my environment, even if it takes some effort to discern it, through processes of logical reasoning (where was I earlier? Oh yeah, my sofa. Could I still be there? Etc... I have also holed basically standing upright with no awareness of my environment, I knew I was standing and I elected not to move because I knew my environment was an illusion, much to the consternation of my girlfriend at the time which I thought was kinda harsh, not like I could help turning into a walking zombie suddenly. I've also heard my friend's voice asking if I was OK at one point while deep in a K tunnel and was able to respond apparently that I just couldn't understand him right now, but not to worry. I'm not saying I could go for a walk or interact with a police officer or anything... just that it's rare I don't maintain some connection to consensus reality even while being mostly elsewhere.

I find it intensely, intensely spiritual, although as I mentioned I am reasonably convinced by now that that sensation of spirituality and profundity is a delusion. There's been a fair bit of research into those feelings of sacred truth that NMDA-modulators can bring since that guy who thought Nitrous held the secrets of the universe even though, strangely, he could never remember those secrets afterwards. Also you don't have to look far to find ketamine enthusiasts waxing lyrically about it's benefits without, seemingly, really doing themselves much good or changing their lives in any measurable way as they go deeper down the rabbit hole. Some people have even written books on their decline while thinking they're authoring something akin to a new religious text (Marcia Moore, I think, who fell in love with an angel and ended up freezing to death K holing in a forest).

That and the by now undeniable physical toxicities, bladder damage, brain damage (yes yes I know, brain damage studies are not conclusive, changes may be reversible, but the measured effects of heavy ketamine doses on certain brain regions is quite profound no matter how you try to spin it). Sadly, it is not a benign drug even though everyone would love if it was.
 
Vastness said:
if you're not in a hole that's difficult if not impossible to climb out of until the drug carries you back out of it - your will being largely uninvolved - then, IMO, it's not a hole.
Click to expand...

To me, when in a "true" K-hole, there is zero awareness of your surroundings or identity. I feel that "I" am pure consciousness moving through the body of god.
I have never been able to truly K-hole without the needle.
These days, I just do lines of K intranasally for amusement lol.

Vastness said:
Sadly, it is not a benign drug even though everyone would love if it was.
Click to expand...

So true.
 
when did i pretty much half a gram of ket i was so far in the fucking hole for hours my mate had to put a blanket on me lol cause i was totally imbolized for hours lying down. If your in a true k hole you are not fucking shaking it off or walking around you just got some trash ket man.
 
fasterfb said:
To me, when in a "true" K-hole, there is zero awareness of your surroundings or identity. I feel that "I" am pure consciousness moving through the body of god.
I have never been able to truly K-hole without the needle.
These days, I just do lines of K intranasally for amusement lol.



So true.
Click to expand...
I agree about the needle. I have only ever experienced ketamine IV because I was getting it in injection vials from an oral surgeon. I feel like I have reached holes with MXE both nasally and IV but the experience of the hole is completely different when IV. Much more sparkly and manic. For some reason when I IV Ketamine my vision goes all blue bubbles but for some reason with MXE it was always red bubbles. Anyone else experienced that?
 
TotalTotalness said:
One time, when I had some K in me, so decided to have a hole, but since I was getting out of an operation, I wanted to sedate myself a bit extra - took 2 mg of Klonopin orally, then waited an hour and filled 2 syringes with K - I put around 100 in my muscle and then the other 50 got IVed. So it was quite a trip, but just after the peak, it seemed that for some unknown reason for me, my father had come to my room and apparently saw that I was in some strange state, which led to him calling my mother in my room too to see me and they started questioning me what is going on, why I am like that, what did I took and etc. etc., while I was still really fucked up, couldn't make sense of anything that was happening - I only knew these were my parents, so their invasive questioning put me in a really nasty loop where it seemed like this will continue forever. In the end I don't know when they left me, but after some time, my mind cleared and I remembered my parents being in my room, but at the same time they weren't here now, so I thought I did hallucinate them, while in the hole...next morning I was doing the usual stuff and was expecting any moment that someone will ask me, but nobody said anything, which led me to think it indeed was a hallucination, until the late afternoon, when my mother just asked me out of the blue "what were you on yesterday?"...So I told her - "Well, since my operation, I can't sleep well because of the pain and I took some klonopin". Then she continued "But yesterday you said it was ketamine...". And I continued with some excuse that I did this to put miself to sleep, because of the pain I have and etc. The moral of the story is, that it sucks when someone tries to engage with you in any form of conversation, while in a k-hole and that people say the truth, when k-ed up, I guess.
Click to expand...
Christ this literal thing has happened to me several times, everything from slamming onwards. Holed, Parents came in, the questions, the loop, thinking I'd hallucinate it. Had to check this wasn't some really old post that I'd posted years ago and forgotten about lol.

Everything except the next day conversation, and my parents were never anywhere near as calm about it
 
Had a premature entrance but not an exit I can think of honestly.
When I was IMing vials I actually hit an artery or vein in my thigh more above the knee area I guess.
I was used to 2-5 mins onset depending on dose via that ROA, but as I pulled out the needle there was like a spray of blood coming from the muscle as if someone started a water siphon.
Before I could even start to try and apply pressure to stop the bleeding I was gone in seconds and to this day was one if not the most visual holes I've had on ket alone.

Not just being sensually disconnected and experiencing certain thoughts and feelings that oddly enough repeated themselves sometimes in presented in different ways but fundamentally the same through all previous Holes, like for example:

The receiving of grand revelations seemingly explaining all that is unexplained, or the strong feeling of a grand event affecting everything and everyone transpiring and me being in the middle of it or it's catalyst in some way.
That's what I was mostly used to I guess more or less.
But this premature entrance or "accidental IV" was very visual with ruins of an old city with egyptian and middle eastern motifs in a seemingly never ending black plane or void background with lots of visual details and actively observing everything while moving through and around the objects almost as if autonomously which was new to me.
And at some point vividly remember a very realistic old witches face as well but not the context of it.

Never tried ket when I actually started to IV stuff at a later point as it was no longer available sadly so can't compare the two ROAs.
 
Never happened to me with ketamine, but with analogues i can't properly fall to the hole, and it always ends before it even starts. Frustrating. I only use ketamine because of that.
 
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