How often is it safe to do Mephedrone?

[Josh7000]

I've heard it's similar to MD and amphetamines but how often is it safe to use this, I've heard md once a monthly due to needing to recover serotonin and any possible brain lesions, and twice a week for amphetamines because dopamine recovers much quicker. How often can you do Mephedrone safely?

 

[Dresden]

Mephedrone is non-neurotoxic, but watch for vasoconstriction (blue extremities or knees).

 

[Josh7000]

Wait what? So I can take it often aslong as I listen to my body but md still needs to be once a month?

 

[Dresden]

It's up to you. Scientists have said mephedrone is not neurotoxic in the way that mdma is said to be, but I think there was some memory loss associated with mephedrone. The main thing to look out for is vasoconstriction.

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

Wait what? So I can take it often aslong as I listen to my body but md still needs to be once a month?

You may as well have said "wait what? This forum talks a load of hogwash about MDMA?" Because it does. For alternative views on MDMA, read my own, Tranced's or Bearlove's contributions to this forum or alternately head over to EADD where you will find many people who have taken MDMA thousands of times, completely ignoring the month/3 month rule, and have not only lived to tell the tale but are successful people with fully functioning lives.

In short, many of us think this particular forum does more harm than good, encourages people to exaggerate symptoms and blame MDMA for everything, and really is a bit of a joke.

But yeah, the vasoconstriction bit regarding meph is right.

 

[Cotcha Yankinov]

I think the issue is individual variation. Not everybody is going to be able to take MDMA every weekend for years with no perceivable negative effects. So its really something that should be played by ear, taken on a case by case basis.

My advice is that if you notice you're starting to get harsher comedowns/hangovers, find another drug

As far as the OP's question about mephedrone
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27908258 - "36 papers were suitable for the review. Neurotoxic effect of mephedrone on 5-HT and DA systems remains controversial. Although some studies in animal models reported no damage to DA nerve endings in the striatum and no significant changes in brain monoamine levels, some others suggested a rapid reduction in 5-HT and DA transporter function.

Persistent serotonergic deficits were observed after binge like treatment in a warm environment and in both serotonergic and dopaminergic nerve endings at high ambient temperature. Oxidative stress cytotoxicity and an increase in frontal cortex lipid peroxidation were also reported. In vitro cytotoxic properties were also observed, suggesting that mephedrone may act as a reductant agent and can also determine changes in mitochondrial respiration.

However, due to the differences in the design of the experiments, including temperature and animal model used, the results are difficult to compare. Further studies on toxicology and pharmacology of mephedrone are therefore necessary to establish an appropriate treatment for substance abuse and eventual consequences for public health."

I don't think there are clear results but it has the potential to be a serotonin and dopamine neurotoxin in animals. I would err on the side of caution and treat it like you would methamphetamine. Chronic meth users have an increased risk of mental illness and Parkinson's disease - I think the case with drugs that induce a subtle neurotoxic effect that is cumulative over time is that when the neurotoxicity occurs slowly enough, the brain can compensate and you don't get above-threshold symptoms until you reach a critical mass.

For example, the vast majority of dopamine neurons have to die off before you become Parkinsonian. One of the reasons for that is that if the cells die off slowly over time, the brain has time to compensate. So who knows how these drugs will affect you when you are 70 or 80. An extraordinary amount of people get a neuropsychiatric or neurodegenerative disease at some point in their lives psychostimulants notwithstanding, so we really don't have good data about what these drugs do acutely in humans and what the long term consequences will be.

There could also be a lot of consequences that are applicable to any drug that tends to be binged upon with subsequent sleep deprivation.

 

[Tranced]

aslong as I listen to my body

This should be your approach anyway. I used mephedrone weekly when it first came out and it never really caused me any problems. It obviously will eventually if you keep using it, so just anticipate eventual side effects and look out for them, taking occasional breaks and stopping if necessary, or when you think it's probably reasonable.

Extended use of stimulating empathogens tends to take its toll; things usually get a bit hazy for me, so at this point I tend to have a long break, return to normal (whatever that is), and then use them far less frequently (if required). Sometimes I'll start taking them more often again. Sometimes not. Sometimes never again.

This method has meant that I've never had to give up any drug on a permanent basis, although some I have no interest in.

No big deal: just know yourself, and know you drug.

 

[Josh7000]

I've heard it's too new and not researched enough to actually know, and I hear people predicting it's possibly more neurotoxic

 

[Tranced]

I've heard it's too new and not researched enough to actually know, and I hear people predicting it's possibly more neurotoxic

Maybe so, but nobody really knows; that's why you need to listen to your body and your mind.

 

[Josh7000]

But if you listened to your mind and body with MD you'd end up with brain damage because I never noticed any ill effects from it

 

[Cotcha Yankinov]

Many people use lots of MDMA without issue, I think being careful not to take more than 120mg a night or so is important and don't use two days in a row especially, but the issue is that once you experience adverse effects you can't really go back in time. So the scenario where you notice negative effects and then back off from using MDMA is a good one and most people have that scenario, but for some few people it may be that they notice adverse effects and then it takes quite a while for the effects to dissipate.

Amphetamine is probably the safest bet, but mind you a lot of the chronic effects of psychostimulant use (especially concerning your old age) could also have to do with sleep deprivation.

 

[Josh7000]

Bump

 

[Josh7000]

I find amphetamines more damaging and give me way more bad side effects on comedown than Md has done by far

 

[JosephTHeSequel]

This should be your approach anyway. I used mephedrone weekly when it first came out and it never really caused me any problems. It obviously will eventually if you keep using it, so just anticipate eventual side effects and look out for them, taking occasional breaks and stopping if necessary, or when you think it's probably reasonable.

Extended use of stimulating empathogens tends to take its toll; things usually get a bit hazy for me, so at this point I tend to have a long break, return to normal (whatever that is), and then use them far less frequently (if required). Sometimes I'll start taking them more often again. Sometimes not. Sometimes never again.

This method has meant that I've never had to give up any drug on a permanent basis, although some I have no interest in.

No big deal: just know yourself, and know you drug.

Not sure that you are exactly correct here... This may be the case for some people, but it is not the case for others. I was doing MDXX before this board was even in existence, and I noticed effects from using too often (depression, neurotoxicity etc.) Maybe look more into why it affects some and not others instead of just calling it all bs.