Identifying Ketamine vs 2'OXO-PCE / Eticyclidone

[jancrow]

There is a rumour going round that some suppliers in my location are substituting 2'OXO-PCE aka Eticyclidone for ketamine due to shortages of the latter, and I expect a surplus of the former.

Are any of you fine upstanding citizens able to tell me what reagent reactions for 2'OXO-PCE look like, please? I have marquis, liebermann, froehde to hand to test and while the substance appears to correspond to ketamine when tested (hard to tell with froehde) it's possible that 2'OXO-PCE reacts the same, and I would love to know.

Many thanks

 

[Solipsis]

I highly doubt that there is a reagent out there that can differentiate that chloro and ethyl vs methyl.. (Not because of technicality since if there were dissociative-targeted reagents that are not only meant to basically detect arylcyclohexylamine presence but could discriminate, sure it would be quite possible - but rather I do not know that any such reagent exists, so the ones that can vaguely detect these compounds probably can't discriminate such differences if they are not designed to do so, is my point)

Marquis and liebermann aren't meant to test for dissociatives anyway... will have to check froehde I don't know it.

EDIT: checked and while froehde is normally meant especially for opioids I see a sample of ketamine that looks pink-ish while MXE looks rather yellow, so yeah if your froehde can be pushed (more product?) to discern whether your color is more of a yellow or pink, that could possible serve you as a preliminary test operating under the assumption that 2'-oxo-PCE would not just be pink as well. Unfortunately it is not enough to go on, I'd say and you definitely don't want a false sense of security based on that kind of assumption.

If you can't really reagent test with a known discriminating agent or lab test, then first it's worth consider that eticyclidone / 2'-oxo-PCE is *much* more potent than ketamine, but of course it could be cut to compensate for that..

..But the duration is extremely different, so if you were to titrate your product I guess you'd notice at some point whether the duration is more 2'-oxo-PCE ballpark or ketamine ballpark.. do you have experience with either as a reference for the taste, feeling, etcc.

 

[jancrow]

Thank you, Solipsis, very kind of you to look into this.

As my intended use is at the end of a night, after MDMA, I don't think I will take my chances this time and will try to procure something from another supplier. However, I'll hang onto this with the intention of delving a little deeper and working it out if possible. Will also try a larger sample in Froehde.

This has the look of a cut product to me and so may be 2'-oxo-PCE diluted with something inert . It could be the end of a batch but I am suspicious as the sample seems to contain fairly large roughly spherical grains and a fine crystalline powder.

 

[lysergamide]

I'm not sure of regeant test results as I don't have any o-pce at hand. But the effects are substantially different, provided you have used ketamine a handful of times at k-hole level you should be able to notice a difference in effects. The hole is also completely different, effects more akin to gbl/alcohol. I can't see how anyone could sell this to any pre-drought k-heads. It will be easy to tell from a small dose.

As mentioned already durations are also entirely different, o-pce has very long residual effect and I find it much less stimulating. I could sleep on it and wake up the next morning with lingering effects on vision/balance. With ketamine I cannot sleep until it has completely worn off unless combined with something else.

 

[white55]

If you do have some o-pce I would still suggest trying it once you have the time as it is a very interesting substance. It's not ketamine, so if you take it and expect ketamine like effects you'll be disappointed but if you look at it as a completely different substance you might like it a lot. But definitely figure out what exactly do you have before taking any.

 

[jancrow]

Many thanks, people who wrote. As a late 30s person with some quite large responsibilities I'm wary of just having a go on some potentially novel substance after a night on MDMA. I will hang on to the substance and continue efforts to identify it, though.

If anyone has o-pce and reagents to hand, I'd love to hear how they combine. I have yet to find details of these reactions, so you'd be doing the broader community a favour too.

Thanks again.

 

[altitudes]

Have you checked with the reagent testing subreddit?

 

[CosmicKoala]

Maybe they meant 2-oxo-pcm, since it's actually a lot like ketamine. o-pce is nothing like ketamine, and the doses are soooo different that one would easily be able to tell it isn't ketamine, unless its a weak batch and the people decided to snort it like most ketamine users do.
I just find that really weird and unlikely that it is o-pce and not o-pcm instead. o-pce is waaaay more potent than ketamine.

 

[white55]

sorry I don't have any reagents on hand but if you have no tolerance you can take a few mg of o-pce sublinqually and feel something, if it's ketamine you won't feel anything

 

[Solipsis]

sorry I don't have any reagents on hand but if you have no tolerance you can take a few mg of o-pce sublinqually and feel something, if it's ketamine you won't feel anything

That is assuming it's pure. In the OP it was mentioned that there is a rumor of K being misrepresented and there would a good chance that it is cut to match K potency, avoid accidents to some extent and make more profit. Although who knows if this is true these guys thought it true, because it's a pretty idiotic (not to mention scumbag) idea considering the difference in duration - not sure what would give it away the most: the different feeling/effect or duration.

 

[deulcore]

If you have a doubt you should really take it easy and do an allergie test ! 2-oxoPCE dosage a really smaller than Ketamine and the dose response is less forgiving.
The material I have seen was something around 10x smaller. Where you would use 100mg of Ketamine 10/15mg of Eticyclidone would already provide effect.

I am not a huge "connaisseur" of dissocative but have tried the main ones and can say that Eticyclidone is something really potent, there's also this debate wether it has antibiotic properties that could probably causes problem after multiple uses over a short period.

So far it has been an interesting compound but I personnaly find it not as innocent as Ketamine or MXE, the duration is way longer and can be quite demanding.

 

[yepyepwoah]

Cutting K with o pce makes no sense fincancially or effects wise. Like other dude said its more likely DCK cut

If you have previous experience with those 3 drugs a 10mg bump shoupd let you know whats what