?Interesting Phendimetrazine Idea

[Jamesaj34]

My monkey had also taken 5mg of methadone the previous day at 9pm. And 35mg Phendimetrazine at 7am the next day. He also Insufflated 1/3rd of a pill and stopped when he realized it was a prodrug
so I have a few questions

1. Why do some people report insufflation of phendimetrazine as effective, if it is a prodrug?
2. What enzyme/process carries out the N-Demethylation of phendimetrazine into phenmetrazine?
3. Why did my monkey knod out instead and not feel any stimulation whatsoever? (My monkey has a medium tolerance to methadone and does not feel anything below 15mg)

P.S. My monkey has done something similar with vyvanse, he took trypsin before the vyvanse and it his him almost instantly and peaked within 30 minutes and lasted about 4-6 hours just like an instant release Adderall would.

 

[clubcard]

Sooner in, sooner N-demethylation, possibly, or usual placebo effects. Although smooth, it isn't as smooth as fencamfamine.... but even that was too much for me.

 

[sekio]

we don't swim here

trypsin won't demethylate anything either nor does the methyl group on phendimethrazine just pop off...

as for why you fell asleep... you took a slow acting stimulant while you still had a strong opioid in your system???

 

[Jamesaj34]

Sekio, I never claimed that trypsin demethylated anything. Please read my 2nd question again carefully.
And as for no swimming, what do we use?
i was saying that trypsin worked for vyvanse, what would carry out the demethylation of pendimetrazine? (if my research is correct, this is how it is metabolized into phenmetrazine)
And it's just weird, it was only 5mg and I usually don't even feel anything below 15mg and a fair amount of the methadone should have been gone by 10 hours shouldn't it have?

 

[Jamesaj34]

we don't swim here

trypsin won't demethylate anything either nor does the methyl group on phendimethrazine just pop off...

as for why you fell asleep... you took a slow acting stimulant while you still had a strong opioid in your system???

Sekio, I never claimed that trypsin demethylated anything. Please read my 2nd question again carefully.
And as for no swimming, what do we use?
i was saying that trypsin worked for vyvanse, what would carry out the demethylation of pendimetrazine? (if my research is correct, this is how it is metabolized into phenmetrazine)
And it's just weird, it was only 5mg and I usually don't even feel anything below 15mg and a fair amount of the methadone should have been gone by 10 hours shouldn't it have?

sorry for the double reply I'm not sure how this site works just yet, just trying to figure out if I need to quote or not.

 

[serotonin2A]

Sorry but trypsin will not hydrolyze Vynase. Your experience shows the power of a placebo response.

"LDX was stable and d-amphetamine formation was negligible in incubations with dipeptidyl/peptidase IV, cathepsin G, and elastase. LDX was also stable in SGF and SIF up to 60 minutes. LDX was stable in incubations with trypsin, even when very high trypsin concentrations were used."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2898170/

 

[sekio]

Here we use proper first person pronouns, that means no swim, no "my monkey", etc.

what would carry out the demethylation of pendimetrazine?

probably CYP enzymes? you aren't going to be able to add them exogenously though

 

[Jamesaj34]

Sorry but trypsin will not hydrolyze Vynase. Your experience shows the power of a placebo response.

"LDX was stable and d-amphetamine formation was negligible in incubations with dipeptidyl/peptidase IV, cathepsin G, and elastase. LDX was also stable in SGF and SIF up to 60 minutes. LDX was stable in incubations with trypsin, even when very high trypsin concentrations were used."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2898170/

no i can be sure this was not a placebo and have experience with both substances. In my experience and research, Trypsin is the enzyme that cleaves the L-lysine molecule off of the lisdexamphetamine. What you have shown me was done in vitro, maybe the conditions change when the trypsin is in the body? There were also other enzymes in the supplement that I took. I will try and find the name and ingredient list of that supplement for you. But I can assure you that I am very familiar with the sensation of amphetamine rush and felt it within 20-30 minutes, and peaked after another 20

 

[Jamesaj34]

[MENTION=337335]serotonin2A[/MENTION] there you go, "Proprietary Blend: 700 mg Betaine hydrochloride†, bovine pancreas Cytosol™ extract†, pancreatin (3x)†, stearic acid (vegetable source)†, pepsin (1:10,000)†, ammonium chloride†, bovine spleen†, and ovine spleen†." The ingredients list of zypan. The serving size is two tablets. I took 2, 45 minutes prior to dosing LDX, and another 4, about 20-25 minutes before. I would maybe believe it was placebo if the effects weren't so much more greatly pronounced. The peak time was absolutely insane! Do you think maybe something in there could have done it? I had an otherwise empty stomach.

 

[Jamesaj34]

probably CYP enzymes? you aren't going to be able to add them exogenously though

Do you think there could possibly be a way to boost the amount I have or catalyze them in any way? Just like you can inhibit them? (if I remember correctly) like Cytochrome P450 with grapefruit juice or Tagamet?

 

[sekio]

i can be sure this was not a placebo

actually you can't, that's the point of placebo effects

if you were using a GC to look for amphetamine as it was hydrolysed, maybe i'd believe you... but bioassay is not enough

and grapefruit juice only enhances the activity of some cyp enzymes, there are a lot of them (more than a dozen).... no guarantee it will speed up metabolism, given that it doesn't speed metabolism of e.g. methamphetamine or DMT why would it speed metabolism of phenmetrazine?

some degree of critical thinking is needed here..
.

 

[Jamesaj34]

@sekio
so you believe my experience was entirely placebo? I mean I didn't really think it was going to do anything. Do you think it would be wise maybe to test it in a few people? Maybe give them a supplement and I'll tell them it will make it work faster and then give another person the real thing and tell them the same thing? This is how they test placebos right? I'm just interested in pharmacology and I'm still learning so there's a lot I don't know. Is this called a double blind test?
the reason I don't believe it was placebo is that I am completely aware of placebo effects and I usually tell myself that a placebo effect may happen whenever I take something, going on the idea that it is psychological wouldn't that lessen the probability of me experiencing placebo? I mean I felt a very distinct amphetamine rush in about 20-30 minutes, and I had some experience with Lisdexamphetamine and amphetamine salts/ dextroamphetamine before this experience. I mean it really felt like I snorted maybe 15-20mg of adrenal and it went away in maybe 4-5 hours or so.

and just another idea, hypothetically. If I cut myself and put vyvanse in a container with my blood in it, would that maybe turn it into dextroamphetamine? Just a though, maybe some kind of enzyme in my blood would convert it. I saw this on another post on blue light somewhere someone claimed it worked.