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Opioids Is it possible to use opiates responsibly?

W

washingtonbound

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 19, 2013
Messages
439
I realize this is a dumb question but figured I’d get some input anyway. I am not talking about mainlining heroin because obviously that is irreversible. My main thing is I really enjoy a fewpercocet every so often and have been debating whether or not I can moderate my use. When I travel abroad I can often get it OTC and I love the buzz I get from around 10-15mg. I know this spells trouble but I don’t really give a shit I guess. Lately I have been back in the US where I can’t get it so I haven’t been using. But every once in a while I think back on the phenomenal feeling I get. Anyway, just wanted to get info from others.
 
Responsibly is a broad term. I would think that pain patients that take their meds as prescribed are responsible. People can be responsible but still abuse ( misuse ) their meds.

Recreational users ( like you and others ) that just use when there is a supply and then can stop when they have none ( and not obsess to get more ) are responsible. People can use all kinds of drugs responsibly. The key is to know when enough is enough, don't create problems for yourself, don't spend money you don't have and to know that you can use a drug and then NOT use the drug. To me that is where responsibility lies.

Taking a few percocet and having a relaxing time once in awhile is fine. If the supply is there and you can afford them and you aren't harming anyone I think that is responsible use. You probably already have an idea what irresponsibility would look like. Just read some of the threads in this forum and you'll get the picture.
 
Nurse Ratched said:
Responsibly is a broad term. I would think that pain patients that take their meds as prescribed are responsible. People can be responsible but still abuse ( misuse ) their meds.

Recreational users ( like you and others ) that just use when there is a supply and then can stop when they have none ( and not obsess to get more ) are responsible. People can use all kinds of drugs responsibly. The key is to know when enough is enough, don't create problems for yourself, don't spend money you don't have and to know that you can use a drug and then NOT use the drug. To me that is where responsibility lies.

Taking a few percocet and having a relaxing time once in awhile is fine. If the supply is there and you can afford them and you aren't harming anyone I think that is responsible use. You probably already have an idea what irresponsibility would look like. Just read some of the threads in this forum and you'll get the picture.
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Very good points. I would ascertain I’m responsible since I’m able to stop like you mentioned.
 
I don't see why not. I'm practise though, it seems like most people don't manage. That might be however because people end up on opiates not because they just wanna have fun (which is your case as I understand) but rather to deal with life problems (my case) in addition to having an addictive personality.

When I started using H (my first and only opiate) I knew in advance I'd end up an addict and eventually on the syringe (not on the syringe yet and hopefully never, but I don't delude myself that "I never would"). Most people delude themselves they will use responsibly and end up junkies in the end.

I think you yourself have an instinct as to whether it is possible for you to use opiates responsibly (by your personal definition of this word)

If you want my opinion, the fact that you have to come to this forum and ask this question to a bunch of strangers is not at all a good indication of being able to use opiates responsibly. Either you don't trust yourself that you can, or your instinct tells you that indeed you can't and you want people to help you delude yourself that you can so that you have an excuse to get high.

Good luck and take care, and if you gonna fuck with opiates treat them with respect

TLDR: theoretically yes, in practise most often not
 
menidiatis said:
I don't see why not. I'm practise though, it seems like most people don't manage. That might be however because people end up on opiates not because they just wanna have fun (which is your case as I understand) but rather to deal with life problems (my case) in addition to having an addictive personality.

When I started using H (my first and only opiate) I knew in advance I'd end up an addict and eventually on the syringe (not on the syringe yet and hopefully never, but I don't delude myself that "I never would"). Most people delude themselves they will use responsibly and end up junkies in the end.

I think you yourself have an instinct as to whether it is possible for you to use opiates responsibly (by your personal definition of this word)

If you want my opinion, the fact that you have to come to this forum and ask this question to a bunch of strangers is not at all a good indication of being able to use opiates responsibly. Either you don't trust yourself that you can, or your instinct tells you that indeed you can't and you want people to help you delude yourself that you can so that you have an excuse to get high.

Good luck and take care, and if you gonna fuck with opiates treat them with respect

TLDR: theoretically yes, in practise most often not
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Well I was referring to Percocet which is obviously different than heroin. I am a bit on the fence on how well I can control my use hence my posting on the forum. I presume I can use it with caution however I know how easy it is to slip.
 
I think I used opioids responsibly for several years BUT it could not have gone on forever. I was on oxys/hydros (real, not pressed) and I've always been a maintenance user. I never got really fucked up; I just had a buzz all day every day.

Three things are inevitable:
1. Tolerance. I had to gradually increase my daily dose to get the same effects.
2. Dry spells. It's unavoidable-- there will come a day when you can't get what you want. It may only last a day or two, but those days are hellish.
3. Expense. At first I could get 10mg oxys for 6 bucks apiece. Then it went up to 7. Then 8. Then 10.*

Toward the end I was taking twice as many pills and paying nearly twice as much per pill as I was at first. For a blue-collar guy like me, that's unsustainable. I'm not gonna start robbing people.

So is it possible to use opiates responsibly? Theoretically, yes. In reality, no.

*edit: I've heard that some folks are paying $15 or more for 10mg pills these days. Fuck that.
 
I've read multiple previous posts from you and given the fact that you have a psychiatric history and diagnosis of bipolar and schizoaffective disorder and have had several hospitalizations for psychosis I think you're swimming in dangerous waters. Although you were describing your ketamine use here
"If you have had psychosis I might encourage you to stay away from psychedelics. Don’t mean to preach but I’ve been in the same situation. Thinking I can control my dosage and next you thing you know I’ve lost it. " it seems controlling usage has been an issue for you. The question of responsible use of opiates gets muddled in past recreational drug use and current prescribed medication use. Speak to your mental health providers. Be safe and stay alive.
 
I sort of use opioids responsibility. I have experience multiple very severe opioid addictions and will not go back to being hooked on opioids unless I have cancer, etc.

However I will say that while I'm mostly able to avoid getting hooked these days, I would absolutely be a happier and healthier person if I didn't play with opioids at all. A person like me, who has spend a significant portion of their life hopelessly dependent on massive amounts of opioids, has a forever altered opioid system that is very quick to manifest withdrawal symptoms from even occasional use.

Even a single strong dose of opioids can make me feel off for a while while my endogenous opioid system regains its function (which was never well functioning to begin with -- I feel like even in my childhood I had symptoms resembling opioid withdrawal simply from having a underactive endogenous opioid system, which is why I instantly fell in love with opioids the very first time I tried them).

So the answer is, yes you can, use them responsibly, with some luck and practice. But you probably won't be a happier person because of it.
 
If you consider kratom an opiate (is an opioid, technically... but..) I think is doable, for me, in +4 years of use I've never went higher than 15grams per day, and most time I've used 6-9gpd, which I think it's a regular and acceptable pattern (which daily could lead to dependence, but, at least in my case, no health problems of any case).
For me this has been sustainable, now I'm in a taper, will hit 5.5 today, and tomorrow I'll start the last part of the taper, next weekend will have a very light withdrawal, completely manageable with black seed oil, kava, mucuna pruriens and ashwagandha (perhaps some other stuff like yohimbe or kola nut, but that's the basic).
I guess if you're strict with yourself you can get that with other light substances like codeine, not sure. A friend of mine uses light doses of tramadol without much trouble. I wouldn't do but surely it's not impossible.
 
jasperkent said:
I'm currently dependent on kratom and have been for about 3 years. I'm having no problems whatsoever. It's relatively cheap, readily available, and never contains fent. I work, eat, sleep normally.
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I think kratom, like ALL ethnopharmacological stuff must be cycled, or at least, regular t-breaks must be taken for not letting the receptors get to used to it, other than that is a very healthy, benefitial and little problematic plant, in most cases.
Ok, if you have and addictive personality and you end up taking +20 grams a day, then well, it could be a problem, but that doesn't happen to everyone.
I think withdrawal is in fact a good thing that encourages discipline and self-control, it let's you know if you're abusing, and to which point.
Is like the "Jiminy Cricket" of the substance.
 
jasperkent said:
If I take kratom every day for the rest of my life, I'm OK with that. Same with coffee. As long as it's not causing any problems, so what?
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I think kratom affects, lightly, our persona, in some way. Is something subtle but it affects how we behave and specially how we feel and react to things. If you recognize that and you're ok with it, then, perfect.
I had an interesting conversation some time ago about "being yourself" under the effects of substances, we are affected yes, but at the same time, we are ourselves, because we normally cannot "stop being ourselves", in the basic sense.
So I think the more "awaken" you're to your real self, the more "integral" you're, with or without drugs. That's why some people who get drunk blame the alcohol, s/he is not aware of his/er real self, so he behaves "differently" under the effects of drugs, not being able to connect/ with their own real intentions and integrate them.
For me kratom creates no problems, but I like some time of sobriety, once in a while, as well as resetting tolerance.
 
Neuroborean said:
I think kratom affects, lightly, our persona, in some way. Is something subtle but it affects how we behave and specially how we feel and react to things. If you recognize that and you're ok with it, then, perfect.
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Could you elaborate?

The only thing I've noticed is that if I take a little too much I get irritable for about 30 minutes.
Otherwise, I've noticed no behavioral changes and nobody I'm around has said anything to that effect.
 
Neuroborean said:
I think kratom affects, lightly, our persona, in some way. Is something subtle but it affects how we behave and specially how we feel and react to things. If you recognize that and you're ok with it, then, perfect.
I had an interesting conversation some time ago about "being yourself" under the effects of substances, we are affected yes, but at the same time, we are ourselves, because we normally cannot "stop being ourselves", in the basic sense.
So I think the more "awaken" you're to your real self, the more "integral" you're, with or without drugs. That's why some people who get drunk blame the alcohol, s/he is not aware of his/er real self, so he behaves "differently" under the effects of drugs, not being able to connect/ with their own real intentions and integrate them.
For me kratom creates no problems, but I like some time of sobriety, once in a while, as well as resetting tolerance.
Click to expand...

I feel like kratom alters my personality more than other opioids, most likely due to its complex mechanism of action.
 
washingtonbound said:
Well I was referring to Percocet which is obviously different than heroin. I am a bit on the fence on how well I can control my use hence my posting on the forum. I presume I can use it with caution however I know how easy it is to slip.
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Isn't percocet like oxycodone with paracetamol? I started with heroin so can't say for sure how weaker oxy is, but I don't think they are "obviously different" and you know how it goes, if you lose control with oxy won't take long before you use H.

If you do manage to use them responsibly, the opioid high is second only to crack ime so for sure you wil have a lot of fun. Best of luck
 
spammie nurse said:
I've read multiple previous posts from you and given the fact that you have a psychiatric history and diagnosis of bipolar and schizoaffective disorder and have had several hospitalizations for psychosis I think you're swimming in dangerous waters. Although you were describing your ketamine use here
"If you have had psychosis I might encourage you to stay away from psychedelics. Don’t mean to preach but I’ve been in the same situation. Thinking I can control my dosage and next you thing you know I’ve lost it. " it seems controlling usage has been an issue for you. The question of responsible use of opiates gets muddled in past recreational drug use and current prescribed medication use. Speak to your mental health providers. Be safe and stay alive.
Click to expand...
Well psychedelic use and opiate use are quite different things. My disorder, whether it be schizoaffective or bipolar, was one hundred percent induced by excessive psychedelic use during college. I pushed the envelope and paid the price for it, and have inherited a nightmare as a result. But in respects to opiate use, I don't use them in the same way I used psychedelics, and obviously you're not going to be catapulted into left field from a couple percocet. In the post you're referring to there, I was responding to someone who said they planned on dropping a tab of acid despite having had psychotic episodes. I brought up ketamine because I absolutely did have a problem with that but always thought "I'm in control here." It is the only substance I've had a major struggle with aside from maybe weed. Anyway, as mentioned I feel opiates are a different ball game. Risky perhaps, but not nearly as much so as getting into psychedelics again.
 
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